Lotus Elise Mk1 anybody got experience of these cars

Lotus Elise Mk1 anybody got experience of these cars

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ClassiChimi

Original Poster:

12,424 posts

148 months

Thursday 27th October 2016
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A strange request but I'm looking at said cars, K series engined 1.8.
I'm aware of engine issues etc
Why I ask on here is because as Tvr owners we know how a fast car feels so if anyone's had experience of driving these little Lotus cars I'd like to know your views.

I'm not bothered about big power anymore and more interested in cornering ability and how they act and feel on the road.
I can do my own research on technical and reliability issues but just wondered what they are like to drive.
Do they feel slow etc.
I can go for a test drive etc but I can hardly put one on the limit of grip so has anyone enjoyed one of these cars on track.

I've read they handle really well and can imagine they are like a big go cart so if anyone's ever owned or driven one of these cars around 2002-3 year model I'd like to know your thoughts good and bad.
Cheers

jules_s

4,235 posts

232 months

Thursday 27th October 2016
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2002-03 will be S2 wont it?

N7GTX

7,822 posts

142 months

Thursday 27th October 2016
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Alun, there was an early Elise featured on Wheeler Dealers tonight on Quest. You may be able to download it.

clarkmagpie

3,559 posts

194 months

Friday 28th October 2016
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I ran a k series 2002 s2 for a couple of years as a daily so feel free to ask any questions...

clarkmagpie

3,559 posts

194 months

Friday 28th October 2016
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A bit more detail.
At the same time I had a 5.0 Griffith.

The lotus,
Nimble, handled like a house fly, serious grip.
It was nippy rather than fast fast.
Loud, rattly, basic.
Kids loved it, always got positive reactions.
Wife HATED it in the end and refused to go out in it.
Never any major problems, few niggles tho.
Water leak and suspension where expensive fixes.

Ended up selling the Elise and going for an RS6.
That went and currently run an SL500 r230.
Much more civilised. Not half as much fun though.
(Still have the Griff)

ClassiChimi

Original Poster:

12,424 posts

148 months

Friday 28th October 2016
quotequote all
N7GTX said:
Alun, there was an early Elise featured on Wheeler Dealers tonight on Quest. You may be able to download it.
I watched it Iain, which is what's provoked this thread.
I've been thinking of old Tvr Vixens with the little 1600cc engines and find myself really drawn to them but they are so old and I can't imagine they'd be too good on the road but that might be doing then an injustice.

The Lotus Elise (Mk2) appears to be the sort of thing that might be right up my street, I can't afford the Tvr to blow up, I want to have some track fun and cornering ability is what I really want, anyone can go fast in a straight line. smile

77racing

3,346 posts

186 months

Friday 28th October 2016
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A friend of mine had the S1 1.8 K engine,which he did the ring in with me several trips and countless trackdays. I was in my Griff. On the seven hour run to germany I always got out of the car fair well in good nick. He on the other hand looked like he had been on spin in a washing machine. The Lotus was really hot all the time in the cockpit and the noise just by your ear was almost unbearable on long trips. The handling was excellent as in go kart esk but on the roads of today with pot holes it was a night mare.The car was reliable , only issue on trackdays was the brakes weren't up to it.

ClassiChimi

Original Poster:

12,424 posts

148 months

Friday 28th October 2016
quotequote all
clarkmagpie said:
A bit more detail.
At the same time I had a 5.0 Griffith.

The lotus,
Nimble, handled like a house fly, serious grip.
It was nippy rather than fast fast.
Loud, rattly, basic.
Kids loved it, always got positive reactions.
Wife HATED it in the end and refused to go out in it.
Never any major problems, few niggles tho.
Water leak and suspension where expensive fixes.

