please take a seat...........
Discussion
As anyone who has had the seats out of an S will know getting a spanner on the bolts is a tad awkward because they sit down in a channel, too narrow to get a socket or spanner on the bolt head but not narrow enough to stop the bolt turning.
One solution is a tack of weld on each bolt, ok if you have a welder.
Popular solution seems to be a nut to tighten the bolt into the runner then "penny washers" to help spread the load when seat is refitted.
Not over impressed with this idea, a lot of weight on a relatively small area, my first "solution" was to use strips of wood with holes big enough to clear the nuts in place of the washers. Weight (even my slender figure) now spread as originally over full length of runners.
This worked fine but over time the wood has got damp and soggy so next plan was alluminium box section (25 x 12mm) with 8mm holes one side and holes big enough to clear a 13mm socket the other, some plastic end caps tidied things up.
Another idea was to use solid alluminium bar and do away with the nuts. This however returns to the "how to turn the bolts" issue? Could use cap heads (Allen bolts) but these only seem to come as bolts (partially threaded) not Sets (fully threaded) so we went for "button heads".
One solution is a tack of weld on each bolt, ok if you have a welder.
Popular solution seems to be a nut to tighten the bolt into the runner then "penny washers" to help spread the load when seat is refitted.
Not over impressed with this idea, a lot of weight on a relatively small area, my first "solution" was to use strips of wood with holes big enough to clear the nuts in place of the washers. Weight (even my slender figure) now spread as originally over full length of runners.
This worked fine but over time the wood has got damp and soggy so next plan was alluminium box section (25 x 12mm) with 8mm holes one side and holes big enough to clear a 13mm socket the other, some plastic end caps tidied things up.
Another idea was to use solid alluminium bar and do away with the nuts. This however returns to the "how to turn the bolts" issue? Could use cap heads (Allen bolts) but these only seem to come as bolts (partially threaded) not Sets (fully threaded) so we went for "button heads".
Edited by phillpot on Saturday 7th January 21:07
I've seen and used plenty of fully threaded cap head Allen acrews in my long career in engineering, Mike. ( Unless I'm starting with senile dementia. )
Aircraft, ships, trains, machines....
If you're trying to tighten or undo a hex bolt or screw with its head inside a channel section, just jam it with a flat-bladed screwdriver between the side of the channel and the relevant flat on the head of the fastener.
Aircraft, ships, trains, machines....
If you're trying to tighten or undo a hex bolt or screw with its head inside a channel section, just jam it with a flat-bladed screwdriver between the side of the channel and the relevant flat on the head of the fastener.
Edited by glenrobbo on Saturday 7th January 21:18
glenrobbo said:
I've seen and used plenty of fully threaded cap head Allen screws in my long career in engineering
Ah but metric, in stainless? ...
glenrobbo said:
If you're trying to tighten or undo a hex bolt or screw with its head inside a channel section, just jam it with a flat-bladed screwdriver between the side of the channel and the relevant flat on the head of the fastener.
Not so easy when you're reaching under the car with the other hand to do the nut up!......... and wouldn't work with my threaded bar design
gmw9666 said:
Alternatively drill a hole.......................
Ingenious, have you actually done that?I like using "Nylok" nuts, could prove a little trickier as these couldn't be wound on by hand past the hole?
Would have to be quite a small hole, minor diameter of an M8 bolt is only 6.65mm
phillpot said:
glenrobbo said:
I've seen and used plenty of fully threaded cap head Allen screws in my long career in engineering
Ah but metric, in stainless? ...glenrobbo said:
If you're trying to tighten or undo a hex bolt or screw with its head inside a channel section, just jam it with a flat-bladed screwdriver between the side of the channel and the relevant flat on the head of the fastener.
Not so easy when you're reaching under the car with the other hand to do the nut up!......... and wouldn't work with my threaded bar design
Sorry, I forgot about your fetish Mike...
Screwdriver... Just wedge it in so that when you start turning the fastener/ nut from underneath, it jams in tighter the more you turn it. Simples. Or get somebody to help.
glenrobbo said:
Ah. Stainless you say?
Sorry, I forgot about your fetish Mike...
Screwdriver... Just wedge it in so that when you start turning the fastener/ nut from underneath, it jams in tighter the more you turn it. Simples. Or get somebody to help.
Or, sorry no photo, use a stainless strip in the channel, with threaded holes and screw up from underneath.Sorry, I forgot about your fetish Mike...
