what do i need for a diy bodywork repair and repaint?

[danlightbulb]

Hi guys.

Never done this work before so im starting with nothing.

I need to sand back, fill and repaint an area of rear arch where i have bubbling paint and likely rust holes.

I have no idea what i need. There are lots of different types of body filler, fibreglass, hardener, resin etc. What tools do i need? A grinder? A dremel?

Can someone help with a shopping list?

Thanks.

[Squiggs]

If you've got paint bubbling it indicates that rust is working its way from the inside to the outside - and what you can see is the tip of the iceberg.
Unless you can get to the inside to completely grind the rust away to then enable welding to take place (if in fact there is actually any good metal left to weld) then I'm afraid you'll be wasting your time.

[danlightbulb]

Thanks. Its not worth spending that money on it though, so I will just be sanding back and making the best job I can of it, with the aim of it lasting 3 to 4 years ish.

Once Ive sanded it back, if there are holes, then I intend to spray copious amounts of rust prevention fluid inside before filling/fibreglassing over and repainting the area. Ive seen some you tube videos of fibreglassing rust holes and it comes up pretty good.

So if someone can tell me what I would need to go shopping for it would be much appreciated.

Edited by danlightbulb on Monday 7th December 23:51

[swisstoni]

If you post up some pictures people can give you a better idea.

[hman]

In my experience if you dont cut out the oxidised metal and the source of the oxidisation then repairing it by sanding back, filling and spraying will last weeks, possibly months if you are lucky before it re-appears.

If you want years of oxidisation free repair then its new metal time.( and even then you need to make sure you prep it properly!!)


If its a front arch then I would consider a new wing, it its a rear arch then normally arch repair panels (£30-£40) are available. Then you either learn to weld or find a helpful welder, get it welded in place (£50) and and fill/paint as before.

The amount of prep for an arch repair panel is less than the amount of ball ache grinding back, rust killing fibre glassing, prepping, painting, and then seeing it all come back a few weeks later is heart breaking...

one tip - dont buy halfords rattle cans - go to a paint shop, they will mix your paint code and put it in a can for you, the results are much much better.

Last tip - you will use a shed load of materials, primer, papers, masking materials, filler, paint, clearcoat.

Paintwork is never cheap which ever way you look at it, materials cost a big part of that sum...

[Squiggs]

danlightbulb said:

Thanks. Its not worth spending that money on it though, so I will just be sanding back and making the best job I can of it, with the aim of it lasting 3 to 4 years ish.

Once Ive sanded it back, if there are holes, then I intend to spray copious amounts of rust prevention fluid inside before filling/fibreglassing over and repainting the area. Ive seen some you tube videos of fibreglassing rust holes and it comes up pretty good.

So if someone can tell me what I would need to go shopping for it would be much appreciated.

Edited by danlightbulb on Monday 7th December 23:51

Rust prevention fluid only slows down the inevitable on new, clean metal - it won't stop rust continuing to rust.
By the time you've spent money on all the tools, all the stuff and grades required for sanding, filler, fine filler, etch primer, primer, etc, etc, etc, (all of which incidentally I can guarantee won't stop it continuing to rust and might only hold the problem back for 3 to 4 months) you may as well spend a bit more and fit a new (or scrappy) panel.

[PositronicRay]

I recently had the following work done on a rusty front arch.

Old metal cut out
New section fabricated and welded in
Lead loaded
Sprayed

£250+ VAT

At a well respected bodyshop.

Well chuffed, not worth attempting a home repair (which if I was doing it would have been pretty poor) at these prices.

[danlightbulb]

I posted a question asking about bodyshop recommendations in general gassing but no-one responded. I do intend to get some quotes. I would not mind £250 a side. But if the job was coming in at more than this its not worth it.

Here are pics. Its a honda accord rear arches which are double skinned and welded on i believe.

better side:


worse side:

[swisstoni]

If that lot was taken to a body shop (near me at least) you would have done well to leave less than £1k lighter for a proper job. They can probably make it look cosmetically better for a good bit less (possibly within budget ) but the rust would break out again eventually. But you might have got a few years out of it.

It could be that it is time to learn a bit of DIY and just keep it tidy for the time you have the car.

[PositronicRay]

danlightbulb said:

I posted a question asking about bodyshop recommendations in general gassing but no-one responded. I do intend to get some quotes. I would not mind £250 a side. But if the job was coming in at more than this its not worth it.

Here are pics. Its a honda accord rear arches which are double skinned and welded on i believe.

better side:


worse side:

A lot of bodyshops are shying away from rust repairs.

I use Manhattan Motors, Earlsdon, Coventry. Highly recommended.

Edited by PositronicRay on Tuesday 8th December 16:03

[danlightbulb]

swisstoni said:

It could be that it is time to learn a bit of DIY and just keep it tidy for the time you have the car.