Ended up selling the Elise and going for an RS6.
That went and currently run an SL500 r230.
Much more civilised. Not half as much fun though.
(Still have the Griff)
Excellent description, I'm more than happy to give way to more powerful stuff as when I drive on the roads I'm a wuss!
Same with going trackdays, but watch me muller them in the bends, I learnt many a year ago corner skills as a driver matter far more than the bit that connects them together, I'm constantly reminded that cars with small engines still manage fast or faster times than many cars with far more power.
I like the basic feel and look of the interior in the Lotus, love the name and maybe this might be an itch that I can scratch without it costing the earth.

I've barely scratched the surface when considering these Lotus as my lack of knowledge shows but there's an old man I know, he's about 80 years now, a cyclist so proper fit even now and has owned one for about 10 years and it just sits in his garage, totally looked after, drives it everynow and then but it's just under used, he mentioned he'd let it go to a good owner and he appreciates my Tvr, we get on very well so I might just look closer.
I've noticed there's a Lotus dealer at Silverstone so I might go and check a few out there and maybe take a test drive.

Thanks for this response and it's pretty much what I was expecting.
Thanks Alun

ClassiChimi

Original Poster:

12,424 posts

148 months

Friday 28th October 2016
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77racing said:
A friend of mine had the S1 1.8 K engine,which he did the ring in with me several trips and countless trackdays. I was in my Griff. On the seven hour run to germany I always got out of the car fair well in good nick. He on the other hand looked like he had been on spin in a washing machine. The Lotus was really hot all the time in the cockpit and the noise just by your ear was almost unbearable on long trips. The handling was excellent as in go kart esk but on the roads of today with pot holes it was a night mare.The car was reliable , only issue on trackdays was the brakes weren't up to it.
That's great info, hmmm, noise is a problem for me as I have a blown ear drum, that could be a big issue as it's my left ear that plays up! Washing machine hehe I won't be aiming to drive it long distances but that alone could be a deal breaker.
Heat in the cab, ok when racing or driving hard as I love the extremes you go through when on track but if that's an issue when driving on the road then again not what you'd want.

Maybe I need to check one out and I'll probably realise just how good my Tvr is.
I'm finding myself using barely any of my Tvr power ( excuse the pun) and driving like a dick on the road doesn't interest me so these little engines cars are getting my attention.
Thanks for the honest opinion.

ETA it's your video at Brands GP Perry that's also got me thinking, once or twice on that vid I can hear the ESCORT engine, really fast car and driver who's getting on the throttle early and often before the Apex which to me is what it's all about, ramming them through corners. Tvr's ttend to need you to hover the throttle until your through and levelling the car up before really accelerating and that's a frustration.
Harder to drive yes but not necessarily more fun. smile

Yes I know you have a Vixen, wink shush.

Edited by ClassiChimi on Friday 28th October 07:59

ClassiChimi

Original Poster:

12,424 posts

148 months

Friday 28th October 2016
quotequote all
A couple more questions
What are they like for fuel economy when used locally around town and also when cruising at say 80 mph

How easy are they to work on, they look simple enough to me!

NorfolkSteve

99 posts

190 months

Friday 28th October 2016
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S2 Elise has more accessible handling than a TVR, with greater confidence under braking and more progressive limit behaviour. It won't spin up the rear wheels under power easily like a TVR (at least in the dry), so handling is understeer biased but with very high grip. It will break away the rear if you lift off the throttle whilst cornering hard. Drifting requires the development of a technique of throttle lift to break away the rear and then reapplication of power at the right time to keep the car sideways. S1 Elise's are less progressive at the limit, but some prefer this characteristic. Both S1 and S2 are quite sensitive to tyre choice. The Elise is, as others have said, very well connected in its steering and handling responses.

Things to note relative to TVR's:

Steering feedback - the Elise's steering wheel is 'lively' on anything other than very smooth roads, learn to let it wriggle, rather than fight it and the car is very stable and tracks straight.

Noise, as others have said is quite tiresome on long journeys, many owners resort to earplugs.

Many people find that they get lower back pain driving an Elise, some after as little as 20mins.

