DSLR or Compact System Camera?
Discussion
I was a keen amateur photographer many years ago and enjoyed using a manual 35mm SLR camera, I particularly liked being able to control the depth of field and to select the right shutter speed to capture things in motion. Then I got lazy and bought an automatic SLR and left it in auto mode most of the time. Then I got even lazier and bought a compact digital camera.
Now I think that I'd like to re-gain control over my photography and have been considering a digital SLR, nothing too fancy, or expensive, but possibly something like the Nikon D3300. When visiting the camera section of a department store I was advised to consider mirror-less Compact System Cameras (CSC). I like the fact that some CSCs have viewfinders as I don't want to have to put my glasses on to see the camera screen!
Digital SLRs seem quite bulky and weighty, the smaller size and lighter weight of the CSC appeals to me for those reasons. Another factor pushing me towards a CSC is that I've seen two CSCs which have old style aperture setting and shutter speed selector, the Panasonic Lumix G DMC-GF7 and the Fujifilm X-T10. As I want to easily select the aperture and shutter speed myself without having to "press button A while twiddling button B while looking in the viewfinder display" these cameras particularly appeal to me. It's possible that I'd want to buy additional lenses sometime.
I'd be interested to hear opinions on those cameras I mentioned, and whether anyone has bought a CSC then wished they'd bought a DSLR instead, or vice versa.
Thanks.
DM
Now I think that I'd like to re-gain control over my photography and have been considering a digital SLR, nothing too fancy, or expensive, but possibly something like the Nikon D3300. When visiting the camera section of a department store I was advised to consider mirror-less Compact System Cameras (CSC). I like the fact that some CSCs have viewfinders as I don't want to have to put my glasses on to see the camera screen!
Digital SLRs seem quite bulky and weighty, the smaller size and lighter weight of the CSC appeals to me for those reasons. Another factor pushing me towards a CSC is that I've seen two CSCs which have old style aperture setting and shutter speed selector, the Panasonic Lumix G DMC-GF7 and the Fujifilm X-T10. As I want to easily select the aperture and shutter speed myself without having to "press button A while twiddling button B while looking in the viewfinder display" these cameras particularly appeal to me. It's possible that I'd want to buy additional lenses sometime.
I'd be interested to hear opinions on those cameras I mentioned, and whether anyone has bought a CSC then wished they'd bought a DSLR instead, or vice versa.
Thanks.
DM
This might be facetious as I admit I don't read this forum that often, I'll get this in before this turns into a DSLR only discussion... I'm not sure you'll get much support on CSCs here 
But it's what you do with the camera isn't it?
I bought into micro four thirds myself so am biased to mirrorless, I can't hold up heavy cameras very easily so DSLRs were never really an option. I used film SLRs a bit at school before I was using wheelchair regularly and the weight got more of a problem. So I was stuck with "those" cameras and high-end P&S until mirrorless was more viable. I wanted some zoom for wildlife so it had to be the former
The GF7 is aimed more at entry level so doesn't have the EVF as you mentioned, but battery life isn't great Afaik. I think I'd be looking at the G7/GX7 or Olympus E-M10 against the X-T10. The GX7's EVF is sort of out of the way and can tilt upwards but it is a previous model (GX8 body is still ~£700). There's also the Olympus E-PL7 which doesn't have an EVF and is cheaper.
It's probably best just to look at various CSCs and DSLRs in person, and go for what ever feels like it would suit best. You'll probably be spending much more with CSCs over something like a D3300 with kit lenses though.
If you like the form factor and ligher weight go for CSC. If those aren't an issue, or you get to doing things like sports/motorsports quite seriously, DSLR might be better, though I think the AF speed on CSCs is starting to become more irrelevant particularly with the latest sensors. If you're getting more lenses later on, DSLRs mount lenses will be cheaper than the nearest approximations on CSC. I think my Panasonic 14mm, 45-175mm and 25mm Summilux ran to £800.
