5 speed box for Granada 2.8

[GrannieTwoEight]

Hi

I've been reading up on details about fitting a 5 speed box to the granada 2.8 I have - a MK2. Cannot figure out for the life of me what exact box it is.

From what I have ascertained so far I need a type 9 box but had read there was differences between the one fitted to OHC and V6 plus there is a type N, which appears to be the one fitted to the V6, but is commonly known as a type 9!! So every ad I see for a 5 speed ford box is a type 9 5 speed and I don't know (and owner potentially wont know) if it is a type 9 or type N (which will be rarer and may have been donored from a V6 for an OHC several owners back).

Secondly if I do get the right box how do I know what prop I need, would grannie auto prop or 4 speed 'E' type box fit?

Hopefully someone can help clarify this once and for all - how do I know what box to look for and the prop details.

There's a thread here on it but has just confused me more lol!

http://www.pistonheads.com/gassing/topic.asp?h=0&a...

G

[TheProfessor]

Hi,

The guys on here will no doubt be able to enlighten you:

http://www.oldskoolford.co.uk/ipb/index.php?/page/...

[S0 What]

You need a V6 type 9, type N is ford inhouse lable for the type 9 n being the first letter of NINE.
Your best bet is a capri 2.8i type 9 as only the granada sport had the manual V6 so rare as fairy farts and only the XR4i had the manual 2WD V6 box (again rare) in the sierra, Mk3 granada 2WD V6 were all auto so your window is narrow.
Do NOT accidently buy a diesel gearbox (same long input shaft as the V6 box but has really REALLY ste ratios

Read this first to help ID the box

http://croydon.amphibia.co.uk:76/pdf/type9.pdf

Prop wise, when i last did this to a granada i used a 4Cyl 5 speed propsahft (way way more common) that i had in the shed, so i know they fit, not sure on the auto prop they are usually longer than the manual prop and can catch the rear of the type9 as it is longer than the auto and 4 speed manual boxes BUT ! 90% of that experiance comes from cortinas and capris so i can not be 100% sure it wont work just offering that as a warning

[InitialDave]

What about an MT75 from a RWD Mk3 Granada, using the forward casing of the 4x4 version from a V6 manual? Would that work?

[finlo]

S0 What said:

You need a V6 type 9, type N is ford inhouse lable for the type 9 n being the first letter of NINE.
Your best bet is a capri 2.8i type 9 as only the granada sport had the manual V6 so rare as fairy farts and only the XR4i had the manual 2WD V6 box (again rare) in the sierra, Mk3 granada 2WD V6 were all auto so your window is narrow.
Do NOT accidently buy a diesel gearbox (same long input shaft as the V6 box but has really REALLY ste ratios

Read this first to help ID the box

http://croydon.amphibia.co.uk:76/pdf/type9.pdf

Prop wise, when i last did this to a granada i used a 4Cyl 5 speed propsahft (way way more common) that i had in the shed, so i know they fit, not sure on the auto prop they are usually longer than the manual prop and can catch the rear of the type9 as it is longer than the auto and 4 speed manual boxes BUT ! 90% of that experiance comes from cortinas and capris so i can not be 100% sure it wont work just offering that as a warning

I used to own a manual 2.3 v6 Sierra estate?

[finlo]

S0 What said:

You need a V6 type 9, type N is ford inhouse lable for the type 9 n being the first letter of NINE.
Your best bet is a capri 2.8i type 9 as only the granada sport had the manual V6 so rare as fairy farts and only the XR4i had the manual 2WD V6 box (again rare) in the sierra, Mk3 granada 2WD V6 were all auto so your window is narrow.
Do NOT accidently buy a diesel gearbox (same long input shaft as the V6 box but has really REALLY ste ratios

Read this first to help ID the box

http://croydon.amphibia.co.uk:76/pdf/type9.pdf

Prop wise, when i last did this to a granada i used a 4Cyl 5 speed propsahft (way way more common) that i had in the shed, so i know they fit, not sure on the auto prop they are usually longer than the manual prop and can catch the rear of the type9 as it is longer than the auto and 4 speed manual boxes BUT ! 90% of that experiance comes from cortinas and capris so i can not be 100% sure it wont work just offering that as a warning

I used to own a manual 2.3 v6 Sierra estate?

[simon3000]

the mk 3 12v granny was avaliable with a manual.thry only made them for a couple of years though

[S0 What]

Mk3 granny would be the MT75 and the only UK manual 2.8/9s were 4WD, manual was available for a while in police spec (SVO) and i've had one but so rare they are not even worth mentioning TBH.
The sierra 2.3 gearbox used the 4 cyl ratios and isn't suited to the 2.8/9 IMHO and again so rare as to make finding one compaired to the easyly available capri box ni on impossable, the odd one turns up every now and then but they were rare new and 25 years later ?

[XJ Flyer]

It's not clear wether you intend to convert an auto to manual or just replace a knackered box.If it's the former of those then it's probably better to just throw the whole lot and source a 302 V8 with the probably much more common easy to obtain manual box.

www.youtube.com/watch?v=FUpnxotJUHw

As for the latter in my case years ago in the day I replaced the knackered known weaker 5 speed with the older stronger 4 speed.

