Test Pilots & Time Wasters
Discussion
Its not just private sellers you can have problems with as a buyer (sorry, I know this thread started from the sellers perspective).
I was thinking of changing my 321bhp M roadster for a TVR. Had never driven one. So I went to my local dealer in a town well known for a rowing event to arrange a test drive. They couldn't have been more difficult. The response was 'our preference is that you decide specifically which of our second hand models you wish to purchase, then we will allow you to drive it'. I replied that I would not know whether a TVR was for me without driving one and thus could not decide specifically which car I wished to purchase. To which he responded 'Well sir, we have rather more people interested in test drives than actually buying the vehicles, and I'm not being rude, but are you accustomed to the power'. He already knew what I drove.
Eventually, two visits later, I did get a drive from them in a Chimaera 450.
And I bought a Griff from another dealer. And I don't go to the original dealer for servicing.
Shame really. I had thought this whole TVR thing would be like a club of enthusiasts, with the dealers being keen to help and put themselves out in addition to wanting to make some money.
Sadly the two dealers I have come into contact were 1) the local one, unhelpful and 2) the one I bought the Griff from, incompetent to the point of being dangerous.
Which reminds me, I need to phone the dealer principal of the latter.....
I was thinking of changing my 321bhp M roadster for a TVR. Had never driven one. So I went to my local dealer in a town well known for a rowing event to arrange a test drive. They couldn't have been more difficult. The response was 'our preference is that you decide specifically which of our second hand models you wish to purchase, then we will allow you to drive it'. I replied that I would not know whether a TVR was for me without driving one and thus could not decide specifically which car I wished to purchase. To which he responded 'Well sir, we have rather more people interested in test drives than actually buying the vehicles, and I'm not being rude, but are you accustomed to the power'. He already knew what I drove.
Eventually, two visits later, I did get a drive from them in a Chimaera 450.
And I bought a Griff from another dealer. And I don't go to the original dealer for servicing.
Shame really. I had thought this whole TVR thing would be like a club of enthusiasts, with the dealers being keen to help and put themselves out in addition to wanting to make some money.
Sadly the two dealers I have come into contact were 1) the local one, unhelpful and 2) the one I bought the Griff from, incompetent to the point of being dangerous.
Which reminds me, I need to phone the dealer principal of the latter.....
Just because they turn up in a nice car, also doesn't mean that they have money - back in my younger poorer days, my brother & I used to go test-driving some weekends when we were bored.
What we would do is dress up smart, persuade someone we knew to let us drive their expensive car all of 100 yards around the corner to the garage of choice (Alfa, Porsche etc) on our 3rd party insurance. We would then breeze in & ask for some test drives, as "daddy" was thinking of buying us new cars (some chance)
Often as not, we'd be allowed off in various cars to drive things we thought we would never be able to afford.
Amusingly enough, years later, when I could actually afford a new 911 Carrera 4, I turned up at the Porsche garage dressed pretty scruffily, but with the the money burning a hole in my pocket, the salesmen just didn't want to know & were arrogant & condescending. After 20 minutes of this, I walked out & ended up buying a TVR and a Subaru - haven't regretted it yet!
cheers,
Craig
What we would do is dress up smart, persuade someone we knew to let us drive their expensive car all of 100 yards around the corner to the garage of choice (Alfa, Porsche etc) on our 3rd party insurance. We would then breeze in & ask for some test drives, as "daddy" was thinking of buying us new cars (some chance)
Often as not, we'd be allowed off in various cars to drive things we thought we would never be able to afford.
Amusingly enough, years later, when I could actually afford a new 911 Carrera 4, I turned up at the Porsche garage dressed pretty scruffily, but with the the money burning a hole in my pocket, the salesmen just didn't want to know & were arrogant & condescending. After 20 minutes of this, I walked out & ended up buying a TVR and a Subaru - haven't regretted it yet!
cheers,
Craig
Looking for my first real company car once, went to the BMW dealer in Warwick to check out what I can get - at the time could have afforded a 320i/325i so not at the lower end of the market. However, went to the dealer looking scruffy and probably smelly (night out before). Promptly was ignored for over 30 minutes. All the sales people turned their noses up at me and refused to give me the time of day.
The only reason why I was sticking around was that everyone was raving about the cars so I thought I would see for myself. Eventually when there was NO ONE else around they would talk to me. First question was "and which car is yours then sir?" Funny thing was that I had a hire Merc E class a the as my Rover had broken down - brand new on a new plate and a decent spec (hire company didnt have anything less...
