Mirror, signal, manoeuvre
Discussion
It seems to be just exactly that, in that order. It doesn't seem to matter if the manoeuvre is dangerous.
I was driving on the M8 today, in lane 2, at a safe distance but keeping pace with the car in front and I and we were overtaking some cars in lane 1. I only had to overtake a silly wee car then a lorry and it would have been safe to pull back in to lane 1. True to form, the driver of the wee car, indicated and pulled straight out front of me in the same breath but didn't accelerate. This caused me to slow down to its pace with the safe distance gone.
Surely it should be "mirror, if there's nothing approaching you, signal manoeuvre"
or at the very least
"Mirror, take stock of what you see, decide if what is in your mind is dangerous to you or other road users, if there is absolutely no danger and then, and only then, signal, look again and manoeuvre.
I was driving on the M8 today, in lane 2, at a safe distance but keeping pace with the car in front and I and we were overtaking some cars in lane 1. I only had to overtake a silly wee car then a lorry and it would have been safe to pull back in to lane 1. True to form, the driver of the wee car, indicated and pulled straight out front of me in the same breath but didn't accelerate. This caused me to slow down to its pace with the safe distance gone.
Surely it should be "mirror, if there's nothing approaching you, signal manoeuvre"
or at the very least
"Mirror, take stock of what you see, decide if what is in your mind is dangerous to you or other road users, if there is absolutely no danger and then, and only then, signal, look again and manoeuvre.
Unfortunately a lot of people seem to think that signal = right of way to pull into your path, regardless of speed difference.
I'd hazard a guess that driver of wee car didn't register the lorry or the fact that it would need to be passed until very late on, giving them little time to assess the situation in their mirrors (if they used them at all)
I'd hazard a guess that driver of wee car didn't register the lorry or the fact that it would need to be passed until very late on, giving them little time to assess the situation in their mirrors (if they used them at all)
That is the basic version, what should be tought is this.
http://www.stephensdrivingschool.co.uk/ipsga/ipsga...
http://www.stephensdrivingschool.co.uk/ipsga/ipsga...
ModernAndy said:
Were you travelling at the speed limit and the car pulled out doing a 'slow speed'? I.e. Significantly under 70mph in a 70mph zone?
It was on a busy stretch of motorway so was travelling at the limit, I recon the wee car was doing about 55 - 60 as it didn't get past the truck (probably limited) very quickly at all. If I were tramping on a bit, I wouldn't have made this post.I drove from Glasgow to Edinburgh and back today which is quite unusual for me - the overall standard of driving by some people is shocking - was particularly annoyed when an idiot in a red 02 x type started tailgating me at 70mph on the M8 when clearly it was nose to tail in front of me - he then undertook and managed to find a gap 5 cars ahead...it's times like that you want the police to be about.
I taught my kids and others whom I taught to drive, that it was:
Mirror ; Signal; check; manoeuvre. I did the IAM test many years ago and Police basic test as well. Check and double check is always safe. I agree with Campbells dad and always assume every one else is an idiot and tray them accordingly. We all make mistakes in driving every day, so its best to do your best.
However, some people seem incapable of driving safely or considerately. I have long advocated compulsory re testing every five years for everyone.
My biggest concern i the number of drivers who seem utterly oblivious to anyone and everyone on the road. I saw an Ambulance on the M90 yesterday lights and sirens on struggling to pass a car who just seemed to sit in front of it for at least 20 seconds. My mates who are doctors who frequently travel with critically ill kids, tell me the same story every time they are out in an ambulance trying to get kids to hospital. Those cars should be videoed and the drivers prosecuted for a Section 3. It is about time the sanctimonious incompetents are charged with Section 3 more liberally just the same way as those terrible drivers who speed.
Mirror ; Signal; check; manoeuvre. I did the IAM test many years ago and Police basic test as well. Check and double check is always safe. I agree with Campbells dad and always assume every one else is an idiot and tray them accordingly. We all make mistakes in driving every day, so its best to do your best.
However, some people seem incapable of driving safely or considerately. I have long advocated compulsory re testing every five years for everyone.
My biggest concern i the number of drivers who seem utterly oblivious to anyone and everyone on the road. I saw an Ambulance on the M90 yesterday lights and sirens on struggling to pass a car who just seemed to sit in front of it for at least 20 seconds. My mates who are doctors who frequently travel with critically ill kids, tell me the same story every time they are out in an ambulance trying to get kids to hospital. Those cars should be videoed and the drivers prosecuted for a Section 3. It is about time the sanctimonious incompetents are charged with Section 3 more liberally just the same way as those terrible drivers who speed.
