Alternative radiator
Discussion
Yes, I'll need to squash the pipe to make room for the bonnet as it sweeps down on opening. Plan A is to simply squash the pipe (it's got a coil of soft wire in it so it'll hold it's shape when squashed); I may also have to put something hard around the pipe to protect it from the sliding action as the bonnet pivots in an arc. Plan B is a letterbox shaped duct but I'm hoping I can get away without that - but as you say it does solve the pipe length issue!
I've got the engine running again now, it turns out that the voltage spikes at the ECU were nothing to do with the fans but instead were the effects of the flapper injectors vs the hotwire ones I had before.
Fan current on low speed hits 32Amps on start up so I definitely need high current relays for the high speed setting. Steady state current draw is about 14Amps on low speed - but the airflow from the Ford fan is huge compared to the TVR original even on low speed. Those values were engine off and 11V at the battery so it'll be more with the alternator running. I am wiring it direct to the battery and keeping the leads short. This is a trace of fan voltage and current:
Below is a graph trace from Megasquirt while running the engine on my drive with the bonnet off. It's time in seconds along the bottom so about 23 minutes of engine idling from a cold start. It shows engine coolant temp in green, air intake temp in red and the fan cutting in and out in purple. The initial engine temp fluctuations before the fan cuts in are the thermostat opening, allowing cold coolant in from the radiator circuit.
I had the fan set to come on at 90DegC for the first event then 95 DegC for the second and third times. It shows the air intake temperature increasing when the fan is running so it looks like the hot air is recirculating around the radiator within the nosecone. I suspect I'll have to put baffles around the periphery of the radiator to stop this recirculation but that would also reduce the airflow into the engine bay at speed; so I'll wait until I've driven the car in hot weather before I decide what to do. I'll also try and get the air intake further forward.
One of the problems with megasquirt is it gives you too much information and starts you worrying!
Fan current on low speed hits 32Amps on start up so I definitely need high current relays for the high speed setting. Steady state current draw is about 14Amps on low speed - but the airflow from the Ford fan is huge compared to the TVR original even on low speed. Those values were engine off and 11V at the battery so it'll be more with the alternator running. I am wiring it direct to the battery and keeping the leads short. This is a trace of fan voltage and current:
Below is a graph trace from Megasquirt while running the engine on my drive with the bonnet off. It's time in seconds along the bottom so about 23 minutes of engine idling from a cold start. It shows engine coolant temp in green, air intake temp in red and the fan cutting in and out in purple. The initial engine temp fluctuations before the fan cuts in are the thermostat opening, allowing cold coolant in from the radiator circuit.
I had the fan set to come on at 90DegC for the first event then 95 DegC for the second and third times. It shows the air intake temperature increasing when the fan is running so it looks like the hot air is recirculating around the radiator within the nosecone. I suspect I'll have to put baffles around the periphery of the radiator to stop this recirculation but that would also reduce the airflow into the engine bay at speed; so I'll wait until I've driven the car in hot weather before I decide what to do. I'll also try and get the air intake further forward.
One of the problems with megasquirt is it gives you too much information and starts you worrying!
Edited by The Hatter on Tuesday 24th January 21:27
The car is back on the road now, seems OK so far!
The spoiler went back on without cutting too much off
70Amp relay for the fan fast speed and a 30A for slow...
Battery connection through a race/kit car fuse box; added advantage of all the circuits on the car are now fused (except the starter cable):
Inlet pipe is crushed by the bonnet but I'll monitor it and see if it gets damaged:
Misson accomplished!
The spoiler went back on without cutting too much off
70Amp relay for the fan fast speed and a 30A for slow...
Battery connection through a race/kit car fuse box; added advantage of all the circuits on the car are now fused (except the starter cable):
Inlet pipe is crushed by the bonnet but I'll monitor it and see if it gets damaged:
Misson accomplished!
For me this is what its all about ...Modern solutions to old problems...Well done that man...
Just a thought....I know you probably don't want a break in the air hose but couldn't you make a coupling from a piece of plastic waste pipe and warm it with a heat gun to flatten it where need?....
Keep up the good work...
Ziga
Just a thought....I know you probably don't want a break in the air hose but couldn't you make a coupling from a piece of plastic waste pipe and warm it with a heat gun to flatten it where need?....
Keep up the good work...
Ziga
The Hatter said:
The car is back on the road now, seems OK so far!
Inlet pipe is crushed by the bonnet but I'll monitor it and see if it gets damaged:
How about routing the inlet pipe below the horizontal fiberglass section, is there anything blocking that route ? Inlet pipe is crushed by the bonnet but I'll monitor it and see if it gets damaged:
or as Ziga suggested , using flatish pipe like
I might put a flat duct of some sort in there, but I'm conscious of restricting the airflow - the duct that is on there at the moment springs back to a more round shape when I close the bonnet. I'm thinking that I'll just see how it goes; if it tears then I get unfiltered air into the engine, so not too big a deal as long as I look out for it.
That's the one Adam, although you need to make sure you get the rad hoses with their quick connects and all the mounting rubbers. I actually bought a used rad to play around with and get all the pipes/rubbers, then bought a new rad (chinese - £45!) and used that for the final fit up. I'll do a list at some point of exactly what I used.
One word of caution though... the weather isn't hot at the moment and I've yet to give the car a serious work out! Ideally I need to do a high speed run up a hill in hot weather to see what the cooling is like under those conditions.
That's the one Adam, although you need to make sure you get the rad hoses with their quick connects and all the mounting rubbers. I actually bought a used rad to play around with and get all the pipes/rubbers, then bought a new rad (chinese - £45!) and used that for the final fit up. I'll do a list at some point of exactly what I used.
One word of caution though... the weather isn't hot at the moment and I've yet to give the car a serious work out! Ideally I need to do a high speed run up a hill in hot weather to see what the cooling is like under those conditions.
Just to conclude this thread, the car has run all summer with no problems at all including trips to the EVO triangle in North Wales and another trip to the Lake District. It's been driven in torrential downpours and very wet roads with no detrimental water pulled into the intake. It also survived a grass autotest in July on a very hot day, with lots of revs in 1st gear and not alot of forward motion!
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6Z6PgE7vKQc
Inlet air temps are a lot lower too so idling in traffic and hot starts are not a problem. A very successful mod, certainly worthwhile. The only downside is having to trim away some of the front spoiler to clear the rad; other than that it's all reversible- if anyone was that way inclined.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6Z6PgE7vKQc
Inlet air temps are a lot lower too so idling in traffic and hot starts are not a problem. A very successful mod, certainly worthwhile. The only downside is having to trim away some of the front spoiler to clear the rad; other than that it's all reversible- if anyone was that way inclined.
Funnily, to add to all the stuff done or waiting to be done on mine, the Rad also appears to be weeping.
I sent an email to these:
https://www.aaronradiator.co.uk/
They came back with the following only a few hours later:
"If the rad is copper and brass the cost will be £395 + VAT.
Turnaround is about a week".
There are other local ones, but I was curious of a ballpark figure.
I sent an email to these:
https://www.aaronradiator.co.uk/
They came back with the following only a few hours later:
"If the rad is copper and brass the cost will be £395 + VAT.
Turnaround is about a week".
There are other local ones, but I was curious of a ballpark figure.
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