20 MPH Speed Limits in Edinburgh - Help needed
Discussion
In short the scum at the council are now trying to impose draconian speed limits across the city. This will make driving in Edinburgh even worse. Once they start doing it they will just expand it to everywhere in the city. The difference between the original consultation of the idea was only a few hundred in favour. They are doing another consultation on the proposals. Now is time to say no to these proposals.
Here is the link.
http://www.edinburgh.gov.uk/info/20089/roads_and_p...
It only takes a couple of minutes to fill in but remember the council suggests that 20mph takes 25 seconds per mile.
Finally - do you want 20mph limits? Is that how you want to live? If you feel like me then please stand up and say no to the council.
Here is the link.
http://www.edinburgh.gov.uk/info/20089/roads_and_p...
It only takes a couple of minutes to fill in but remember the council suggests that 20mph takes 25 seconds per mile.
Finally - do you want 20mph limits? Is that how you want to live? If you feel like me then please stand up and say no to the council.
I think you'll find that 20 mph ADDS 25 seconds per mile compared to 30 mph.
That notwithstanding, looking at the language of the report, and the results of previous surveys, that it's a done deal, however stupid it may seem.
They claim that cyclists will be prosecuted for speeding in the 20 mph zones, but as that can't be done with a camera, and the police have better things to do, I'm not going to hold my breath on that one.
No proposals at all for variable speed limits. 20 mph through the Meadows throughout the night? Why? 20mph up Abbey Hill to Princes Street throughout the night? Where are the crowds of pedestrians,children and kittens at that time of night?
I've chucked my tuppence worth at the questionnaire, but I can't see any likleyhood of that affecting the final outcome.
That notwithstanding, looking at the language of the report, and the results of previous surveys, that it's a done deal, however stupid it may seem.
They claim that cyclists will be prosecuted for speeding in the 20 mph zones, but as that can't be done with a camera, and the police have better things to do, I'm not going to hold my breath on that one.
No proposals at all for variable speed limits. 20 mph through the Meadows throughout the night? Why? 20mph up Abbey Hill to Princes Street throughout the night? Where are the crowds of pedestrians,children and kittens at that time of night?
I've chucked my tuppence worth at the questionnaire, but I can't see any likleyhood of that affecting the final outcome.
Cynical comment to follow....
The trams take longer than the bus or a car to get to the airport, the first i heard of the 20mph was after the timings for the trams was released. I wouldnt put it past them to introduce this to slow down the traffic to make the tram times more appealing.
marcus
The trams take longer than the bus or a car to get to the airport, the first i heard of the 20mph was after the timings for the trams was released. I wouldnt put it past them to introduce this to slow down the traffic to make the tram times more appealing.
marcus
flyboyben said:
Aberdeen has had 20mph speed limits in the city centre for a few years now. I haven't heard too many complaints about inconveniences. It is a fairly small area though
I wonder how many people actually realise that Union Street and some of the surrounding streets are 20mph though.marcus1875 said:
Cynical comment to follow....
The trams take longer than the bus or a car to get to the airport, the first i heard of the 20mph was after the timings for the trams was released. I wouldnt put it past them to introduce this to slow down the traffic to make the tram times more appealing.
marcus
My immediate thought too. They can't improve the tram therefore we will worsen the alternatives.The trams take longer than the bus or a car to get to the airport, the first i heard of the 20mph was after the timings for the trams was released. I wouldnt put it past them to introduce this to slow down the traffic to make the tram times more appealing.
marcus
marcus1875 said:
Cynical comment to follow....
The trams take longer than the bus or a car to get to the airport, the first i heard of the 20mph was after the timings for the trams was released. I wouldnt put it past them to introduce this to slow down the traffic to make the tram times more appealing.
marcus
That's exactly what I was thinking about too. Alos, that's a much wider coverage of 20mph zones than I'd expected The trams take longer than the bus or a car to get to the airport, the first i heard of the 20mph was after the timings for the trams was released. I wouldnt put it past them to introduce this to slow down the traffic to make the tram times more appealing.
marcus
I didn't hold back on that "Extra comments" box... This is anothjer stupid idea designed to batter our wallets etc. They want to ty and turn Edinbrugh into some sort of Cosmopolitan city, just look at George street during the festival. Alfresco dining in a glass box in the middle of a road... becuase it's just like Milan 
They couldn't get a congestion charge in so now it's an exercise in making it such a nightmare to get around Edinbrguh we don't bother trying.
I'm just waiting for the raft of speed cameras and average cameras to go up all over the city. Going to have to stock up on black spray paint, not that I'd use it to paint over their lenses of course...
They couldn't get a congestion charge in so now it's an exercise in making it such a nightmare to get around Edinbrguh we don't bother trying.
I'm just waiting for the raft of speed cameras and average cameras to go up all over the city. Going to have to stock up on black spray paint, not that I'd use it to paint over their lenses of course...
If the council wants to raise revenue from automated "policing" of drivers, they need to fire up a whole bunch of red light cameras.
