How to start up. Advise please

[Fastchas]

I'm looking at getting into photography a bit deeper than I currently do. I've got a Canon 20d which I'm getting well versed with. Well, I kinda know what the buttons do but getting photos of the quality on some threads here leave me a little deflated.
At the moment my kit is;

Canon 20d
Tamron 18-200mm
Canon 50mm f1.8
Canon 55-80mm kit lens (which never gets used)
Pk/4 NDF's

Just bought a laptop. What editing would be best for me. Lightroom? Elements? Which one and why?

What would you suggest would be a good addition to the kit? I'm toying with the idea of throwing a couple hundred quid at it. Would it better to update the body? I know a better camera doesn't make a better photographer but is a 50d so much better? Or a EOS600d? A few friends have these and they seem so much lighter and faster but also the images seem sharper. Or is it just me looking at other peoples images? Is a 20d old hat now?
I'll post some pics on when I get chance.
Thanks in advance.

[beanbag]

It's all 6 and half a dozen.

You can take as much feedback from these forums as you like but the best way is simply to experiment and play around with your gear a lot.

My only suggestion would be to shoot in RAW allowing you to manipulate your photos more when they are imported into whatever editing program you choose to use.

My choice is Lightroom. I pay a monthly subscription for this and I also get Photoshop in the deal too, but there are many other options out there. I also use Picasa because I like the way it manages my photos. More-so than Lightroom.

All have free trials and demos so just spend time downloading a few and playing around with them.

If you need more information, DPreview.com is a great place to start.

[Fastchas]

Thanks. I already use Picasa for managing them and I like it's simplicity for fixing and cropping. I've just started shooting in RAW but can't see the advantage with this in Picasa? Am I missing something?
I was going to get an editing suite off eBay. Missed out on Elements 10 last night for £29. Seemed a good price and plenty of bidders on it so guessing it was a good one to get.

[Simpo Two]

I wonder if the issue is exposure and composition, rather than 'kit' per se? Can't tell without examples.

[Starfighter]

Don't buy any more kit - what you have is more than capable of getting great results. Go out and practice.

The hardest thing that I found was choosing the picture - what angles to shoot from and what to include / remove from the frame. I did a photography course at my local tech and we did several exercises with a topic set for the following week or in class. I still have a thing for old doors as a result. Try forgetting about as much as possible with the lens options. Put on the 50mm and just use that for some time. It's a cheap but very under rated lens with good sharpness and colour control.

The 20D can display a histogram on the screen along with the image - learn about what this means and how the different metering settings work and influence the results you get. Do similar things playing with expose options (shutter speed vs aperture vs ISO setting). Shooting RAW may help but you can't turn a pigs ear in to a silk purse doing this. That said, my 20D gives slightly soft results compared to my other bodies and they all needed a little unsharp mask just to put the punch back in.

I think Canon allow you to download their RAW software. If not then drop me a PM with your address and you can have the disk from my 20D and upgrade from there.

[Fastchas]

Here's afew pics I've taken with my 20d. Some edited/cropped in Picasa, some not touched at all. Please impart some constructive criticism and hints/tips.

[troc]

I found the following book to be very useful when I was starting out, and indeed still now:

"Understanding Exposure, 3rd Edition: How to Shoot Great Photographs with Any Camera" by Bryan Peterson

Amazon link: http://www.amazon.co.uk/Understanding-Exposure-3rd...

It's an excellent guide to how to set-up, light and expose a picture.

I have also found the following website to be extremely informative and helpful:

http://www.cambridgeincolour.com/

What I have also done before is to browse sites like flickr and pbase (this one is excellent to see what a particular camera or lens is capable of) for images I like and then look at the EXIF information to get an idea of the exposure settings used to obtain the image.

I'd also look at joining a local club, they usually have interesting lectures and workshops as well as challenges to go and shoot something specific.