The engine doesn't have the torque of a TVR, so you have to use the gears a lot more.


clarkmagpie

3,559 posts

194 months

Friday 28th October 2016
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Mpg
I can't remember exact figures but I'd hazard a guess around mid 30s.

I agree on the noise being an issue on long trips.
Sports exhaust and big air filter sounded great when giving it a bit of welly though smile

highway

1,928 posts

259 months

Friday 28th October 2016
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I had several from new. A few months ago I treated myself to an S1 with 16k. It had just had a new radiator. Early car with the still excellent MMC brakes. One of the original rear dampers was weeping. Sourcing replacements has been nightmarishly difficult. The car is a joy to drive. You feel the lightness. It's punchy upto 60 mph at which point the performance is that of a modern 2.0 tdi. The real beauty is that unlike all the favoured German Marques the Elise FEELS fast at sane speeds. I'd suggest it feels faster than it is. The Germans are, in reality, engineered for autobahn work. We have no roads in Britain where you can cruise at 90mph plus with impunity. The Germans do this well. However at B road speeds M3:rs4, 911's aren't woken up at 50 and 60 mph. In comparison they are numb at those speeds where you get the sensation you are travelling slowly.

I've had an epiphany realising how good a standard Elise is on our roads. I highly recommend purchase if you like driving for fun rather than for commuting. The Elise is tiring on motorways due to road noise and firm suspension.

nawarne

3,088 posts

259 months

Friday 28th October 2016
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Alun,

- Mk.1 Elise great fun, fantastic in the corners, emminentley chuckable very tactile car. However, will never be as useful as your Chim. was with your drive to the S of France a year or so ago. You'd be snookered for kit stowage.

I did a track day with my mate in his Caterham at Silverstone October 3rd. It'd be all over the exhausts of the GT3's, Fezza Cali's, 355's etc in the bends. You could brake later, be on the power earlier in a corner and hence carry much more momentum in the bend. The Elise is a similar beast.

Another mate has an Elise Mk.1, but he only tracks it....and lately just wants to go to a local track - Combe, Thruxton perhaps Goodwood, because travelling further afield would be more of a work-up.

Nick

ClassiChimi

Original Poster:

12,424 posts

148 months

Friday 28th October 2016
quotequote all
nawarne said:
Alun,

- Mk.1 Elise great fun, fantastic in the corners, emminentley chuckable very tactile car. However, will never be as useful as your Chim. was with your drive to the S of France a year or so ago. You'd be snookered for kit stowage.

I did a track day with my mate in his Caterham at Silverstone October 3rd. It'd be all over the exhausts of the GT3's, Fezza Cali's, 355's etc in the bends. You could brake later, be on the power earlier in a corner and hence carry much more momentum in the bend. The Elise is a similar beast.

Another mate has an Elise Mk.1, but he only tracks it....and lately just wants to go to a local track - Combe, Thruxton perhaps Goodwood, because travelling further afield would be more of a work-up.

Nick
Thanks for the input gents, one mate confirmed it won't be as comfortable as the Tvr for longer distances yet another said he had one for 9' years and never had a problem with back ache or the like.
I do have a lower back issue, I'm a broken wreck hehe so I better have a test drive.

I've been out all day and when I got home and looked at the Tvr, it's hard to beat isn't it.
Thanks again.
France, that was another mad run that was.
Cheers Nick

trev4

736 posts

161 months

Friday 28th October 2016
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I had a test drive in a s1 a few years back I was thinner then and still found it difficult to get in and out of, very high door sill.
They do handle though, I did the last two rounds of the javlin sprint competition and the car that won the whole series was a lotus s1 with a Honda 2lt V tec engine in it, a common upgrade by all accounts, he beat single seater's, lotus 7s and fire breathing evos really good looking car with a fitted hard top, he did have a removable steering wheel to add entry. Pictures on the javlin website.

