DIY Dent removal
Discussion
Hi p'headers
I've got an old Golf that I use for work and thought it could be a good thing to practice DIY dent removal on as its got plenty of parking dings on it from careless door openers.
That way I can get good at using the tools and get a couple out on my nicer cars.
Where to start though? Some research on PH is probably a good place
I wondered if people could:
a) Recommend a good DIY kit- the heat, glue, pull method seems popular on these types of ding
b) Any experience of trying to do DIY dent removal- tips or pitfalls
Thanks all.
I've got an old Golf that I use for work and thought it could be a good thing to practice DIY dent removal on as its got plenty of parking dings on it from careless door openers.
That way I can get good at using the tools and get a couple out on my nicer cars.
Where to start though? Some research on PH is probably a good place
I wondered if people could:
a) Recommend a good DIY kit- the heat, glue, pull method seems popular on these types of ding
b) Any experience of trying to do DIY dent removal- tips or pitfalls
Thanks all.
Hi PaulsM3
As with may things, don't trust everything you see on pootube. Most of the budget DIY dent removal 'kits' don't really work as well as they are made out too, and in many cases make things worse. That said all dent removal kits are DIY to an extent as anyone can buy one and use it, but as you rightly want to do, they take practice to get right as it is very easy to over stretch a panel effectively scrapping it.
A starting point would be to get yourself a good mini lifter kit (try Wurth) which may include a mini lifter, hot melt glue gun, glue sticks (these are specially for the job, not b&q domestic stuff, and different glues for different weather / [paint /metal types), a set of glue pulling tabs, a slide hammer kit, a tap down set including hammer and adjustable tips, IPA Release agent, chalk pens for marking up, and a reflection source in the way of a line board. The line board will help read the dent (as you will notice most 'diy kits' don't use a line board), mainly because it will highlight the imperfections that you will also see every time you walk up to the car after using a lifting kit.
Lifting kits using hot melt glue are very effective and take some practice. More often than not the dent will lift high (so sticking out) which will require tapping back, or require multiple lifts or pulls to get right. Areas around the dent will also be displaced by the dent being formed so will require flattening or tapping back in order to release some of the tension in the dent. Your reflection source will allow you to see these and practice getting right.
Ensure the panel preperation and panel temperature are right before applying and check the cure temp of the glue before pulling so you don't pull to early or late (pre-releasing the glue or pulling the paint or lacquer layer of the car), bare in mind glue is applied at a melting point of around 190 degrees c so older more brittle paint will be affected differently to newer paint so it is wise to consider the cars age, it's paint condition and the metal type (alloys will be much stronger than steels and different cars will have different braceings and panel tensions.
Every dent you pull will be different so think about where and how to start, and how the dent will be finished, again this will take some practice. It may be adviseable to get a scrap panel, bonnet or the like for 20 quid and practice on that to start as mistakes won't matter.
Hope this helps.
As with may things, don't trust everything you see on pootube. Most of the budget DIY dent removal 'kits' don't really work as well as they are made out too, and in many cases make things worse. That said all dent removal kits are DIY to an extent as anyone can buy one and use it, but as you rightly want to do, they take practice to get right as it is very easy to over stretch a panel effectively scrapping it.
A starting point would be to get yourself a good mini lifter kit (try Wurth) which may include a mini lifter, hot melt glue gun, glue sticks (these are specially for the job, not b&q domestic stuff, and different glues for different weather / [paint /metal types), a set of glue pulling tabs, a slide hammer kit, a tap down set including hammer and adjustable tips, IPA Release agent, chalk pens for marking up, and a reflection source in the way of a line board. The line board will help read the dent (as you will notice most 'diy kits' don't use a line board), mainly because it will highlight the imperfections that you will also see every time you walk up to the car after using a lifting kit.
