Alloy Rads - Should I give up?
Discussion
My 2nd very expensive RadTech alloy rad has started to weep. The first one lasted less than a year, and this one almost exactly 5 years. I have been offered a replacement on excellent terms but the cost would be roughly the same as a re-core on an old V8S rad. Considering the mileage I do, this is ridiculous.
What would you do?
Does anyone have their rad out at the moment and would be able to tell me the distance between the centres of the locating pegs on the bottom frame of the rad? (That piece is missing on my old rad). Alternatively, does anyone have one of these plates in return for some drinking vouchers?
I'll be going to a rad repair firm tomorrow to see exactly how much a re-core would be.
Thanks in advance
What would you do?
Does anyone have their rad out at the moment and would be able to tell me the distance between the centres of the locating pegs on the bottom frame of the rad? (That piece is missing on my old rad). Alternatively, does anyone have one of these plates in return for some drinking vouchers?
I'll be going to a rad repair firm tomorrow to see exactly how much a re-core would be.
Thanks in advance
LawrieS said:
... Are they the manufacturers for ACT?.....
Yes, but to be fair to ACT they have offered a replacement on very fair terms.LawrieS said:
....
I have my old S3C rad to hand if that's likely to be the same I can go and get the tape out?
Not sure if they are the same, but if you can let me have the measurement I can see if it looks similar to the damaged alloy one I have.I have my old S3C rad to hand if that's likely to be the same I can go and get the tape out?
LawrieS said:
...It's a bit dark in my shed but something like 555mm, ...
That corresponds to my old one (alloy rad No 1) at 555mm. Would you mind having another look tomorrow and let me know if the pegs equidistant from the outer edges of the rad (or either side of the centre line).Many thanks
v8s4me said:
What would you do?
What I did was fitted a Subaru one.Admittedly an aftermarket extra thick aluminium one which I suspect will fail in a similar way to my radtec one eventually but will be considerably cheaper* to replace when it does.
I don't think that aluminium is really the ideal thing to make the rad out of if you're going to bolt it to something as flimsy and prone to vibration as the radiator frame on an S. Reinforcing the frame might help, or making the rad rather more softly mounted to it.
I think if you've got an original one to recore that may well be the best solution for a long life, it's probably not as good at cooling it but I don't recall it being a problem in the few months I had mine before the standard radiator decided to stop holding the water in.
- to be fair the radtec one is more expensive because they've done a better job
Was yours powder coated .? I wonder if this would aid longevity .? I went for alloy after I only got 18 months life from a recore .!
I'm interested to know if this is from impact damage or a crack / joint or just corrosion.
I remember reading that there can be Galvanic (?) reactions if the alloy to steel connections are isolated or not. Mine in on all rubber bushes so is isolated and has some vibration damping too.
some earth theirs not sure which is best.. Also the reaction thing could be balls, would it take 1, 5, 10 years, not sure.
I wish I'd paid to have mine powdercoated but it's just bare ally for now.
Good luck
Damian S3
I'm interested to know if this is from impact damage or a crack / joint or just corrosion.
I remember reading that there can be Galvanic (?) reactions if the alloy to steel connections are isolated or not. Mine in on all rubber bushes so is isolated and has some vibration damping too.
some earth theirs not sure which is best.. Also the reaction thing could be balls, would it take 1, 5, 10 years, not sure.
I wish I'd paid to have mine powdercoated but it's just bare ally for now.
Good luck
Damian S3
I don't think powder coating would make any difference, apart perhaps from making it less efficient.
Rad 1 started weeping from one of the weld seams after about 3000 miles, this one seems to be weeping from where the core joins the end tank. Personally, rightly or wrongly, I've come to the conclusion that the alloy rad can't handle the combination of repeated expansion and contraction in a confined space and the vibration. The combination of these two factors leads to fatigue in the joints and failure. Just my personal opinion based on two failed rads and what I've see happen to other owner's cars with alloy rads. Two failed rads with less than 10,000 miles in 5 years is stupid.
If the re-core is less than the alloy replacement, I'm going back to old technology.
Rad 1 started weeping from one of the weld seams after about 3000 miles, this one seems to be weeping from where the core joins the end tank. Personally, rightly or wrongly, I've come to the conclusion that the alloy rad can't handle the combination of repeated expansion and contraction in a confined space and the vibration. The combination of these two factors leads to fatigue in the joints and failure. Just my personal opinion based on two failed rads and what I've see happen to other owner's cars with alloy rads. Two failed rads with less than 10,000 miles in 5 years is stupid.
