New TVR still under wraps!

[GTrr]

nawarne said:

Please point me in the direction of a sub-£100K Porsche where the interior doesn't look like a Audi A3 look-alike.

Drove a Jersey Reg Carrera 2 from Pompey docks last week diverting to Southampton Airport and whilst it did feel hewn from solid, it was just so uninspiring.....Now the previous week took an Alfa 8C to New Milton....that stirred the soul!!
Nick

Yep, that's where the opportunities are. Not so much plain performance but soul and sound. But then you have e.g. an F-type which isn't bad either. There is a lot more competition now than 15 years ago. Still very eager to see what they will come up with!

[DonkeyApple]

GTrr said:

OK the basic Carrera S at 90k pounds has 420 hp and weighs 1450 kg so less than 300 h/ton but it does 4.2 s to 100 kph and tops at 306 kph.
The new TVR should do about 450 hp at some 1200 kg (if that is true?) but will be hard pressed to match these numbers, let alone have the same quality handling.

But we are coming from a world where a TVR had a lot more power than a 911 and cost a lot less; that won't be the case anymore.

True. It's not ever going to knock Porsche off its perch or even threaten to. But not everyone has any interest in owning a Porsche and buy other sports/GT cars.

What else do we have out there that is a front engined, RWD high end sports GT? I guess you have the F Type, DB11, SL and a few others. I think there is space for a TVR in there as it brings a very different image to those cars. It brings much more serious motoring, less golf club gropers or James Bind wannabes or carrouselle fraud experts.

[Hughesie]

GTrr said:

Yep, that's where the opportunities are. Not so much plain performance but soul and sound. But then you have e.g. an F-type which isn't bad either.

For old people

[anonymous-user]

GTrr said:

OK the basic Carrera S at 90k pounds has 420 hp and weighs 1450 kg so less than 300 h/ton but it does 4.2 s to 100 kph and tops at 306 kph.
The new TVR should do about 450 hp at some 1200 kg (if that is true?) but will be hard pressed to match these numbers, let alone have the same quality handling.

But we are coming from a world where a TVR had a lot more power than a 911 and cost a lot less; that won't be the case anymore.

450bhp and 1200kg is 375 bhp/tonne. With a GM designed chassis and proper aero what makes you think they will neither match those numbers or have the same quality handling..?

[Hughesie]

thecook101 said:

GTrr said:

OK the basic Carrera S at 90k pounds has 420 hp and weighs 1450 kg so less than 300 h/ton but it does 4.2 s to 100 kph and tops at 306 kph.
The new TVR should do about 450 hp at some 1200 kg (if that is true?) but will be hard pressed to match these numbers, let alone have the same quality handling.

But we are coming from a world where a TVR had a lot more power than a 911 and cost a lot less; that won't be the case anymore.

450bhp and 1200kg is 375 bhp/tonne. With a GM designed chassis and proper aero what makes you think they will neither match those numbers or have the same quality handling..?

Then stick a Supercharger on it

[m4tti]

thecook101 said:

It quite possibly is a shrinking market but the options available to that market are shrinking even faster. Relatively light, manual gearbox, 500hp flat plane V8, great aero and even better noise - how many options are there under 100 grand? I was there last Saturday and I think they have nailed it. I don't think the model was the best colour to show off the design but the configurator in my head was in overdrive and I liked what i saw. I've never owned a TVR but if the brand is meant to represent an ear to ear smile, wide eyes and clenched buttocks then I don't think the 500 will disappoint.

.

So did they confirm they're putting a flat plane crank in the cross plane based coyote engine.

[anonymous-user]

m4tti said:

So did they confirm they're putting a flat plane crank in the cross plane based coyote engine.

Ah - my bad, nothing was said and have edited my original post.

[TrotCanterGallopCharge]

People saying Lotus arent doing well - 2015 cars (worldwide) in 2014 Financial year (from internet news article), & have been doing 'ok' since then.

Speaking to their stand staff at Goodwood F.O.Speed in '15, I think they said they'd met their year targets by June of that year.

870 cars to Europe alone last year, so hopefully enough buyers are out there (as well as far east).