Lifting kits using hot melt glue are very effective and take some practice. More often than not the dent will lift high (so sticking out) which will require tapping back, or require multiple lifts or pulls to get right. Areas around the dent will also be displaced by the dent being formed so will require flattening or tapping back in order to release some of the tension in the dent. Your reflection source will allow you to see these and practice getting right.
Ensure the panel preperation and panel temperature are right before applying and check the cure temp of the glue before pulling so you don't pull to early or late (pre-releasing the glue or pulling the paint or lacquer layer of the car), bare in mind glue is applied at a melting point of around 190 degrees c so older more brittle paint will be affected differently to newer paint so it is wise to consider the cars age, it's paint condition and the metal type (alloys will be much stronger than steels and different cars will have different braceings and panel tensions.
Every dent you pull will be different so think about where and how to start, and how the dent will be finished, again this will take some practice. It may be adviseable to get a scrap panel, bonnet or the like for 20 quid and practice on that to start as mistakes won't matter.
Hope this helps.
LOL!! Like the pic! Yes I have done it once or twice, for quite a few years and will be doing it again tomorrow!
I am all for anyone having a practice at PDR, It is a really satisfying skill to master, but to master, a DIY Kit for pounds and a couple of bangs at a panel isn't going to get you there. The kit I list is a starter kit for pulling dents that would enable you to learn and progress to a standard that may well keep you happy when doing your own dents. There will be hrs of frustration ahead but it will come. You could get some training which will include a pro showing you how to use the kit properly, how to read a dent, start progress and finish, there is a great deal to it.
It is also important to remember that many of the kits and systems you see demo'd are by guy's who have been in car body repair for years and will have practiced with the 'technology' and understand what the outcomes could be if they pulled / pushed to hard etc etc etc. There are however also some really good in depth guides to glue pulling kicking around but there can be no replacement for experience as I mentioned before. Every panel on every car has its own individual properties and while some dents can appear similar, every one is different and will require a slightly different approach as you progress through the repair.
There isn't necessarily a common starting point but being ale to read the dent, understanding metal displacement caused by denting and knowing how to deal with a stretched panel (and that doesn't have to be a big dent) are important to the success of the outcome.
Glue will also have it's limitations. Sharp creases a pin dents are rarely cured with glue and some ali panels are like sprung steel to work and glue will just be a waste of time. However, for the kind of stuff you mention it sounds like a good solution.
Read up on tapping down as it will be vital to correct the highs that glue pulling will create. That sounds a bit wrong... not that sort of high, i mean high dents (sticking out not in). Also start to (if you haven't already) look into your panel construction on Your cars. what are they made of, paint type and is it all genuine, where are the panels braced etc.
I am all for anyone having a practice at PDR, It is a really satisfying skill to master, but to master, a DIY Kit for pounds and a couple of bangs at a panel isn't going to get you there. The kit I list is a starter kit for pulling dents that would enable you to learn and progress to a standard that may well keep you happy when doing your own dents. There will be hrs of frustration ahead but it will come. You could get some training which will include a pro showing you how to use the kit properly, how to read a dent, start progress and finish, there is a great deal to it.
It is also important to remember that many of the kits and systems you see demo'd are by guy's who have been in car body repair for years and will have practiced with the 'technology' and understand what the outcomes could be if they pulled / pushed to hard etc etc etc. There are however also some really good in depth guides to glue pulling kicking around but there can be no replacement for experience as I mentioned before. Every panel on every car has its own individual properties and while some dents can appear similar, every one is different and will require a slightly different approach as you progress through the repair.
There isn't necessarily a common starting point but being ale to read the dent, understanding metal displacement caused by denting and knowing how to deal with a stretched panel (and that doesn't have to be a big dent) are important to the success of the outcome.
Glue will also have it's limitations. Sharp creases a pin dents are rarely cured with glue and some ali panels are like sprung steel to work and glue will just be a waste of time. However, for the kind of stuff you mention it sounds like a good solution.