But it's what you do with the camera isn't it?I bought into micro four thirds myself so am biased to mirrorless, I can't hold up heavy cameras very easily so DSLRs were never really an option. I used film SLRs a bit at school before I was using wheelchair regularly and the weight got more of a problem. So I was stuck with "those" cameras and high-end P&S until mirrorless was more viable. I wanted some zoom for wildlife so it had to be the former
The GF7 is aimed more at entry level so doesn't have the EVF as you mentioned, but battery life isn't great Afaik. I think I'd be looking at the G7/GX7 or Olympus E-M10 against the X-T10. The GX7's EVF is sort of out of the way and can tilt upwards but it is a previous model (GX8 body is still ~£700). There's also the Olympus E-PL7 which doesn't have an EVF and is cheaper.
It's probably best just to look at various CSCs and DSLRs in person, and go for what ever feels like it would suit best. You'll probably be spending much more with CSCs over something like a D3300 with kit lenses though.
If you like the form factor and ligher weight go for CSC. If those aren't an issue, or you get to doing things like sports/motorsports quite seriously, DSLR might be better, though I think the AF speed on CSCs is starting to become more irrelevant particularly with the latest sensors. If you're getting more lenses later on, DSLRs mount lenses will be cheaper than the nearest approximations on CSC. I think my Panasonic 14mm, 45-175mm and 25mm Summilux ran to £800.
Edited by mizx on Wednesday 27th January 13:35
As above - it depends on what you want to shoot. Motorsport or wildlife stick with DSLR.
However if you are looking for the manual control experience I would highly recommend Fuji. I have a X100s as an accompaniment to my DSLR and it is fantastic (along with the other Fuji X series cameras) for a tactile interface with manual control wheels. The sensor and great Fuji lenses are fantastic and can often match full frame quality.
However if you are looking for the manual control experience I would highly recommend Fuji. I have a X100s as an accompaniment to my DSLR and it is fantastic (along with the other Fuji X series cameras) for a tactile interface with manual control wheels. The sensor and great Fuji lenses are fantastic and can often match full frame quality.
Big Fuji Fan here, having X100, X-E2, X-T1 and an IR converted X-E1 and a bucket load of lenses.
I don't shoot motorsport, fast moving things or wildlife, and a CSC suits me. I love the Fuji's for that old-skool tactile method of setting aperture, shutter speed, etc. The quality of the lenses is also fantastic, but some are not cheap.
The X-T10 is a fantastic camera, but it is quite small, so if you have big hands, it may not be the Fuji for you.
I don't shoot motorsport, fast moving things or wildlife, and a CSC suits me. I love the Fuji's for that old-skool tactile method of setting aperture, shutter speed, etc. The quality of the lenses is also fantastic, but some are not cheap.
The X-T10 is a fantastic camera, but it is quite small, so if you have big hands, it may not be the Fuji for you.
DarkMatter said:
I was a keen amateur photographer many years ago and enjoyed using a manual 35mm SLR camera, I particularly liked being able to control the depth of field and to select the right shutter speed to capture things in motion. Then I got lazy and bought an automatic SLR and left it in auto mode most of the time. Then I got even lazier and bought a compact digital camera.
Now I think that I'd like to re-gain control over my photography and have been considering a digital SLR, nothing too fancy, or expensive, but possibly something like the Nikon D3300. When visiting the camera section of a department store I was advised to consider mirror-less Compact System Cameras (CSC). I like the fact that some CSCs have viewfinders as I don't want to have to put my glasses on to see the camera screen!
Digital SLRs seem quite bulky and weighty, the smaller size and lighter weight of the CSC appeals to me for those reasons. Another factor pushing me towards a CSC is that I've seen two CSCs which have old style aperture setting and shutter speed selector, the Panasonic Lumix G DMC-GF7 and the Fujifilm X-T10. As I want to easily select the aperture and shutter speed myself without having to "press button A while twiddling button B while looking in the viewfinder display" these cameras particularly appeal to me. It's possible that I'd want to buy additional lenses sometime.
I'd be interested to hear opinions on those cameras I mentioned, and whether anyone has bought a CSC then wished they'd bought a DSLR instead, or vice versa.
Thanks.