).
Unsuprisingly then they couldnt do enough for me. Seeing as I was completely pi**ed of by this point I thought that I would string them along. Anyway, sales guy keeps calling me to follow up. Eventually the sales manager starts calling me - so I give it to him with the full two barrels - "I will never buy a BMW from you or any other dealer because of the utter contempt that you paid me while I was at your premises. Nothing, not a dicky bird - you cannot treat customers like this". Unsuprising the sales manager was very appologetic and could do enough for me - But, as a result I will never buy a BMW - sad but true.....
Went to visit a Merc dealer about 18 months ago - completely different. Very accomodating and very nice chaps. Didnt buy a car, but always very helpful. Total contrast to BMW...... I wonder how many other people have done the same.
Cheers,
Paul
P.S. And yes Ted, no names, but this was a few years ago and the dealer has changed management now, so different all around.
The only reason why I was sticking around was that everyone was raving about the cars so I thought I would see for myself. Eventually when there was NO ONE else around they would talk to me. First question was "and which car is yours then sir?" Funny thing was that I had a hire Merc E class a the as my Rover had broken down - brand new on a new plate and a decent spec (hire company didnt have anything less...
). Unsuprisingly then they couldnt do enough for me. Seeing as I was completely pi**ed of by this point I thought that I would string them along. Anyway, sales guy keeps calling me to follow up. Eventually the sales manager starts calling me - so I give it to him with the full two barrels - "I will never buy a BMW from you or any other dealer because of the utter contempt that you paid me while I was at your premises. Nothing, not a dicky bird - you cannot treat customers like this". Unsuprising the sales manager was very appologetic and could do enough for me - But, as a result I will never buy a BMW - sad but true.....
Went to visit a Merc dealer about 18 months ago - completely different. Very accomodating and very nice chaps. Didnt buy a car, but always very helpful. Total contrast to BMW...... I wonder how many other people have done the same.
Cheers,
Paul
P.S. And yes Ted, no names, but this was a few years ago and the dealer has changed management now, so different all around.
True to a certain extent Ted. My experience with dealer no 1 was one chap - things improved when I spoke to a different chap who said 'just give us a call or drop in after Christmas and we'll sort you out with a drive' - returned after Christmas to see the original bloke again and was back to square one - had to recount the conversation again etc etc..
The problem is when there are only three people who work in sales, if even if only one is unhelpful that's still a pretty big percentage of the whole..
Dealer no 2 - my experiences are not to do with a particular individual. I won't bore you with the detail again, but in summary, it appears their processes and controls are not working and this is far more worrying than someone in sales having an 'off' day.
The problem is when there are only three people who work in sales, if even if only one is unhelpful that's still a pretty big percentage of the whole..
Dealer no 2 - my experiences are not to do with a particular individual. I won't bore you with the detail again, but in summary, it appears their processes and controls are not working and this is far more worrying than someone in sales having an 'off' day.
As someone going through the buying and selling process at the same time i can see each side.
I do find it funny that i am treated like a time waster at dealers when i have the cash sitting waiting at home. Even when i tell them i already have a TVR they still think i am wasting their time coz young and scruffy!!!
But hay.... a Griff will be mine at some point!!
I do find it funny that i am treated like a time waster at dealers when i have the cash sitting waiting at home. Even when i tell them i already have a TVR they still think i am wasting their time coz young and scruffy!!!
But hay.... a Griff will be mine at some point!!
I've not had many cars but when I've come to buy or sell my cars privately I've had no problems either way.
When selling, I've never offerred a test drive to the buyer and they've never asked! They were happy with a demonstration with me driving the cars under a variety of different conditions and on a suitable cross-section of roads. Personally I'd never buy a car without a test drive but there you go. I've not been refused a test drive or had any seller get funny about it.
The only (minor) problems I've had have been when I came to buying a TVR from TVR dealers. I focussed on 2 fairly local dealers. Both were very helpful, informative (though their information was contradictory and in one case incorrect), and both allowed me test drives of their Cerbera's without any hassle. However, although I had sufficient funds to buy a Cerbera and had budgetted for more than enough to purchase one at dealer prices, having left my details with specific instructions to let me know when cars came onto their books, neither ever bothered getting back to me.
Whilst my initial intention was to buy from a dealer, it turned out for the best. In the end I bought a Cerbera privately but using Rob Ingleby to check the car out. Now I've got a great car and paid a hell of a lot less than I would have through one of the said dealers. Their loss not mine in this case.
