Used dslr: where is the best budget buy?

Used dslr: where is the best budget buy?

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Discussion

MysteryLemon

4,968 posts

190 months

Thursday 11th July 2013
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The Jolly Todger said:
I don't think LiveView is very useful outside of some very specific instances (e.g. manual focusing from a tripod). I've never found any use for it personally.

As for the OP, a used D3100 with the 18-55mm lens would be a good way to go, there should be plenty around from people who are not upgrading.
No. A d3100 body with an 18-70mm kit lens purchased seperately. Much better built lens and costs the same.

JDRoest

1,126 posts

149 months

Thursday 11th July 2013
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Big fan of the 400D here. Used it for years, and still am due to the new camera failing so fast.

300D is big and old. 6M really is on the low side these days, 10M like the 400D is much better. There is also a world of difference between the 300D and 400D in size and operation and the extra £50 is well worth paying for.

The biggest problem with the 300D is speed. It just feels slow and clunky - which it is. The 400D is a much more up to date body, but not in the latest generations league by any stretch.

Not convinced about LiveView. I've never missed a shot because I didn't have LiveView, and frankly even on the new camera I feel it's just a gadget I can't be bothered with.

vladcjelli

Original Poster:

2,962 posts

157 months

Thursday 11th July 2013
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Latest news, my work colleague has offered the d3100 with 18-55 lens and memory card (unknown capacity) for £200.

Unfortunately, while I see this as a belter of a deal, mrs Cjelli is holding those purse strings tight.

Must keep looking for that elusive bargain. Will definitely research the 400d further, but have my eye on that Olympus from earlier.

flat-planedCrank

3,697 posts

202 months

Thursday 11th July 2013
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vladcjelli said:
Latest news, my work colleague has offered the d3100 with 18-55 lens and memory card (unknown capacity) for £200.

Unfortunately, while I see this as a belter of a deal, mrs Cjelli is holding those purse strings tight.

Must keep looking for that elusive bargain. Will definitely research the 400d further, but have my eye on that Olympus from earlier.
Personally, I'd suggest sticking to the 'big two' of Nikon or Canon if you'll want to keep building on your setup - imo you'll have access to a wide range of lenses, accessories (from themselves and from 3rd party manufacturers) not to mention a huge range of used gear too.

vladcjelli

Original Poster:

2,962 posts

157 months

Thursday 11th July 2013
quotequote all
flat-planedCrank said:
vladcjelli said:
Latest news, my work colleague has offered the d3100 with 18-55 lens and memory card (unknown capacity) for £200.

Unfortunately, while I see this as a belter of a deal, mrs Cjelli is holding those purse strings tight.

Must keep looking for that elusive bargain. Will definitely research the 400d further, but have my eye on that Olympus from earlier.
Personally, I'd suggest sticking to the 'big two' of Nikon or Canon if you'll want to keep building on your setup - imo you'll have access to a wide range of lenses, accessories (from themselves and from 3rd party manufacturers) not to mention a huge range of used gear too.
Yeah, done a bit of ebay research and the Olympus lenses seem a bit expensive.

So at the moment, I think the 400d is looking like my best chance.

Simpo Two

85,147 posts

264 months

Thursday 11th July 2013
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vladcjelli

Original Poster:

2,962 posts

157 months

Saturday 13th July 2013
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Starting to lose my nerve regarding dslr ownership.

Don't know if a combination of costs, initial/additional equipment going forward, and the added complexity would be more trouble than they're worth.

Started looking at bridge cameras instead. The dslr-lite options and big zoom without added cost are a definite draw for me.

Two around the right sort of price are the lumix dmc lz30 and the finepix hs30exr.

Would I be okay with these sort of things, or would I cry myself to sleep at night having made the wrong choice?

RobDickinson

31,343 posts

253 months

Saturday 13th July 2013
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vladcjelli said:
Would I be okay with these sort of things, or would I cry myself to sleep at night having made the wrong choice?
That. Honestly bridge cameras wont give you what your after.

An evil/mirrorless would do most of it as would the fuji or sony big sensor compacts.

Dont get a 'prosumer' superzoom SLR lookalike.

Honestly a 400d with IS kit lens would do great

Simpo Two

85,147 posts

264 months

Saturday 13th July 2013
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vladcjelli said:
Don't know if a combination of costs, initial/additional equipment going forward, and the added complexity would be more trouble than they're worth... Started looking at bridge cameras instead.
1) You don't have to buy any additional equipment if you don't want to.

2) I'd suggest that bridge cameras are more complex/harder to use than DSLRs because half the stuff is buried away where you can't see it or start to understand it. Simpler to use at the outset perhaps, but then become harder to use as you progress and wonder where the goddamn hell the ISO is hidden. Etc.

vladcjelli said:
Would I be okay with these sort of things, or would I cry myself to sleep at night knowing that I had been a big girl's blouse?
EFA. And yes. Now man up and get yourself out there! :slap:

vladcjelli

Original Poster:

2,962 posts

157 months

Saturday 13th July 2013
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RobDickinson said:
vladcjelli said:
Would I be okay with these sort of things, or would I cry myself to sleep at night having made the wrong choice?
That. Honestly bridge cameras wont give you what your after.

An evil/mirrorless would do most of it as would the fuji or sony big sensor compacts.

Dont get a 'prosumer' superzoom SLR lookalike.

Honestly a 400d with IS kit lens would do great
The 400d still appeals, it's good money, and I do want to learn the ways of the slr.

But I can't see the compact system stuff at the money I've got to spend, and the super zoom part of the super zooms has tickled my fancy. A camera that can do 1cm macro to 30x zoom out of the box appeals.