DM
My son is a journalist and uses a Lumix G5 (or 6) for broadcast quality video as well as stills. He loves the Lumix. Very quick to use if the circumstances merit but equally at home where an image or video is to be taken in difficult light.Now I think that I'd like to re-gain control over my photography and have been considering a digital SLR, nothing too fancy, or expensive, but possibly something like the Nikon D3300. When visiting the camera section of a department store I was advised to consider mirror-less Compact System Cameras (CSC). I like the fact that some CSCs have viewfinders as I don't want to have to put my glasses on to see the camera screen!
Digital SLRs seem quite bulky and weighty, the smaller size and lighter weight of the CSC appeals to me for those reasons. Another factor pushing me towards a CSC is that I've seen two CSCs which have old style aperture setting and shutter speed selector, the Panasonic Lumix G DMC-GF7 and the Fujifilm X-T10. As I want to easily select the aperture and shutter speed myself without having to "press button A while twiddling button B while looking in the viewfinder display" these cameras particularly appeal to me. It's possible that I'd want to buy additional lenses sometime.
I'd be interested to hear opinions on those cameras I mentioned, and whether anyone has bought a CSC then wished they'd bought a DSLR instead, or vice versa.
Thanks.
DM
Doesn't suit my needs but if it did, I'd go for it. I'm used to the Lumix controls so me finding it very easy to set up might not be the universal opinion. He's well chuffed with it. Perhaps a bit over-priced for what it is, but it's well made and quite solid.
mizx said:
This might be facetious as I admit I don't read this forum that often, I'll get this in before this turns into a DSLR only discussion... I'm not sure you'll get much support on CSCs here
Don't think anyone has any problems with CSCs, but for f**k's sake don't mention Bridge Cameras - seen as heresy by many in these here parts ........ CSC are great cameras for a range of things.
dSLR's are a better all round more capable tool though, but if you dont want to shoot things like wildlife , motorspots etc then you likely dont need one.
CSC's are smaller and lighter, quality is great usually , I'm not a fan on m43rds tho for IQ.
A D3300 or canon 1100D or something isnt a big camera but is bulkier than say a sony a7.
But in general there are no real bad cameras now. And with the right lens a crop sensor camera will give you good subject isolation, FF is better and more like what you were used to in 35mm terms but we have more and faster,much better lenses now.
dSLR's are a better all round more capable tool though, but if you dont want to shoot things like wildlife , motorspots etc then you likely dont need one.
CSC's are smaller and lighter, quality is great usually , I'm not a fan on m43rds tho for IQ.
A D3300 or canon 1100D or something isnt a big camera but is bulkier than say a sony a7.
But in general there are no real bad cameras now. And with the right lens a crop sensor camera will give you good subject isolation, FF is better and more like what you were used to in 35mm terms but we have more and faster,much better lenses now.
If you shoot motorsport, don't think for a minute that CSCs cant shoot it. Of course, the AF on DSLRs is still better ( the AF tracking on Olympus is hilariously bad, turn the tracking off and it works fine ) but I've had as much success with my E-m1 as I had with my d7000 for drag racing
have a look at Lars' site www.griddd.se for some examples
have a look at Lars' site www.griddd.se for some examples
I switched from a bulky Canon DSLR to an Olympus EM5 kit and haven't regretted it for one minute. The size & weight means I can carry my full kit around all day without getting any backache. The image quality is fantastic for my uses, i.e. I rarely print on anything above A3 size, and most of my photography is mainly for on-line viewing. As far as shooting motorsport is concerned, yes the camera does have its limitations, but if you work around those limitations you can get some pretty impressive shots - I shoot motorsport using the zone focussing approach with high speed burst, and it works fine for me.
I've literally just sold all my Canon DSLR gear (Canon 550D) and moved over to Olympus mirrorless compact system (EM-5 II). Just got back from 2 weeks in LA/San Diego, truly converted to mirrorless.
Love the fact I can now fit ALL my camera gear in one small bag that use to be only big enough for one lens + 550D, and actually when out and about no need for a bag at all, the pancake zoom lens is so small. The difference is quite remarkable
Really enjoy using the camera, the AF may not have phase detection but in real life use is AS GOOD as my old 550D, even the shutter makes a lovely noise. Anyone currently still shooting with DSLRs need to give these mirrorless systems a try, they really are good!!