[GrannieTwoEight]

XJ Flyer said:

It's not clear wether you intend to convert an auto to manual or just replace a knackered box.If it's the former of those then it's probably better to just throw the whole lot and source a 302 V8 with the probably much more common easy to obtain manual box.

www.youtube.com/watch?v=FUpnxotJUHw

As for the latter in my case years ago in the day I replaced the knackered known weaker 5 speed with the older stronger 4 speed.

Replacing auto with manual. Yes this thought has crossed my mind about a V8 but cant be bothered with any more engine conversion work after spending so long building the engine up and getting it running right! Quite keen on keeping it as original as possible with the exception of the 5 speed box conversion.

Might go for 4 speed box if easier to get but really looking for the long legs of the 5 speed box.

Thanks for all the replies will check out those links.

G

[Hooli]

The 4cyl type nine does fit the v6. I know because I ran one in a xr4i for a while, no idea on the ratios etc and I doubt it's lifespan with the short input shaft not reaching the spigot bearing.

[GrannieTwoEight]

Hooli said:

The 4cyl type nine does fit the v6. I know because I ran one in a xr4i for a while, no idea on the ratios etc and I doubt it's lifespan with the short input shaft not reaching the spigot bearing.

Remember reading somewhere there was a mod you could do with bellhousing - or another bellhousing, that brings the shaft out and it fits a 2.8.

Don't know I probably would try one out a 2.0 as I don't hammer it anyway or use the car much, but I read that the ratios for 2.0 are different and don't suit the V6.

[Hooli]

GrannieTwoEight said:

Hooli said:

The 4cyl type nine does fit the v6. I know because I ran one in a xr4i for a while, no idea on the ratios etc and I doubt it's lifespan with the short input shaft not reaching the spigot bearing.

Remember reading somewhere there was a mod you could do with bellhousing - or another bellhousing, that brings the shaft out and it fits a 2.8.

Don't know I probably would try one out a 2.0 as I don't hammer it anyway or use the car much, but I read that the ratios for 2.0 are different and don't suit the V6.

I don't recall any difference in ratios, but it was years ago so I could well be wrong. That XR4i had the rear end off a XR4x4 to get the LSD anyway. That change gave it a different diff ratio & rear discs too. The LSD was all I wanted as it made it much easier to go everywhere sideways before chavs had heard of drifting

TBH I can't even recall if I changed the bellhousing over to do the swap. But I do recall the box was £40 not £150 from the local breakers.

[S0 What]

The 4 cyl type box will destroy it's inpust shaft bearings in short time not being supported by the crank, been there done it, you may get 100 miles you may get 1000 miles, the V6 B/H is deeper than the 4cyl B/H and the bolt patterns are differant so you cant use the 4Cyl B/H on the V6 engine you would nned a cut and shut B/H and then you would have the gearstick too far forward to come though the trans tunnel hole, really not worth it when v6 type 9 are pretty easy to find.
You could go MT75 but you'd need a prop making as the MT has no splined sliding joint on the back, either way converting from auto you will probably have to drill the bulkhead and make a mount for the clutch cable and change the pedal box to a manual one (try asking on ovalchat, banger racers seem to have all the granadas nowdays and they tend to sell parts off cheap after they have raced em

[MJG280]

I changed a 4 speed to 5 on a 1981 TVR Tasmin. Straightforward as I got the Type N from a crashed Tasmin. It bolted up with no problem and the prop fitted ok. The Gear lever was marginally further forward than previously, possibly 15mm. The speedo cable needed a new fitting at the gearbox end. As a temporary measure I cable tied the speed cable to the chassis. Worked ok

The gearbox was marked BA for V6 Other markings are as below

S9 Road ratios
C9 Close ratios
W9 Wide
BA V6
AA Pinto

Your problem nowadays is finding a gearbox in decent condition at a reasonable price

[GrannieTwoEight]

I have the chance to get a 5 spd box from a 1986 2.4 mk3 from Germany - this should fit the 2.8 ok? I remember reading the 2.4 box was ok - can't remember where I read that. I am asking the seller to send some pics of codes, is there any specific codes I should look for.

Thanks

Andrew

[GrannieTwoEight]

Hi

Just bumping this thread up to see if anyone can point me in right direction. As I said in last post I have a chance to get 5 speed box from MK3 2.4 but not sure if the box for this is more closer to the 2.3 box, which someone said above had 2.0 ratios and would not suit 2.8?

It certainly seems like a type 9 'N' box with the input shaft that protrudes from the bellhousing (will post pics but can't just now as in work) but the seller says it has 23 teeth on the shaft, which matches neither of the teeth count on the list here:

http://www.type9gearbox.co.uk/type-9-variations.ht...

19 Teeth for 2.8 and 18 teeth for 2.0 box.

Any ideas anyone?

thanks

Andrew

[DeanoX]

is 23 splines on the input shaft (which the clutch plate drives) i.e. outside the box

The 18/19 is the number of teeth on the first gear on the input shaft inside the box

[V8 Fettler]

If you run out of options with the 5 speed manual, why not consider the four speed auto A4LD? Earlier to avoid extensive electronicness, might have to modify the floor pan to accept A4LD gate,

[MJG280]

23 teeth on the input shaft is correct

The information that I have is that the 2.3/2.4 V6 used a different ratio to the 2.8 /2.9, and you will need to check that the gearbox you use has a mechanical speedo drive as the later MK3 Granny uses an electronic drive.