Finally, try simply setting up a scene or photo (maybe something interesting in your garden) where you have plenty of light available and just try shooting it in many different ways. Try to stay in one place and adjust the aperture to see how depth of field changes, then do the same for shutter speed. If you do this in "P" mode, you will see how the other variable changes to keep your exposure the same. Try on manual and see how changing one affects the amount of light that comes in. Then maybe try keeping the exposure the same but move around. Zoom in on the subject and take a picture. Now, zoom out and walk forwards to get the subject the same size on the frame - note how the background has changed etc etc.

I found this sort of exercise really helped me when I was starting out.

You can also challenge yourself by going out with just the 50mm attached and see how it forces you to alter your position and shooting style to get the images you want. Zooms make us all lazy

The main thing is to enjoy it!

[Fastchas]

Hmmm...didn't realise there was only the one pic uploaded from the 6/7 I chose.
I'll attach some more tonight!

[Simpo Two]

Fastchas said:

Here's afew pics I've taken with my 20d. Some edited/cropped in Picasa, some not touched at all. Please impart some constructive criticism and hints/tips.

Well, from that one, I guess you wanted to capture the beauty of a pine cone. First, the background whilst out of focus is cluttered and so prevents a nice view of the cones - it's also the same colour which adds to the confusion. Second, as well as pine cones there's a lot of random branchiness which is ugly, and there is no obvious composition going on. The exposure is OK, but you've just plonked two pine cones in the middle and pressed the button.

I'd have concentrated on one cone, got in much closer, and adjusted my position to get a clear or at least plain b/g.

Generally if a scene doesn't work when viewed through the viewfinder, it won't work later. Not every scene makes a good photo; sometimes you need to walk on.

[Fastchas]

Simpo Two said:

Well, from that one, I guess you wanted to capture the beauty of a pine cone. First, the background whilst out of focus is cluttered and so prevents a nice view of the cones - it's also the same colour which adds to the confusion. Second, as well as pine cones there's a lot of random branchiness which is ugly, and there is no obvious composition going on. The exposure is OK, but you've just plonked two pine cones in the middle and pressed the button.

I'd have concentrated on one cone, got in much closer, and adjusted my position to get a clear or at least plain b/g.

Generally if a scene doesn't work when viewed through the viewfinder, it won't work later. Not every scene makes a good photo; sometimes you need to walk on.

Yes I didn't see the twig that comes across the front of the cones until I looked at it in Picasa. But I understand your criticism and take it on board so thanks for that. I need to compose the shot more carefully, perhaps adjust my angle to get a better b/g instead of just point & click.
I do notice the image isn't actually that sharp either though?

[Simpo Two]

Fastchas said:

I need to compose the shot more carefully, perhaps adjust my angle to get a better b/g instead of just point & click. I do notice the image isn't actually that sharp either though?

Yes, just pointing a camera at an interesting thing is unlikely to get great results, some thought is needed as to position, distance, background, depth of field and lighting.

I think the plane of focus is around the front of the front pine one, but I agree it's not quite there. A little movement perhaps, either camera or subject, and maybe sub-optimal sharpening for posting (when you make an image smaller it needs resharpening).

[Fastchas]

Here's some more (hopefully)

[Fastchas]

[Fastchas]

[Fastchas]

[Fastchas]

[Fastchas]

[Simpo Two]

Fastchas said:

pix

One of those makes the grade for me with no major issues.

But let's turn this around - can you identify the issues with the others? If and when you can, then you're halfway to fixing them for next time.

[budfox]

Fastchas said:

This is quite nice. It won't set the world alight but it's quite interesting, nicely exposed, black bits are black, white bits are white and it's pretty sharp.

[RobDickinson]

Find/identify the subject
De-clutter, compose with less in. Follow traditional composition rules unless you know you can break them and win. rule of 3rds, leading lines, odd numbers.
Shoot with good light. Mid day light is often flat and contrasty causing boring pictures.
Make sure you have it focused properly and the shutter speed is adequate if hand holding.
Check your exposure on the screen and tweak if its wrong. Dont rely on the cameras metering.