In summary no regrets about moving away from DSLR to the current mirrorless systems - Infacf I wish I done it sooner
These were all taken with the kit lens (expect last - cheap Sigma prime)...and the cost of additional lens is 2/3-1/2 the cost of the equivalent DSLR gear.
Love the fact I can now fit ALL my camera gear in one small bag that use to be only big enough for one lens + 550D, and actually when out and about no need for a bag at all, the pancake zoom lens is so small. The difference is quite remarkable
Really enjoy using the camera, the AF may not have phase detection but in real life use is AS GOOD as my old 550D, even the shutter makes a lovely noise. Anyone currently still shooting with DSLRs need to give these mirrorless systems a try, they really are good!!
In summary no regrets about moving away from DSLR to the current mirrorless systems - Infacf I wish I done it sooner
These were all taken with the kit lens (expect last - cheap Sigma prime)...and the cost of additional lens is 2/3-1/2 the cost of the equivalent DSLR gear.
Edited by gangzoom on Monday 1st February 05:01
gangzoom said:
I've literally just sold all my Canon DSLR gear (Canon 550D) and moved over to Olympus mirrorless compact system (EM-5 II). Just got back from 2 weeks in LA/San Diego, truly converted to mirrorless.
Love the fact I can now fit ALL my camera gear in one small bag that use to be only big enough for one lens + 550D, and actually when out and about no need for a bag at all, the pancake zoom lens is so small. The difference is quite remarkable
Surely if you put a pancake lens on the DSLR it wouldn't be much bigger than the CSC?Love the fact I can now fit ALL my camera gear in one small bag that use to be only big enough for one lens + 550D, and actually when out and about no need for a bag at all, the pancake zoom lens is so small. The difference is quite remarkable
Craikeybaby said:
Surely if you put a pancake lens on the DSLR it wouldn't be much bigger than the CSC?
Depends on your definition of 'much' e.g. EOS-M with a 22m pancake fits in the pouch designed for a point-and-shoot. I guess if a DLSR isn't too bulky for you then moving to a mirrorless system isn't going to be that appealing. The in-build image stabilisation, sensor size and arrangement all help to keep the lenses small.Edited by fido on Monday 1st February 15:11
Craikeybaby said:
I was specifically referring to the image I quoted, the CSC was shown with a pancake lens and the DSLR with a zoom. The DSLR body is slightly bigger, but not my much - put the 40mm pancake lens on there and the size difference between the two cameras shown would be minimal.
Sorry that's simply not my experience, the pancake zoom lens on the EM-5 has a x3 zoom, 14-42mm. That's an equivalent 35mm focal lengths of 28-84mm. I've never seem a Canon or Nikon pancake lens that offers that level of zoom. I loved my Canon 550D, and 450D before it, but technology has moved on. AND the EM-5 II had FIVE stop body stabilisation, no Canon pancake lens I know had that kind of IS??If your a pro, FF will still offer the best quality, but most us take photos for fun, and for me the quality of even the kit lens on the my EM-5 II is amazing. Been playing with some photos I took on holiday, they look good enough for me, especially considering just how much more compact the camera is compared to my old DSLR. The OP was asking about real life experiences of using CCS versus DSLR, and for me CSC is now the default choice
Edited by gangzoom on Tuesday 2nd February 07:11
Edited by gangzoom on Tuesday 2nd February 09:20
From what I've been told, the Panasonic G7 has excellent autofocus.
Went into a camera shop yesterday to have a browse. My photography needs might be changing and I was wondering about CSC for lack of bulk reasons. Had a long chat with one of the chaps there, no pressure (thanks Park Cameras, like Jessops of old) and he was of the opinion that the differences in autofocus is almost unnoticeable for most and the G7 in particular.
He has almost convinced me. I need to work out costs before taking the plunge.
Went into a camera shop yesterday to have a browse. My photography needs might be changing and I was wondering about CSC for lack of bulk reasons. Had a long chat with one of the chaps there, no pressure (thanks Park Cameras, like Jessops of old) and he was of the opinion that the differences in autofocus is almost unnoticeable for most and the G7 in particular.
He has almost convinced me. I need to work out costs before taking the plunge.
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