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JnP
310 posts
26 months
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I have to say this topic has become entertaining. We have a saying in France that says: "With "ifs" we could put Paris in a bottle" TVR sank when PW was owning it, NS didn't manage to bring it back up, those are facts. Maybe had someone else bought it, would have been different... But that is only theoretical Now all we can do is pray that someone with a viable plan (and tons of money) comes forward. And maybe we could help him plan out the future of TVR by giving him ideas on what to do  Just my 2cents, no siding with anyone 
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carsy
1,271 posts
34 months
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JnP said: I have to say this topic has become entertaining. We have a saying in France that says: "With "ifs" we could put Paris in a bottle" TVR sank when PW was owning it, NS didn't manage to bring it back up, those are facts. Maybe had someone else bought it, would have been different... But that is only theoretical Now all we can do is pray that someone with a viable plan (and tons of money) comes forward. And maybe we could help him plan out the future of TVR by giving him ideas on what to do Just my 2cents, no siding with anyone Just about says it all i reckon. The thing is, is there anyone out there willing to do so. I hope so but somehow doubt it.
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Derek Smith
16,030 posts
117 months
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teamHOLDENracing said: Sorry, I was being a little mischievous.
It is quite interesting to go back and look at the accounts of both businesses through the early to mid 2000's and in the case of Ginetta, since then. It just emphasises how different the companies were, both in scale and activities. Andy, Isn't that the point? The only thing TVR and Ginetta had in common were the fact that they both produced cars, one mainlyfor the road, the other more or less exclusively for the track. They were vastly different in size and, I would suggest, aspirations of any buyer. I would also suggest that they were the only games in town. LNT hardly looked around once the TVR offer was rejected for something similar. He was aware of Ginetta and had rejected it in favour of TVR. Once the first choice died he went for the second option, a sign of a businessman. So the question would seem to be: how much of the progress of Ginetta can we take to a supposed buy-out of TVR? I'd suggest very little apart from the overall fact that Ginetta still exists, not something that was probably under previous ownership.
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St John Smythe
3,796 posts
86 months
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JnP said: I have to say this topic has become entertaining. We have a saying in France that says: "With "ifs" we could put Paris in a bottle" TVR sank when PW was owning it, NS didn't manage to bring it back up, those are facts. Maybe had someone else bought it, would have been different... But that is only theoretical Now all we can do is pray that someone with a viable plan (and tons of money) comes forward. And maybe we could help him plan out the future of TVR by giving him ideas on what to do Just my 2cents, no siding with anyone I agree. I imagine this is what being stuck in limbo is like. An endless conversation about resurrecting TVR, covering the same points again, and again, and again......
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teamHOLDENracing
4,819 posts
136 months
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Derek Smith said: So the question would seem to be: how much of the progress of Ginetta can we take to a supposed buy-out of TVR? I'd suggest very little I totally agree Derek, which is why I questioned your statement "the facts speak for themselves: TVR would be alive and well if he'd (LNT) bought it"
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Derek Smith
16,030 posts
117 months
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teamHOLDENracing said: Derek Smith said: So the question would seem to be: how much of the progress of Ginetta can we take to a supposed buy-out of TVR? I'd suggest very little I totally agree Derek, which is why I questioned your statement "the facts speak for themselves: TVR would be alive and well if he'd (LNT) bought it" Andy, You are quoting parts without the context. The overall conclusion has to be that if LNT kept Ginetta going despite all its problems then he would probably have kept TVR going. However, your question was about the number of road cars produced by Ginetta, my assumption being that you were suggesting that this could be used to show how few he would have produced if he'd bought TVR. My suggestion, which I'm sorry it if wasn't clear, was that you cannot compare the two in the detail of cars produced. Ginetta's last road car was the G32 and that stopped production some weeks ago now. I'm a big fan of the G32. I had one for 10 years or so, shared with my son. I loved it. However, it was not really a production car despite passing the tests. There were so many design flaws. The interior especially was dreadful.  The Sagaris, Wheeler's greatest car according to many, was still in production and there were modifications to existing cars in the pipeline. The interiors of all of them were somewhat different to my G32. My assumption was that the progress of the two companies would have been somewhat different. The number of cars produced by a company that had no recent history of road car production would, I think, been somewhat different to one that had not only cars in current production but a somewhat fanatical following. On top of that, and not refered to by me previously, is that whether or not TVR made road cars under LNT straight away I feel certain he would have started a few race series so providing a certain financial security. It worked for PW.