Read up on tapping down as it will be vital to correct the highs that glue pulling will create. That sounds a bit wrong... not that sort of high, i mean high dents (sticking out not in). Also start to (if you haven't already) look into your panel construction on Your cars. what are they made of, paint type and is it all genuine, where are the panels braced etc.
I think everything you've said so far is a good advert for giving the dent man thirty quid!
I had one done on my M3 last year (only one it had, after one visit to work on a Friday, when the car park was empty- t
ts) but didn't watch the guy do it as I was chatting to my mate at the dealership. Was done in 10mins so I thought it might be an easy case of popping it out with the glue method. Sounds a lot more involved though. Might just get a few £30's out instead.
I had one done on my M3 last year (only one it had, after one visit to work on a Friday, when the car park was empty- t
ts) but didn't watch the guy do it as I was chatting to my mate at the dealership. Was done in 10mins so I thought it might be an easy case of popping it out with the glue method. Sounds a lot more involved though. Might just get a few £30's out instead. PDR is a black art .... and not really something to be tried without loads of tuition and practice.
A novice can easily cause more damage quite quickly which can then take it beyond realms of even the best PDR technician - turning a simple job into a full blown body shop job involving the use filler and a re-spray.
A novice can easily cause more damage quite quickly which can then take it beyond realms of even the best PDR technician - turning a simple job into a full blown body shop job involving the use filler and a re-spray.
Might not be a bad idea for the M3 Paul. Squiggs is absolutely right, it is a bit of a dark art and an ever evolving one as panel technology, build, materials and finishes change. The guy that trained me is in it now for some 36 odd years and I know that I work on cars that he has never touched before so he might one day ring me for a how too on one (though he's pretty bl00dy good so would probably work it out).
I practiced on hundreds of dents both high's and low's before ever touching a customers car, and that was after I had some training, and needless to say, hacked a few up on the way. I don't like to be one of those techs that immediately poo poo's the idea of someone else learning the art, but it is WAY harder than you think it is ever going to be. Most techs if they are honest will also tell you that 10% of the time they come up against dents that they can't finish, such is the nature of the job, every day and every job is different, it's what keeps us young! LOL!!
I would encourage people to learn, but it is expensive to tool up, the glue kit will part you with between £300-£500 as a start, plus hammers, tap downs, line board or other reflection source, then you got to learn how to use it. There is no such thing as one tool for all jobs either, where as we have our favourites and our go too's every now and then a broader range is required and it could include some glue pulling and some pushing for the same dent.
On a last note I am afraid also that Squiggs is bang on with the 'more damage than good' comment. I see a couple every month where someone has 'started it off for me' only to be directing the client to the body shop for a new panel / respray etc, paint is very easily cracked. By all means get some kit but get someone in the know to show you how to start and then a scrap panel to practice on, as I said it is very satisfying to master, but it is not a short journey and things will get thrown. Where are you based by the way?
I practiced on hundreds of dents both high's and low's before ever touching a customers car, and that was after I had some training, and needless to say, hacked a few up on the way. I don't like to be one of those techs that immediately poo poo's the idea of someone else learning the art, but it is WAY harder than you think it is ever going to be. Most techs if they are honest will also tell you that 10% of the time they come up against dents that they can't finish, such is the nature of the job, every day and every job is different, it's what keeps us young! LOL!!
I would encourage people to learn, but it is expensive to tool up, the glue kit will part you with between £300-£500 as a start, plus hammers, tap downs, line board or other reflection source, then you got to learn how to use it. There is no such thing as one tool for all jobs either, where as we have our favourites and our go too's every now and then a broader range is required and it could include some glue pulling and some pushing for the same dent.
On a last note I am afraid also that Squiggs is bang on with the 'more damage than good' comment. I see a couple every month where someone has 'started it off for me' only to be directing the client to the body shop for a new panel / respray etc, paint is very easily cracked. By all means get some kit but get someone in the know to show you how to start and then a scrap panel to practice on, as I said it is very satisfying to master, but it is not a short journey and things will get thrown. Where are you based by the way?
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