Its only a section 4" long by 1" wide. Thats why i posted the thread because thats exactly what i want to do, but please refer back to OP. need help with what to buy.

[ATG]

Hmm. Based on next to no experience, that looks like an interesting diy challenge. I've found filling holes is quite easy with fibre glass or one of the isopon fillers, because the repair is supported from all sides and you can use the edges to guide the shaping of the new splat you've added. Your repair is going to create a new edge, so it'll be hanging in mid air ... nothing to guide the shape or support the material unless you make a mold or somehow fabricate the new piece separately then bond it to the bodywork. Good luck!

[swisstoni]

danlightbulb said:

swisstoni said:

It could be that it is time to learn a bit of DIY and just keep it tidy for the time you have the car.

Its only a section 4" long by 1" wide. Thats why i posted the thread because thats exactly what i want to do, but please refer back to OP. need help with what to buy.

I'd just visit the world of YouTube - I'm sure there's tons of stuff.

[danlightbulb]

swisstoni said:

I'd just visit the world of YouTube - I'm sure there's tons of stuff.

There is, but it doesnt tell you what type of filler or hardener to use. On halfords there are several types.

[Squiggs]

danlightbulb said:

Its only a section 4" long by 1" wide.

On the outside .... from what you can see .... but once you start working on it will probably grow to an area of rust at least 12" by 4" - and that will still only be what you can see on the outside - on the inside it's more than likely an area twice as large again!

If (.... and it's a big if!) you managed to cosmetically repair what you can see - then within months the surrounding rusting edges on the inside would be breaking to the outside.

In reality for what you might achieve you may as well put a bit of gaffer tape over the outside - but that ain't going to stop it continuing to rust on the inside.

If repairing/preventing rust was as DIYable as you think it is then there would never be a rusty car on the road.

Honestly mate - don't try repairing it - you'll just be wasting your time and more importantly your money!

[danlightbulb]

I'm struggling to visualise what I will find underneath.

Here is what is in my head.

I sand it back, I'm left with some holes where I can see the inner skin through the holes. I spray rust preventer through the holes and underneath the arch (inside the arch lining). I chip away at the rusted edges until they are not falling apart. I mix up fibreglass with resin and pack it between the inner and outer skin until its flush with the arch surface. Then I use body filler over the top.

I'm struggling to see how this can continue to rust. Fibreglass can't rust.

It's only the bit on the lip of the arch where it undertucks the wheel well, isn't it? It won't have spread up the whole rear quarter - how can it?

Ive looked under the wheel well and can't see any rust on the wheel arch inside (i.e above the tyre).


I'm expecting to see something like this:


and do this to it:




It won't be like this will it? It can't be that bad:





Can you see why I'm not getting it, all we are looking at are a few paint blisters??

Edited by danlightbulb on Tuesday 8th December 19:54

[danlightbulb]

Squiggs said:

Honestly mate - don't try repairing it - you'll just be wasting your time and more importantly your money!

This whole thing is really putting a downer on my new car purchase. I feel like I've made the wrong decision and now I will be lumbered with a car where the whole rear panel starts to disintegrate on me.

What do I do? If I leave it to rot then what happens? Does it mean I'll never sell the car on now?

[chazola]

Don't let others put you off having a go, it's your car and everyone had to start learning somewhere. Just be aware bodywork repairs are probably the hardest to get right- and you need time, patience and good working conditions. Probably not the time of year to do it unless you have a warm garage. And rust is a bugger, it's always worse than it looks!

If you just want to make it look tidier, then you'll need to sand/grind out all that old rust and paint to bare metal, fill (the filler you get at Halfords is fine) and prime, then paint. With all the tedious stages of drying/sanding/shaping etc between! Look up on youtube spray painting and masking techniques and practice on an old bit of metal first if you can.
I found Victoria Autoparts on ebay supply very good matched paint.

If you're on a budget I'd say have a go- if you've got the cash then bodyshop but like others have said I don't think it'll be cheap.

[longshot]

You never really know what you are going to find when you do rusty body repairs but I wholeheartedly encourage you to have a go at repairing it yourself.
You're not going to learn anything otherwise.

Do you have access to a warm dry garage.
If not I'd leave it until the weather improves and squirt some wd40 all over it in the mean time.

[Andy 308GTB]

chazola said:

Don't let others put you off having a go, it's your car and everyone had to start learning somewhere....

....If you're on a budget I'd say have a go- if you've got the cash then bodyshop but like others have said I don't think it'll be cheap.

Definitely have a go.

See how you get on. You aren't going to make it any worse and if it all goes horribly wrong you can take it to a bodyshop and blame the previous owner. All you will have wasted is a few quid and a few hours of your time.

Just trying jobs like this will give you a better understanding and appreciation of what this work entails & what sort of results are acheivable. (i.e. you may learn enough to tackle smaller jobs in the future).

I have a go at anything - you'd be surprised how easy many jobs are.