Unfortunately, I think they are now competition to Tvr, & not in a different niche like previous years (Evora & specced up Exiges),with fantastic handling to, & are already an established antidote to Porsche etc.

I appreciate a 6 cyl Evora isnt the same as an 8 cyl Tvr on various levels, but, approx same power & weight, & the Lotus is a far better mile muncher than they used to be.

For people just wanting a 2 seater sports car, with the budget for just one car, would be a tough choice between the two, with running costs taken into account as well?

I'm reminded of how far Lotus have come when out with friends in their S/Charged Elises, compared to my (old) 4.5 Chim.

It will be tough, but hoping that Tvr with new technology/team can find the way to producing something with the 'Wow' factor the brand had before, & have the marketing power to reach buyers to. So far reactions have been good at the viewings, long may it continue.

[bullittmcqueen]

Dammit, it was only last Saturday and i thought i had it forever burned right in the middle of my aging memory. But after all the talk and pictures passed round here i honestly can't remember much more than that it had four wheels and i liked it. So much for photographic memory.

[TrotCanterGallopCharge]

bullittmcqueen said:

Dammit, it was only last Saturday and i thought i had it forever burned right in the middle of my aging memory. But after all the talk and pictures passed round here i honestly can't remember much more than that it had four wheels and i liked it. So much for photographic memory.

In NCIS etc, they always say shut your eyes & imagine being back in the room, & what you are touching/feeling/smelling etc?!

What was the cover colour, & first impressions when revealed etc anyway, what details caught your eye etc?

100% not guaranteed..., but good luck.

[anonymous-user]

bullittmcqueen said:

Dammit, it was only last Saturday and i thought i had it forever burned right in the middle of my aging memory. But after all the talk and pictures passed round here i honestly can't remember much more than that it had four wheels and i liked it. So much for photographic memory.

yeah right

[L33]

I am aware of a couple of people who might be willing to sell their build slot (something I'm interested in buying).

Has anyone done this yet and is there an official process in place to facilitate? I can't be the only one out there kicking myself I didn't give the £2,500 deposit at the time.

I fully appreciate that the £2,500 paid is arguably now worth £5,000. What (if any) would be a reasonable premium to pay for the privilege?

[AOK]

L33 said:

I am aware of a couple of people who might be willing to sell their build slot (something I'm interested in buying).

Has anyone done this yet and is there an official process in place to facilitate? I can't be the only one out there kicking myself I didn't give the £2,500 deposit at the time.

I fully appreciate that the £2,500 paid is arguably now worth £5,000. What (if any) would be a reasonable premium to pay for the privilege?

Those who put down £2,500 have a credit of £2,500 off the purchase price once their new car arrives
Those who put down £5,000 have a credit of £5,000 off the purchase price once their new car arrives

With Les suggesting that some of the 500 Launch Editions are still up for grabs, why you'd want to pay a 'premium' of any kind just to get a car a little earlier is beyond me. Just give TVR a call and put your own deposit down. As people fizzle out (and there's no one interested in 'buying' their slots) you'll naturally get closer and closer to the front of the queue.

For information, I'm sure the form we signed when placing a deposit said they don't have a problem in slots chaining hands, so long as the original deposit is put down in "good faith" .. or something similarly worded.

[Slow M]

thecook101 said:

m4tti said:

So did they confirm they're putting a flat plane crank in the cross plane based coyote engine.

Ah - my bad, nothing was said and have edited my original post.

That's not a task for which they would need to retain the services of Cosworth Engineering.
http://www.f1technical.net/forum/viewtopic.php?t=2...

Best regards,
Bernard.

[GTrr]

thecook101 said:

450bhp and 1200kg is 375 bhp/tonne. With a GM designed chassis and proper aero what makes you think they will neither match those numbers or have the same quality handling..?

Because the chassis of the top cars take hugh budgets and knowledge to make. But I really hope that they come up with something good.

[Rob-s5mok]

Englishman said:

Personally I was heartened by the number of non-TVR owners at the reveal I attended. I don’t have the numbers, obviously, but would guess 60% of deposit holders at the session I attended were existing TVR owners, 40% first-time buyers, most under 40.

