Winter tyres vol 2
Discussion
Tyres make all the difference and I salaute anyone that has winter tyres if they need them. What I find a little strange is tying the evangelism for them with the tedious comparison between a 2WD car on winters and a 4WD car on summers. Surely a 4WD car on winters is the ultimate protection?
RodneyDanger said:
Tyres make all the difference and I salaute anyone that has winter tyres if they need them. What I find a little strange is tying the evangelism for them with the tedious comparison between a 2WD car on winters and a 4WD car on summers. Surely a 4WD car on winters is the ultimate protection?
Nobody argues that. It's to illustrate to the people that think 4WD is the be all and end all that actually, no, it's not.Of course it would be better- although that is purely from a traction point of view and means nothing else with regards to lateral grip and braking. The point is more towards people who feel the need to go and buy a 4x4 when there is often no actual need
Two of my colleagues have done exactly that. If they had wanted a 4x4 anyway then I'd have understood it.
Two of my colleagues have done exactly that. If they had wanted a 4x4 anyway then I'd have understood it.
apotts said:
4WD is a complete red herring. It only affects going. Tyre choice affects going, stopping and cornering.
This is the key. So many people want a 4x4 for the bad weather and then buy one with enormous summer tyres which mean they've ended up with a two ton sledge for the winter. Surely you don't get grip and lateral movement without traction in the first place. Ground cleareance, for that matter, can help as can a locking differential. A spinning wheel will prevent progress - 4 wheels good, 2 wheels bad. Seems that the 4WD hating argument is being applied here - you shouldn't buy a 4WD because you don't 'need' it. Well, actually they are the best with winter tyres on.
I have 2 - 4 wheel drive cars, one with Winter tyres and one with Summers. Guess which I take every time when it is snowing?
Yes it is annoying getting stuck behind those that try to run Summers in the snow and get stuck. But I am able to pass them with ease if clear to do so and always have the (rather fun) option of using the back streets and minor roads to avoid the jams on the main road. So when a relative in hospital died in 2013 when all the roads were covered and no buses were operating, I was able to get there in the same time as it would normally, due to the roads being empty of traffic.
I really cannot understand why the argument is still rolling! Fine if you don't need them, good for you. Just don't clog up the streets in bad weather for those of us that need to travel and all is well!
Yes it is annoying getting stuck behind those that try to run Summers in the snow and get stuck. But I am able to pass them with ease if clear to do so and always have the (rather fun) option of using the back streets and minor roads to avoid the jams on the main road. So when a relative in hospital died in 2013 when all the roads were covered and no buses were operating, I was able to get there in the same time as it would normally, due to the roads being empty of traffic.
I really cannot understand why the argument is still rolling! Fine if you don't need them, good for you. Just don't clog up the streets in bad weather for those of us that need to travel and all is well!
Jimboka said:
No snow or ice to affect my journeys for a few years here, South Bucks..
This is why the debate is never ending. Our neighbour had to abandon her car on Wednesday morning as it was stuck on snow and ice. So you have no need for winter tyres, but we feel happier with them "up here". 
Don't think I will ever be without them now, whatever car I have in the future, brilliant things and its amazing how good they are, and I had my reservation's when I forked out my hard earned cash!
But, I am looking forward to getting my smooth summers on, looks like I've got the winters on for a while yet...their noisey buggers ha!
But, I am looking forward to getting my smooth summers on, looks like I've got the winters on for a while yet...their noisey buggers ha!
JagXJR said:
Snow is forecast for this weekend. Here's hoping .............
Are you hoping it snows? 
If so, I'm not sure why. Surely the whole point of winter tyres is to improve safety. All other things being equal , snow will make driving less safe, both for those on summer tyres and even for those on winter tyres.
Countdown said:
Are you hoping it snows?
If so, I'm not sure why. Surely the whole point of winter tyres is to improve safety. All other things being equal , snow will make driving less safe, both for those on summer tyres and even for those on winter tyres.
Totally sensible viewpoint, but of course anyone on winter tyres [for the first time] will always be interested in 'testing them out', I know I am. But I certainly won't got for a test run if there's any question of my actions inconveniencing/endangering anyone else.If so, I'm not sure why. Surely the whole point of winter tyres is to improve safety. All other things being equal , snow will make driving less safe, both for those on summer tyres and even for those on winter tyres.
RenesisEvo said:
Totally sensible viewpoint, but of course anyone on winter tyres [for the first time] will always be interested in 'testing them out', I know I am. But I certainly won't got for a test run if there's any question of my actions inconveniencing/endangering anyone else.
Fair enough. I find supermarket car parks early morning to be best for testing. Usually empty with lots of space.RodneyDanger said:
Surely you don't get grip and lateral movement without traction in the first place. Ground cleareance, for that matter, can help as can a locking differential. A spinning wheel will prevent progress - 4 wheels good, 2 wheels bad. Seems that the 4WD hating argument is being applied here - you shouldn't buy a 4WD because you don't 'need' it. Well, actually they are the best with winter tyres on.
You're putting the cart before the horse. Winter, all seasons and summer tyres are popular because you can pick the car you want, then for a relatively small amount of money modify your car to meet your needs. You've got to live somewhere pretty extreme for snow performance to be the most important feature of your £xx,xxx car. Make the expensive choice that meets your needs, then choose the - relatively - cheap way to keep it gripping the road when you'll be using it by choosing the right tyres. Don't get me wrong - if they did a car as quick, comfortable, economical, cheap to maintain etc as my own choice and it was a 4WD too for the same cost - I'd have it. But the right tyres on the existing car will give me grip levels I'm happy with and any more is a bonus.