Edmundo2

1,328 posts

209 months

Friday 28th October 2016
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Hi. I was running a nice 450 Chim but fancied something sharper and more chuckable so went for an S1 111s. In summary I found it to be great when really pushing it and on smooth roads but unfortunately this is just far too often to make the car worthwhile, ( and I'm on the edge of the Dales ). It handled really nicely upto a point but was a bit skittish, ( with a new steering rack, new Lotus Sport shocks, new tyres etc ), and unforgiving at times

I bought it over a Caterham in the belief it would over a sharper drive vs the Tiv but with more practicality than a 7. I spent quite a bit on it but in reality I found it to be really impractical in terms of getting in and out of the thing and the roof was a pain in the backside. It was also pretty harsh/noisy which just becomes tiresome when getting anywhere at normal commuting speeds. It was great when screaming along but pooltling about it was like a tappetty go kart.

In the end I missed the TVR massively and sold the Elise in order to buy a Griff 500. Which I bloody loved. It had way more sense of occasion, was much more practical/comfortable at commuter speed, was way quicker in a straight line, felt less fragile, sounded awesome, was better suited to soaking up britains bumpy roads - still not great and scuttle shake etc but more tyre wall / suspension travel, chassis flex which I found more a acceptable than the Elise tub.

In the end I still wanted something sharper so sold up and went racing in a single seater hillclimber, ( which I'm loving and redefines speed and handling by comparison ).

Looking back I would say keep the TVR if you want to use it only on the road. If you want something sharper and still for road use that is just the occasional blast then by a Caterham. If you want something road legal but do the odd sprint or track day then an Elise could be great, ( although so would a 7 ).

Hope this helps.

mikeock64

105 posts

155 months

Friday 28th October 2016
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I had an S1 for 7 years and sold it when the essex roads got so bad you had to have one eye on the traffic and one eye looking for potholes and sunken manhole covers.
Even after changing the konis for Bilsteins. Great car. If you can stand on one leg and touch your chin with the the other knee, then you'll have no problem getting in and out of it. Mine never had any issues. As long as you keep an eye on the small expansion tank and keep it topped up.

ClassiChimi

Original Poster:

12,424 posts

148 months

Friday 28th October 2016
quotequote all
This is all very interesting reading, the same theme keeps coming up
Not to great over the bumps which considering it's virtually a trackcar is no suprise really.

I think I've been drawn by a smaller engine, nostalgia, my youth, something like that.
Maybe I should just put some Nitrons on my Tvr and be done with it wink

Twice now I've walked past the Tvr today and boy do I feel guilty for questioning it.

I've been reading the thread about values of Tvr's and I'm slowly coming to the conclusion regardless of value I'd not get a better car for the money in a million years.
The Lotus is a fine piece of engineering and the tubs ability does excite me but in reality how often am I going to get the benefit of it.
It's also because I'd really like to do more trackdays that I'm considering a Lotus but it's not likely to be any more reliable or cheaper to run than a sorted Tvr anyway.

I've done a small amount of reading and the Lotus can also have its issues, corrosion being just one of them, maybe my archaic Tvr box section chassis isn't as bad as all that and once sorted it's going to last years. scratchchin

The handing of the Lotus in the right conditions is always going to be a huge positive but if it's difficult to use on the road then it's not going to be what I want.
I still feel the need to find out though.
I'll not rush in but I will go and check a few out with an eye on having a test drive.

Today a chap raved about his saying it's the only car he kept for almost a decade, but then he's never driven a Tvr, maybe I should let him drive my Tvr and see what his reaction will be, that might put his words into perspective.




phazed

21,844 posts

203 months

Friday 28th October 2016
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I drove friends Exige at Brands Indy circuit a few years ago for about 40 minutes. It was brand-new and I said I'll be back in five minutes. wink

If an Elise handles anywhere like the Excige it will be fantastic, , Nothing like a TVR. As you said earlier, it is like a go kart, you sit over the front wheels and can plant the front anywhere you like.

Given time, money and opportunity I would have one of these in the garage, the handling really is something else.