When selling, I've never offerred a test drive to the buyer and they've never asked! They were happy with a demonstration with me driving the cars under a variety of different conditions and on a suitable cross-section of roads. Personally I'd never buy a car without a test drive but there you go. I've not been refused a test drive or had any seller get funny about it.
The only (minor) problems I've had have been when I came to buying a TVR from TVR dealers. I focussed on 2 fairly local dealers. Both were very helpful, informative (though their information was contradictory and in one case incorrect), and both allowed me test drives of their Cerbera's without any hassle. However, although I had sufficient funds to buy a Cerbera and had budgetted for more than enough to purchase one at dealer prices, having left my details with specific instructions to let me know when cars came onto their books, neither ever bothered getting back to me.
Whilst my initial intention was to buy from a dealer, it turned out for the best. In the end I bought a Cerbera privately but using Rob Ingleby to check the car out. Now I've got a great car and paid a hell of a lot less than I would have through one of the said dealers. Their loss not mine in this case.
Just to add to the scruffs in crap cars 
... when I was in the market to buy my Chimaera, I paid a visit to a certain dealer that is no more in the South of Brum. Turned up in my old Citroen BX TD - distinctly off white in colour. The sales man looked me up and down, "TVRs are VERY powerful sir," he sneered...
I bought elsewhere and oh, they went bust
... when I was in the market to buy my Chimaera, I paid a visit to a certain dealer that is no more in the South of Brum. Turned up in my old Citroen BX TD - distinctly off white in colour. The sales man looked me up and down, "TVRs are VERY powerful sir," he sneered... I bought elsewhere and oh, they went bust
quote:
........ In the end I bought a Cerbera privately but using Rob Ingleby to check the car out. Now I've got a great car and paid a hell of a lot less than I would have through one of the said dealers. Their loss not mine in this case.
leszekg
Small world when I got Rob to send me pictures of an S I was interested in, he accidently sent one of the rear 3/4 view of a R reg Sage Cerbie, must be yours, always wondered who bought it. Very nice btw, still have a copy in 'my pictures' on the pc (sad I know).
Harry
quote:
Small world when I got Rob to send me pictures of an S I was interested in, he accidently sent one of the rear 3/4 view of a R reg Sage Cerbie, must be yours, always wondered who bought it. Very nice btw, still have a copy in 'my pictures' on the pc (sad I know).
Harry
Yes, that's mine. I talked to Rob at 'Back Home' last weekend and he seems to be doing very well. He didn't tell me he was trying to sell my car though
quote:
Looking for my first real company car once, went to the BMW dealer in Warwick to check out what I can get - at the time could have afforded a 320i/325i so not at the lower end of the market. However, went to the dealer looking scruffy and probably smelly (night out before). Promptly was ignored for over 30 minutes. All the sales people turned their noses up at me and refused to give me the time of day.
Similar thing happened to a friend of mine a couple of years ago. Walked into Park Lane BMW looking rather worse for wear on a Saturday morning wanting to buy a new M3. Couldn't get anyone to even say good morning to him apart from the secretary at the reception desk. Being the kind of guy he is, he got bored after about five minutes, walked over to the secretary, asked her the list price of the M3 with all the options, wrote out a cheque there & then. Told her to choose the colour & call him when it was in !!
Monday morning he gets a call at work from surprisingly enough the sales manager who promptly gets told to F**k off & to top it all he made them pay the secretary the sellers commission on the car before he accepted delivery !! Top bloke.
quote:
Similar thing happened to a friend of mine a couple of years ago. Walked into Park Lane BMW looking rather worse for wear on a Saturday morning wanting to buy a new M3. Couldn't get anyone to even say good morning to him apart from the secretary at the reception desk. Being the kind of guy he is, he got bored after about five minutes, walked over to the secretary, asked her the list price of the M3 with all the options, wrote out a cheque there & then. Told her to choose the colour & call him when it was in !!
Monday morning he gets a call at work from surprisingly enough the sales manager who promptly gets told to F**k off & to top it all he made them pay the secretary the sellers commission on the car before he accepted delivery !! Top bloke.
Great story Ross
John.
PS Spot the new name, getting paranoid about the world seeing my real name up there all the time.
>> Edited by JohnL on Wednesday 22 May 12:52
lol, superb.
It's all down to individuals who happen to be on duty that day though. Some are helpful, regular guys and others seem a little snooty. Just like some shop assistants that think they're above their station.