You're right about people getting in the way of the emergency services. I remember once seeing a copper with blues and twos on in the rear view mirror some distance away on the Edinburgh bypass. I pulled in and it must have been a full 2 minutes before they were able to pass me due to the traffic in the outside lane being oblivious to their presence.
One so appreciates those drivers who having been given 5 orange indications will STILL accelerate to block you in despite the rather obvious fact that you are closing on 48 tons of steel and as there is a suitable gap will be taking advantage to pull out pass then pull in again...ooh no...
Standards of driving are generally pretty high in the UK, people make mistakes, some people could do with more training and some will never be fully competent on the roads, but you only have to spend a few years in Saudi Arabia to realise what dangerous and poor driving really is. I love coming home and being able to enjoy driving without genuine fear of being killed at any given moment :-)
Slightly O/T but a Scottish Highland issue. Looking forward seems to be a problem here. I've nearly had two head on's with cars on the wrong side of the road in the past week. Foreigners of course, here on hols, who get used to miles of single track roads, then when confronted with a two lane road... 'revert to type'. One of them even started to shout at me as we faced each other, stationary, until his mrs in the passenger seat, realising his mistake, shut him up, pointing to the left.
Careful if you are up this way!
Careful if you are up this way!
Mojocvh said:
One so appreciates those drivers who having been given 5 orange indications will STILL accelerate to block you in despite the rather obvious fact that you are closing on 48 tons of steel and as there is a suitable gap will be taking advantage to pull out pass then pull in again...ooh no...
That's a whole different topic. If the traffic in lane 2 is moving faster than that in lane 1, it is not safe to pull into the flow of traffic unless you can reasonably accelerate to the same pace as the approaching traffic. Nomatter how many times the indicators flash, there is no acceptable time to pull out into a space which puts other road users in danger ie drastically reducing the approaching vehicles braking distance by your action.Having indicators flash gives nobody right of way.
GetCarter said:
Slightly O/T but a Scottish Highland issue. Looking forward seems to be a problem here. I've nearly had two head on's with cars on the wrong side of the road in the past week. Foreigners of course, here on hols, who get used to miles of single track roads, then when confronted with a two lane road... 'revert to type'. One of them even started to shout at me as we faced each other, stationary, until his mrs in the passenger seat, realising his mistake, shut him up, pointing to the left.
Careful if you are up this way!
To my shame I once did this in Tuscany after many miles on a single track road Careful if you are up this way!
My wife thought I was mucking about driving on the wrong side of the road for about 200 yards before pointing out my mistake in a calm and ordered manner
If you see someone indicating I assume (like driving in Germany) that the driver will move out unless I would be forced to do more than just back off the throttle. Similarly I do the same. I'll move out if it's safe at that point, yet people still insist on thinking people need to be "let out". These people seem to put the foot down as if they can't have someone move out in front.
The people who are reasonable never find this a problem and I don't find a problem with people doing it so long as I don't need to brake.
The people who are reasonable never find this a problem and I don't find a problem with people doing it so long as I don't need to brake.
Maybe its my age and when I was taught to drive but I treat every journey as a constant, variable risk assessment.
Here's a wee example, very soon I'll be driving to Blackpool for a few days away with the family. I'll be heading down the M6 and driving within the limits of the law. I may want to pull out to pass a slower truck or something and will look in the mirror and assess whether it will be safe to pull out and pass. Now, I normally drive a 507BHP BMW M5 so am easily ably to pull out, accelerate, pass and pull back in without effecting the approaching traffic.
I will be driving the family car, a 1.6L Diesel Citroen Xsara Picasso, this car will easily do 70MPH but will take an eon to get there so performing the same manoeuvre will pose a much larger risk.
I was always taught that it was wrong to perform a manoeuvre which causes other road users to alter speed or direction.
Here's a wee example, very soon I'll be driving to Blackpool for a few days away with the family. I'll be heading down the M6 and driving within the limits of the law. I may want to pull out to pass a slower truck or something and will look in the mirror and assess whether it will be safe to pull out and pass. Now, I normally drive a 507BHP BMW M5 so am easily ably to pull out, accelerate, pass and pull back in without effecting the approaching traffic.
I will be driving the family car, a 1.6L Diesel Citroen Xsara Picasso, this car will easily do 70MPH but will take an eon to get there so performing the same manoeuvre will pose a much larger risk.
I was always taught that it was wrong to perform a manoeuvre which causes other road users to alter speed or direction.
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