If this session was typical, it suggests to me that TVR are already reaching well beyond their traditional base. I just don’t buy that ‘sports car customers are dying off’, literally or otherwise, or that TVR need to offer ‘hybrid/electric drive trains’ for quite a while yet. I do agree the LE will either make or break them though, so it needs to be right from the start.

My session was probably the other way round, assuming that most people who owned a TVR drove it there. I have never owned a TVR nor (sorry!) ever really desired one*.

I am happy to be an odd one out here but I was much more attracted to this endeavour by the involvement of GM and Cosworth than the fact that it's a TVR. I probably would have been interested if it had been called Edgar Motors if they deliver on the plan.

• On our session a guy turned up in a Tuscan with its exhaust hanging off and there was some issue with a car that needed to be jump started.I am sure some would say that this is all part of TVR ownership and in a way I admire the bulldog spirit but that's not for me.

[Bluebottle]

Slow M said:

thecook101 said:

m4tti said:

So did they confirm they're putting a flat plane crank in the cross plane based coyote engine.

Ah - my bad, nothing was said and have edited my original post.

That's not a task for which they would need to retain the services of Cosworth Engineering.
http://www.f1technical.net/forum/viewtopic.php?t=2...

Best regards,
Bernard.

When I asked LE last September if they considering using the Voodoo engine (flat plane crank), he was of the opinion that inside info suggested it was not a proven reliable unit yet so they were going to stick with the Coyote unit

[anonymous-user]

GTrr said:

thecook101 said:

450bhp and 1200kg is 375 bhp/tonne. With a GM designed chassis and proper aero what makes you think they will neither match those numbers or have the same quality handling..?

Because the chassis of the top cars take hugh budgets and knowledge to make. But I really hope that they come up with something good.

Knowledge yes, and they have that in bucketloads in GMD. Huge budgets no, think Lotus, Caterham, etc. Handling is not necessarily about how fast you can make a car go around a corner, it's about steering feel, responsiveness to driver inputs, feedback to the driver through all points of driver contact. Knowing how much grip is available to you, knowing when you are approaching the limits, and predictability over the limit defines good handling and step one to achieving that is less weight, not more money.

[Zippee]

Rob-s5mok said:

Englishman said:

Personally I was heartened by the number of non-TVR owners at the reveal I attended. I don’t have the numbers, obviously, but would guess 60% of deposit holders at the session I attended were existing TVR owners, 40% first-time buyers, most under 40.

If this session was typical, it suggests to me that TVR are already reaching well beyond their traditional base. I just don’t buy that ‘sports car customers are dying off’, literally or otherwise, or that TVR need to offer ‘hybrid/electric drive trains’ for quite a while yet. I do agree the LE will either make or break them though, so it needs to be right from the start.

My session was probably the other way round, assuming that most people who owned a TVR drove it there. I have never owned a TVR nor (sorry!) ever really desired one*.

I am happy to be an odd one out here but I was much more attracted to this endeavour by the involvement of GM and Cosworth than the fact that it's a TVR. I probably would have been interested if it had been called Edgar Motors if they deliver on the plan.

• On our session a guy turned up in a Tuscan with its exhaust hanging off and there was some issue with a car that needed to be jump started.I am sure some would say that this is all part of TVR ownership and in a way I admire the bulldog spirit but that's not for me.

Personally I'd say it's not part and parcel of ownership, more poor maintenance. There are a lot of very good cars out there with fastidious owners, yes they'll suffer niggles from time to time but generally they are very reliable. On the other hand there are a lot of poorly maintained or rough examples, but like any brand of car really.

[KevinCamaroSS]

Zippee said:

Personally I'd say it's not part and parcel of ownership, more poor maintenance. There are a lot of very good cars out there with fastidious owners, yes they'll suffer niggles from time to time but generally they are very reliable. On the other hand there are a lot of poorly maintained or rough examples, but like any brand of car really.

Agreed, my Wedge had 85K miles on it, and during the time I had it (used most days) all that happened was a multi-connector came loose and I had to clip it back together. All cars also benefit from regular use, leave them to stand and the issues start.