Countdown said:
Are you hoping it snows?
If so, I'm not sure why. Surely the whole point of winter tyres is to improve safety. All other things being equal , snow will make driving less safe, both for those on summer tyres and even for those on winter tyres.
Winter or summers on the car I love driving in the snow - it's different, it's a challenge, it can turn the journey into work into an adventure with that real element of doubt over whether or not you'll make it home or weeks later be sitting down the pub recounting how you survived off jelly babies as you were forced to camp in the car. Am I the only one that gets slightly childlike when the snow comes?If so, I'm not sure why. Surely the whole point of winter tyres is to improve safety. All other things being equal , snow will make driving less safe, both for those on summer tyres and even for those on winter tyres.
And anything that is well designed and exceeds my expectations impresses me. £400 winter tyres. £1000 gadget. £5 folding cup. Sometimes it's satisfying to use something that does what it should, really really well. If you can show off a little into the equation, posing as a driving god when the reality is you've got physics on your side rather than divine ability, well that's all good too.
Safety is the most important factor - sparing you injury or unexpected financial outlay is the grown up reason. But whilst you're being boringly sensible and safe, carrying on to work as normal you can - maybe just for once - take some childish pleasure in an otherwise bland and unappealing task.
tenohfive said:
Winter or summers on the car I love driving in the snow - it's different, it's a challenge, it can turn the journey into work into an adventure with that real element of doubt over whether or not you'll make it home or weeks later be sitting down the pub recounting how you survived off jelly babies as you were forced to camp in the car. Am I the only one that gets slightly childlike when the snow comes?
And anything that is well designed and exceeds my expectations impresses me. £400 winter tyres. £1000 gadget. £5 folding cup. Sometimes it's satisfying to use something that does what it should, really really well. If you can show off a little into the equation, posing as a driving god when the reality is you've got physics on your side rather than divine ability, well that's all good too.
Safety is the most important factor - sparing you injury or unexpected financial outlay is the grown up reason. But whilst you're being boringly sensible and safe, carrying on to work as normal you can - maybe just for once - take some childish pleasure in an otherwise bland and unappealing task.
Agree so much. For me many driving trips are about the journey itself rather than the destination.And anything that is well designed and exceeds my expectations impresses me. £400 winter tyres. £1000 gadget. £5 folding cup. Sometimes it's satisfying to use something that does what it should, really really well. If you can show off a little into the equation, posing as a driving god when the reality is you've got physics on your side rather than divine ability, well that's all good too.
Safety is the most important factor - sparing you injury or unexpected financial outlay is the grown up reason. But whilst you're being boringly sensible and safe, carrying on to work as normal you can - maybe just for once - take some childish pleasure in an otherwise bland and unappealing task.
I'm one of those who needs winter tyres due to location, not so much for snow but cold weather; I have 180 mile round trip to get to work and back (stay there when at work) and have clients who live in very remote locations 15-20 miles up single track roads.
We had snow here this week and it added 90 mins on to my journey time as others aren't prepared for the weather; I had no traction issues or traction control kicking in unless I severely provoked it, ABS didn't kick in once, yet others are driving like Bambi.
Case in point, the day after the snow some of the roads were still slushy in the centre of each lane, couple of inches at most. Come up behind a fire officer in a Corsa doing 23mph on a NSL, straight appears and I overtake to be met with a flurry of flashing headlights; it's well sighted with a near 90 degree left hander in the distance, a bint who was approaching the bend saw my manoeuvre and once round the bend started flashing at me despite me having been back in my lane for at least 15 seconds.
They were obviously having traction problems on summer rubber, I wasn't as I had spunked out the £400 for the necessary equipment for those conditions, however they assume that everyone is having the same traction issues as they are. I honestly expected to get stopped at the next town 20 miles further on by the cops for a chat.
Yet I see that Fire officer regularly, and in good weather he pedals that wee Corsa very well indeed, I'm happy to sit behind him as we are making good progress; so the difference is equipment choices, and the inability of others to fathom that they are the danger to other, well prepared, road users.
We had snow here this week and it added 90 mins on to my journey time as others aren't prepared for the weather; I had no traction issues or traction control kicking in unless I severely provoked it, ABS didn't kick in once, yet others are driving like Bambi.
Case in point, the day after the snow some of the roads were still slushy in the centre of each lane, couple of inches at most. Come up behind a fire officer in a Corsa doing 23mph on a NSL, straight appears and I overtake to be met with a flurry of flashing headlights; it's well sighted with a near 90 degree left hander in the distance, a bint who was approaching the bend saw my manoeuvre and once round the bend started flashing at me despite me having been back in my lane for at least 15 seconds.
They were obviously having traction problems on summer rubber, I wasn't as I had spunked out the £400 for the necessary equipment for those conditions, however they assume that everyone is having the same traction issues as they are. I honestly expected to get stopped at the next town 20 miles further on by the cops for a chat.
Yet I see that Fire officer regularly, and in good weather he pedals that wee Corsa very well indeed, I'm happy to sit behind him as we are making good progress; so the difference is equipment choices, and the inability of others to fathom that they are the danger to other, well prepared, road users.
Edited by stevoknevo on Saturday 17th January 00:09
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