These proposals will do nothing to manage peak time traffic, and will just slow the city down at all other times too. The Council should take its budget for smug "twenty's plenty" signs and allocate it to something that will actually benefit the city.
These proposals will do nothing to manage peak time traffic, and will just slow the city down at all other times too. The Council should take its budget for smug "twenty's plenty" signs and allocate it to something that will actually benefit the city.
I don't particularly mind local side streets being 20mph. It's the reduction of many main roads to 20mph that I have a real problem with. Roads like Queen Street (a four lane main arterial route used by nearly all central traffic to bypass George St and Princess St) or Leith Walk (just about the widest boulevard you can imagine with great peripheral visibility).
If you look at the map, everything in dark blue is a main road that is proposed to reduce to 20mph:
http://edinburghcouncilmaps.info/transport/20mphco...
I agree that it looks like done deal, patricularly given the apparent 67% support from those surveyed (although I'm not convinced people really appreciated what they were agreeing with). However, the only hope of changing that (or at least getting some modifications to the scheme) is to respond to the consultation.
For my part, as well as lisiting a few streets I had a particular issue with, I just made the point that with the exception of busy shopping streets nearly all main roads should in my view remain subject to a 30mph limit, because people need to be able to get into and out of the city efficiently.
There is also the wider point that drivers need to continually adjust their speed as part of driving to the conditions in any event and can (and should) already do that within the existing 30mph limit.
Furthermore, the effect of 20mph limits in other cities in the UK has not yet been clearly established, with some evidence that 20mph limits may increase accident rates and emissions, so the scheme is arguably premature.
If you look at the map, everything in dark blue is a main road that is proposed to reduce to 20mph:
http://edinburghcouncilmaps.info/transport/20mphco...
I agree that it looks like done deal, patricularly given the apparent 67% support from those surveyed (although I'm not convinced people really appreciated what they were agreeing with). However, the only hope of changing that (or at least getting some modifications to the scheme) is to respond to the consultation.
For my part, as well as lisiting a few streets I had a particular issue with, I just made the point that with the exception of busy shopping streets nearly all main roads should in my view remain subject to a 30mph limit, because people need to be able to get into and out of the city efficiently.
There is also the wider point that drivers need to continually adjust their speed as part of driving to the conditions in any event and can (and should) already do that within the existing 30mph limit.
Furthermore, the effect of 20mph limits in other cities in the UK has not yet been clearly established, with some evidence that 20mph limits may increase accident rates and emissions, so the scheme is arguably premature.
JK55 said:
Finally - do you want 20mph limits? Is that how you want to live? If you feel like me then please stand up and say no to the council.
I am actually an advocate for 20mph (30km/h) speed limits in city centres when done right. Needless to say, that proposal is not.There are a couple of test projects in mainland Europe, for example the Netherlands, which are very successful and I do see the benefits. The idea is to get rid of all traffic light, as many traffic signs as possible, bike lanes, bus lanes etc and make a shared space. The benefits have been proven to be as following:
- Because you don't have to read all kind of sometimes obscure signs you spend more time paying attention to other cars and pedestrians and bikes ... things that actually matter. As a result, accidents have been significantly reduced.
- If accidents do happen, people are not insured as badly. The difference between hitting a child at 20 to 30 is actually quite a lot. (Broken arm vs. intensive unit kind of thing.)
- Pollution is greatly reduced, because there are no traffic lights, people don't stop and role off all the time.
- Reduced stress. Because you drive at a more constant speed, but you do drive rather than sit in front of red lights, people are less stressed.
- You arrive faster. You might go slower, but you go ... so in the end you do arrive at your destination quicker then if you would be racing between red lights.
Which brings us back to what Edinburgh wants to do ... simply dropping the speed limit, this is not going to cut it. Probably not making things much worse either, but certainly not improving things. Just p...ing off people. Which I secretly believe is their intention. Remember, Edinburgh wanted to introduce a congestion charge. Ever since that failed, everything they do seems to be designed to make traffic deliberately worse.
I also noticed that Edinburgh set to be first Scottish city to permit motorbikes in bus lanes although I'm unsure exactly why they're making this change.
AGK said:
People in this country are too angry on the roads to be able to drive with a bit of give and take.
Really? Have you ever tried driving in France or Italy ... or dare I say it India???I have moved to Scotland via a few other European countries (I am originally from Austria) and trust me, drivers in the UK are very considerate by comparison. In Germany for example you would die of old age before anybody would let you out of a T-junction.
DottyMR2 said:
I didn't hold back on that "Extra comments" box... This is anothjer stupid idea designed to batter our wallets etc. They want to ty and turn Edinbrugh into some sort of Cosmopolitan city, just look at George street during the festival. Alfresco dining in a glass box in the middle of a road... becuase it's just like Milan
I bet a lot of people don't know that the license for the closure of George Street is actually 18 months, not just the month of the festival like last year. This means the Alfresco dining will be around until at least next Christmas. The idea is to make it permanent, according to a friend that owns a hotel on the street.Gassing Station | Scotland | Top of Page | What's New | My Stuff