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Gazzab
15,113 posts
151 months
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How about some facts:-
If I had bought it then it would now be clearing £20m pa profit, the cars would be winning awards and races, the race series would be the no 1 race series in the UK, they would have won Le Mans 2 years in a row, the AJP would have come back as a 32 valve emission friendly engine, the new models would be seen as the best design and highest quality cars ever rom TVR, the workforce would be motivated, the tooling modern, the chassis rust free, customers willing to pay porsche prices for TVRs etc etc
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900T-R
18,560 posts
126 months
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Gazzab said: How about some facts:-
customers willing to pay porsche prices for TVRs
They already did in mainland Europe.
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alex_gray255
3,018 posts
74 months
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Gazzab said: How about some facts:-
If I had bought it then it would now be clearing £20m pa profit, the cars would be winning awards and races, the race series would be the no 1 race series in the UK, they would have won Le Mans 2 years in a row, the AJP would have come back as a 32 valve emission friendly engine, the new models would be seen as the best design and highest quality cars ever rom TVR, the workforce would be motivated, the tooling modern, the chassis rust free, customers willing to pay porsche prices for TVRs etc etc
You forgot to mention world peace and an era of gloria for all 
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GTRene
7,762 posts
93 months
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EvoOlli
137 posts
32 months
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I got a secret video of the new TVR wind turbine  Secret Video
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alex_gray255
3,018 posts
74 months
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Heh. Must have used a fibre galass base to try and improve weigh ratios...
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S2Mike
2,066 posts
19 months
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http://www.zolfe.com/ Could this be the new One To Watch?, if TVR cannot be resurrected, it has the looks of the S Series about it, and they are already into track versions and export.
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tuscanturner
240 posts
31 months
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From all of these differant threads about what ifs which seem to go on forever, I think lots of people would be happy if Ginetta were to have TVR run alongside them that way we would all be happy. Even if it meant only low volume sales of new TVRs, long waiting lists and whatever other hurdles would need to be jumped over to get there.
I for one like what is being done with the Ginetta, especially the G60 but probably wouldnt buy one, but if it had a TVR badge on the front of the bonnet then my car will be up for sale and my deposit would be down today.(badge snobbery I suppose)
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DonkeyApple
12,003 posts
38 months
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Graham said:  TVR ENGINEERING LIMITED UNIT 8 MEDIA VILLAGE LISCOMBE PARK SOULBURY BUCKS UNITED KINGDOM LU7 0GH Company No. 08013574 It is an odd one. Not an off the shelf job but set up from scratch. Single director is a partner of the firm that set it up, he resigned a month later. Currently it has no officers. Bucks isn't an area previously associated with NS' LTDs. Nor is Enfield, where the firm that set it up is based. Bucks is an area associated with motorsport due to the proximity of Silverstone. Plenty of BRDC and ex F1 people living and running businesses in the area. As mentioned by V8GRF, can a company be incorporated in the name of a previous company that expired with debts, maybe TVR Eng was just wound down. Why would anyone set up a company in this name and use an address on a media trading estate as opposed to just using the address of the firm that registered it? Why would the start up officer resign and not be replaced simultaneously, let alone 3 months on? And finally, what use is such a company if the Trademark is not available? One small possibility is that if you were building a car, let's call it a w  kshaft GT and your brand was called Geoff Motors would you get a lot of kudos by association and press coverage etc if your holding company was called TVR Engineering Ltd? Would it be a very smart move to get the brand association of the TVR name without using or infringing the TVR registered trademarks? 
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elisek
381 posts
151 months
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