I wonder whether a bridge camera is my bridge to a dslr. A stepping stone if you like.

There are so many variables in this field, it's an intriguing conundrum.

RobDickinson

31,343 posts

253 months

Saturday 13th July 2013
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Bridge cameras have big lenses yes but more 'zoom' = less quality, and you will be using a slow 30x zoom with a small sensor and get relatively poor results.

Look at the Olympus ep-1 or something perhaps?

vladcjelli

Original Poster:

2,962 posts

157 months

Saturday 13th July 2013
quotequote all
RobDickinson said:
Bridge cameras have big lenses yes but more 'zoom' = less quality, and you will be using a slow 30x zoom with a small sensor and get relatively poor results.

Look at the Olympus ep-1 or something perhaps?
Being a layman, when you say slow zoom, what do you mean?

RobDickinson

31,343 posts

253 months

Saturday 13th July 2013
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lumix dmc lz30 is f5.9 at 800mm (effective, about 6mm in real terms) which on its own isnt that bad but the sensor size is 1/2.3"



Look , the sensor is tiny, and sensor area = quality, bluntly.

vladcjelli

Original Poster:

2,962 posts

157 months

Saturday 13th July 2013
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Yeah, I read a little bit about sensor size and appreciate the importance. I looked at a supposedly improved model of one camera where they'd increased the mp count from 10 to (I think) 16 and one review reckoned the increase in "noise" due to cramming more pixels into the same space had made a mess of image quality.

Will keep researching. As mentioned earlier, the variables involved in this purchase are huge. Very complicated.

JDRoest

1,126 posts

149 months

Sunday 14th July 2013
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vladcjelli said:
The 400d still appeals, it's good money, and I do want to learn the ways of the slr.
As I said earlier, big fan of the 400D. Does everything you need in a reasonable package. I use one for work and today I'll probably put another 8,000 exposures through it (aiming for 9k today). The one I use for work is just a work horse and comes up with pretty reasonable images (shutter button is pretty much fked though lol). I won local competitions with it and beat out people with much much better kit (which is hugely gratifying I might add, especially the guy with the 1d-whatever with his big white L lenses).

Even the 18-55 kit lens was a reasonable bit of kit in my hands. Yeah, it's not an L, and it's a cheap lens, but the key to all these things is not what you have, but how you use it.

Simpo Two

85,147 posts

264 months

Sunday 14th July 2013
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vladcjelli said:
Being a layman, when you say slow zoom, what do you mean?
In this context, at the very long focal length of '30x' (whatever that means in bridgeland), the aperture is small so less light can get in so your shutter speed won't be as fast as it could otherwise be. In short you get a woo 30x zoom but it compromises other options. 'Zoom' (as in 'look I can zoom in on that sandwich from 50 yards away') is almost always a false god IMHO.

vladcjelli

Original Poster:

2,962 posts

157 months

Sunday 14th July 2013
quotequote all
JDRoest said:
vladcjelli said:
The 400d still appeals, it's good money, and I do want to learn the ways of the slr.
As I said earlier, big fan of the 400D. Does everything you need in a reasonable package. I use one for work and today I'll probably put another 8,000 exposures through it (aiming for 9k today). The one I use for work is just a work horse and comes up with pretty reasonable images (shutter button is pretty much fked though lol). I won local competitions with it and beat out people with much much better kit (which is hugely gratifying I might add, especially the guy with the 1d-whatever with his big white L lenses).

Even the 18-55 kit lens was a reasonable bit of kit in my hands. Yeah, it's not an L, and it's a cheap lens, but the key to all these things is not what you have, but how you use it.
On the subject of the 400d, does it have an auto/idiot setting?

I ask because at some point my wife will want to snap away, and she certainly won't have the patience to faff about.

Simpo Two

85,147 posts

264 months

Sunday 14th July 2013
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A is for Auto, yes.

MysteryLemon

4,968 posts

190 months

Sunday 14th July 2013
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Looking at bridge cameras kinda defeats the point of what you want in a camera.

You make out that you want a better camera than the likes of a compact.

A bridge basically is a compact with a big lens. The big lens might seem like an awesome thing but in reality, they aren't ever great quality and will be slow and cumbersome to use.

If you want a DSLR, get a DSLR. I garantee you will never use the full range of a 24-600mm lens that will be found on a bridge. It might seem like the perfect, all round camera but they really arent. A DSLR with an 18-70ish lens will be far more usable, and produce far better quality pictures. If you really want the extra range then the likes of a 55-300mm lens (for Nikon) will only set you back around £150, which you can add at a later date. Unless you are looking at shooting wildlife or track days, you really wont need more than 100mm for general use, and even then, you could get something like a 18-135mm kit lens (nikon) for £130.

MysteryLemon

4,968 posts

190 months

Sunday 14th July 2013
quotequote all
vladcjelli said:
On the subject of the 400d, does it have an auto/idiot setting?

I ask because at some point my wife will want to snap away, and she certainly won't have the patience to faff about.
As with every DSLR, it will have Auto, P, A, S and M.

Auto is literally auto everything. Just like a compact. P is auto apeture and speed but you will have control over flash and iso, as well as other features in the camera. A is manual aperture and the camera will adjust the speed for the correct exposure, S is manual speed and will adjust the aperture for the correct exposure. M is manual everything and the camera will do nothing for you.

As with all modern, entry level DSLRs will also have many "scene" modes where the camera can be preset for certain situations.

You will be surprised how user friendly entry level DSLRs are these days.