If the re-core is less than the alloy replacement, I'm going back to old technology.
v8s4me said:
I don't think powder coating would make any difference, apart perhaps from making it less efficient.
Rad 1 started weeping from one of the weld seams after about 3000 miles, this one seems to be weeping from where the core joins the end tank. Personally, rightly or wrongly, I've come to the conclusion that the alloy rad can't handle the combination of repeated expansion and contraction in a confined space and the vibration. The combination of these two factors leads to fatigue in the joints and failure. Just my personal opinion based on two failed rads and what I've see happen to other owner's cars with alloy rads. Two failed rads with less than 10,000 miles in 5 years is stupid.
If the re-core is less than the alloy replacement, I'm going back to old technology.
Joe Rad 1 started weeping from one of the weld seams after about 3000 miles, this one seems to be weeping from where the core joins the end tank. Personally, rightly or wrongly, I've come to the conclusion that the alloy rad can't handle the combination of repeated expansion and contraction in a confined space and the vibration. The combination of these two factors leads to fatigue in the joints and failure. Just my personal opinion based on two failed rads and what I've see happen to other owner's cars with alloy rads. Two failed rads with less than 10,000 miles in 5 years is stupid.
If the re-core is less than the alloy replacement, I'm going back to old technology.
I thought long and hard about this when my rad started leaking and i came to the conclusion that a recore of the old rad represented a more cost effective solution. I also considered the capability to repair the old rads with a bit of solder and a soldering iron in a hotel car park should a failure occur away from home. All in all I stuck with the old technology.
v8s4me said:
greyhulk said:
I wonder if getting it anodized is a possibility?
That wouldn't make one last any longer is fatigue around the welds is the cause.
Is the crack "getatable"? could it be welded or soldered or maybe a lump of Sugru would sort it ?
LeTVR - thanks for the drawing, I'll take it with me later. The V8S has a different mounting arrangement on the top.....
Question for Phillpot - when you had your old V8S rad re-cored, did you have a different bottom plate put on? If not then the locating arrangement on the bottom of the rad is the same for the V8S and the S3.
Question for Phillpot - when you had your old V8S rad re-cored, did you have a different bottom plate put on? If not then the locating arrangement on the bottom of the rad is the same for the V8S and the S3.
intended for air conditioning coils (they're subjected to higher temperatures and pressures than a car radiator), La Co heat Seal might be good for a temporary repair
My S3 rad has the same top mounts as this.
I've been quoted £165 probably, but £225 possibly by Arrow of Melksham (local to me) depending what they find,+VAT. This makes this at £161 delivered look like a bargain, unless there are reliability issues.
Does anybody have any other good recore quotes?
Also:
Thanks.
John
I've been quoted £165 probably, but £225 possibly by Arrow of Melksham (local to me) depending what they find,+VAT. This makes this at £161 delivered look like a bargain, unless there are reliability issues.
Does anybody have any other good recore quotes?
Also:
phillpot said:
Good old copper 'n brass, blow lamp and it would be fixed in minutes
Mike, please could I ask you for a little more detail, or a link to such? I'd love to try, but reluctant to attack the apparent mess of my rad without further guidance. It has two pinhole leaks, apparently at the tank/core joints at right and left sides: didn't lose any measurable water during my three weeks of more-or-less successful motoring, but does show stains and drips (oo-er!).Thanks.
John
Hi John, from my limited knowledge and experience that would be a tricky one.
I have in the past successfully repaired a leak on the seam between the header tank and the end plate, removed and refitted a leaking hose stub and refitted a mounting bracket that had become detached using one of these.
When a radiator is made all the tubes are soldered into the end plates from what will become the inside once the end headers are soldered on so access for a repair would be awkward. Trying to do anything from the outside would be hindered by the nice coat of black paint. The two essentials of soldering are cleanliness and heat control.
Personally for your issue I'd try something like Ce-Lit.
There are no doubt those that will throw there arms up in horror at the idea of using any form of leak sealer but I've never had an issue with it causing any problems.
I have in the past successfully repaired a leak on the seam between the header tank and the end plate, removed and refitted a leaking hose stub and refitted a mounting bracket that had become detached using one of these.
When a radiator is made all the tubes are soldered into the end plates from what will become the inside once the end headers are soldered on so access for a repair would be awkward. Trying to do anything from the outside would be hindered by the nice coat of black paint. The two essentials of soldering are cleanliness and heat control.
Personally for your issue I'd try something like Ce-Lit.
There are no doubt those that will throw there arms up in horror at the idea of using any form of leak sealer but I've never had an issue with it causing any problems.
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