I was wondering around a Porsche dealer a few weeks ago, checking out the stock for about half an hour. They totally ignored me though. Must have been my jeans and tee appearance. Not to worry though, I had a good chat to one of the mechanics about the various merits of each model. Thoroughly decent chap! The guy knew exactly what he was talking about (obviously) and had plenty of time to spend chatting.
Previously I had a rather unhelpful sales guy on the phone. He never returned e-mails etc. Very annoying. In the end I spoke to another guy at the same dealer who turned out to be great - very friendly and down to earth, so I happily ordered my car from him. It just shows it's worth seeking out the better staff rather than just writing off an entire dealership due to one person.
Mind you, when it comes to collection time I'll be wearing my jeans and tee again. Might even wander around for a bit to see if they bother coming over to talk to me. Will be a nice feeling if I am ignored though. I'll just wander over and let them know I'm collecting my new pride and joy. He he!
It's all down to individuals who happen to be on duty that day though. Some are helpful, regular guys and others seem a little snooty. Just like some shop assistants that think they're above their station.
I was wondering around a Porsche dealer a few weeks ago, checking out the stock for about half an hour. They totally ignored me though. Must have been my jeans and tee appearance. Not to worry though, I had a good chat to one of the mechanics about the various merits of each model. Thoroughly decent chap! The guy knew exactly what he was talking about (obviously) and had plenty of time to spend chatting.
Previously I had a rather unhelpful sales guy on the phone. He never returned e-mails etc. Very annoying. In the end I spoke to another guy at the same dealer who turned out to be great - very friendly and down to earth, so I happily ordered my car from him. It just shows it's worth seeking out the better staff rather than just writing off an entire dealership due to one person.
Mind you, when it comes to collection time I'll be wearing my jeans and tee again. Might even wander around for a bit to see if they bother coming over to talk to me. Will be a nice feeling if I am ignored though. I'll just wander over and let them know I'm collecting my new pride and joy. He he!
I got the same thing when I went into a Porsche dealer. They ignored me for a while, and then when I did ask for some info it was given to me but in a very rude, demeanering way, as if to say I will give you the brochure etc (even though it was out of date and didn't have the C4S details that I actually wanted) but I know you can't afford one. He was so uninterested. I also had the same experience with BMW. I went with a mate of mine as he wanted to look at some 318 Coupes. They saw his car first and didn't really pay much attention. Saw my car, and he instantly livened up.
I keep thinking to myself, what is the problem? If they don't like what they do, they should get another job. And surely they must have realised that it doesn't amount to what you look/dress like?
Now, Maranello Sales in Egham. That was a different story. Salesman was friendly, helpful, knew his stuff and let me drive two of the cars to see which type I preferred. He didn't even bother to see my licence. I didn't even look the part either.
I keep thinking to myself, what is the problem? If they don't like what they do, they should get another job. And surely they must have realised that it doesn't amount to what you look/dress like?
Now, Maranello Sales in Egham. That was a different story. Salesman was friendly, helpful, knew his stuff and let me drive two of the cars to see which type I preferred. He didn't even bother to see my licence. I didn't even look the part either.
Unfortunately it does come down to what you look like. Obviously I could wear my suit or armani trousers etc, but I prefer to wear (smart) jeans. Especially at the weekend. I'm sure my grandad would put on a shirt and tie for the occasion, but I'm in my 20's and can't be arsed with it all! It's their loss at the end of the day, if they can't imagine there are well paid people who like to look casual, they'll loose out on some hefty commission.
>> Edited by Roadrunner on Wednesday 22 May 16:50
>> Edited by Roadrunner on Wednesday 22 May 16:50
If going to spend a lot of money anywhere I personally go out of my way to look as scruffy as possible.
I hate the attitude that you dont 'look' like you can afford something so we are not going to help you so play on this. Its amazing the feeling of satisfaction you can get by forcing these snooty ar$eholes to pander to your wishes.
Matt.
I hate the attitude that you dont 'look' like you can afford something so we are not going to help you so play on this. Its amazing the feeling of satisfaction you can get by forcing these snooty ar$eholes to pander to your wishes.
Matt.
It has been said somewhere - probably here as this is the only time I actually read anymore! That a car salesman does 2 things with a prospective punter no matter how they are dressed or what car they turn up in.
1. Check out the shoes - decent shoes = spare cash??
2. Check out the watch - same as above.
Don't know if it's true anyone out there willing to own up as a car salesman?
1. Check out the shoes - decent shoes = spare cash??
2. Check out the watch - same as above.
Don't know if it's true anyone out there willing to own up as a car salesman?
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