Screwdriver... Just wedge it in so that when you start turning the fastener/ nut from underneath, it jams in tighter the more you turn it. Simples. Or get somebody to help.
or alternativly, try these
https://www.buckandhickman.com/find/product-is-883...
if you look in product attributes you'll see these are fully threaded.
phillpot said:
Ingenious, have you actually done that?
I like using "Nylok" nuts, could prove a little trickier as these couldn't be wound on by hand past the hole?
Would have to be quite a small hole, minor diameter of an M8 bolt is only 6.65mm
On my to do list as A) I seem buy a lot of tvrs and B) I always need to take the runners off to lower the seat as I'm tall and when I sell I need to put the runners back on (aka always a pain in the ass) I like using "Nylok" nuts, could prove a little trickier as these couldn't be wound on by hand past the hole?
Would have to be quite a small hole, minor diameter of an M8 bolt is only 6.65mm
Another option is to cut a screw slot in the end of thread.
Alan Whitaker said:
Hi All
Bugger the stainless why not just weld the bolts in the rail and be done with it, Bolt up and dose with sealer.
Alan
Because we don't all have a welder!Bugger the stainless why not just weld the bolts in the rail and be done with it, Bolt up and dose with sealer.
Alan
Alan 1209 said:
if you look in product attributes you'll see these are fully threaded.
Yes, but far too short at 25mm!and I can't be arsed to go all through their website to see if they do 50mm fully threaded
I needed to raise my seat an inch (duck desease...arse too close to ground!) so made up four threaded bobbins in alloy and used long full thread stainless 'allen' screws from above (from a specialist and waxed to obviate corrosion) so the bobbins are locked tighly to the seat rails. The worry for me was the floor was very thin (the floors appear to have been stiffened a bit after the S1) and there was already some cracking near the mountings so I repaired that then bonded approx 3" square pieces of stainless sheet either side of the grp floor . Set the seat in place, marked and cut the bolts to the right length then fitted stainless nyloks.
This was all part of a pretty serious amount of work to a drivers seat which was completely collapsed when I bought the car. I have photos somewhere of the drivers seat base being a poly bag full of (wet) newspaper!
This was all part of a pretty serious amount of work to a drivers seat which was completely collapsed when I bought the car. I have photos somewhere of the drivers seat base being a poly bag full of (wet) newspaper!
As my refurbished seats are still hidden away it will be at least 6 months before I visit this work. But purely on thinking about the problem...
Why not just angle grind/saw/file off 2 opposite edges of the hex head, so that it fully drops into the channel.
Or if its already doing that & spinning round, then use mild steel over sized penny washers & fold 2 opposite sides upwards over the hex flats so that they will wedge into the channel.
But flush & away from the upper moving section.
TerryB
Why not just angle grind/saw/file off 2 opposite edges of the hex head, so that it fully drops into the channel.
Or if its already doing that & spinning round, then use mild steel over sized penny washers & fold 2 opposite sides upwards over the hex flats so that they will wedge into the channel.
But flush & away from the upper moving section.
TerryB
Plenty of alternative ideas but I like mine because bolts are positively held in place, drop the seat in, bolts pop through floor, nuts (and sealer) on, job done.
No fannying around wedgeing or holding anything
It does, of course, lift the seat slightly, may be an issue if you look down on people like Ed China and Richard Osman!
How about plan S ?
Use stainless bolts that are too long, put 3 nuts on the bottom. Tighten the bottom two against each other so that you can use them to hold the bolt and stop it spinning while you do up the top bolt against the floor.
Finally remove the two lower nuts and cut off the excess with an angle grinder (pref cordless) or hacksaw.
Saves making anything and bolts are cheap.
I do however like the bar with the thread in but shouldn't that be stainless too ?
Use stainless bolts that are too long, put 3 nuts on the bottom. Tighten the bottom two against each other so that you can use them to hold the bolt and stop it spinning while you do up the top bolt against the floor.
Finally remove the two lower nuts and cut off the excess with an angle grinder (pref cordless) or hacksaw.
Saves making anything and bolts are cheap.
I do however like the bar with the thread in but shouldn't that be stainless too ?
Buzzlt said:
How about plan S.................... ?
I like a re-useable system Got S seats in my Taimar and until find all the water leaks seats are out rather frequently to dry out the carpets!
Buzzlt said:
I do however like the bar with the thread in but shouldn't that be stainless too ?
Too heavy alluminium much easy to cut, drill and tap (and cheaper!)
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