What constitutes a classic
Discussion
I'm sure this has been discussed before, but what makes a car a classic? Seems to me that many cars are now regarded as such simply because they are of a certain age. Is that enough though or should they bring more to the table than just age? Personally I feel that to be a classic, a car should be memorable for more than just its' age. I see many cars posted that I remember as just every day runaround transport from the days of my youth, and I can't get my head around the fact that Fiat Pandas et al are now seen as some sort of motoring milestone. So what are your thoughts. Is simply being X amount of years old sufficient or should there be more to it?
It's a never-ending discussion. Should a Minor be more of a classic somehow than an Allegro, should we celebrate the Mk3 Escort but ignore the Mk4, is it down to age, or rarity, or interesting-ness? I doubt there's going to be a conclusive answer - there never has been before. My view is that pretty much anything could be considered a classic if there's something a little 'different' about it - which might be its age, might be how few survivors there are, might even just be that a specific one has been owned continually for 30+ years, or just that a few people want to celebrate them.
It's a discussion that comes round regularly and normally ends up going round and round in circles with everyone involved justifying why their particular choice is "classic", much the same happens on other sites regarding what constitutes a "hot rod", "progressive rock", "fine wine" or "hi-fi". Me, I tend to use the dictionary definition which means that I am unlikely to ever own a proper classic (set new standards, quality of design or engineering etc. etc.)... but I do have a lot of fun playing with old cars. Right, back to the old jalopy...
The only deffinition that works for me is a old car that someone's willing to spend more on repairing than the car may end up being worth.
You can easilly pick holes in almost any other definition.
"Memorable for more than just its' age". What exactly was memorable about the Morris Minor/Triumph Herald/run-of-the-mill Ford Escorts? Still a classics in most people's book.
"rarity" - So the VW Beetle, Mini and Ford Model T aren't classics?
"interesting-ness" - subjective. Personally I don't 'get' 2-door Ford Escorts or see what's meant to be so interesting about them.
"any sort of car you remember from your youth" - subjective again. If I'm stood next to someone 10 years my junior at a car show we can both be looking at the same car and while for them it's a car from their youth (so a classic) but for me it's from my early adult-hood (so just an old car). The car is now like Schrodinger's cat - both a classic and a non-classic at the same time.
You can easilly pick holes in almost any other definition.
"Memorable for more than just its' age". What exactly was memorable about the Morris Minor/Triumph Herald/run-of-the-mill Ford Escorts? Still a classics in most people's book.
"rarity" - So the VW Beetle, Mini and Ford Model T aren't classics?
"interesting-ness" - subjective. Personally I don't 'get' 2-door Ford Escorts or see what's meant to be so interesting about them.
"any sort of car you remember from your youth" - subjective again. If I'm stood next to someone 10 years my junior at a car show we can both be looking at the same car and while for them it's a car from their youth (so a classic) but for me it's from my early adult-hood (so just an old car). The car is now like Schrodinger's cat - both a classic and a non-classic at the same time.
Sadly we only seem to have 1 word. I believe the German's have the concept of a "Young timer" for a more recent interesting car. I would consider my X300 Jag to be too new to be a classic, but if I was offered classic car insurance for it years ago. However with the X300 I couldn't have classic car insurance with business use, whereas for the XK150 business use was free, I believe the underwriter's comment was along the lines of "That sounds nice, I'd do that too". But by //j17 rule that I'd be prepared to spend more on it than it's current market value then my X300 would pass and I'd get murdered by LadyB8 if I tried to spend even fraction of the what the XK150 is worth.
I don't think you'll ever get two people to agree on a the definition of what constitutes a classic car. Even coming up with a definition that works only for yourself is hard enough for no sooner have you decided on the rules you'll find an exception.
I don't think you'll ever get two people to agree on a the definition of what constitutes a classic car. Even coming up with a definition that works only for yourself is hard enough for no sooner have you decided on the rules you'll find an exception.
These things always have different meanings depending on who you ask - what's a supercar is another example.
With old cars its a little strange in the sense that there are veteran and vintage vehicles, which seem to be defined by age, with anything newer falling into the "classic" category where there is no real definition.
I like cars and in particular older ones, whether classic by everyone's definition or not. There were lots of cars I never liked when I was younger but when I go to shows or see one on the road I am glad we are all different and someone felt they were worth saving.
With old cars its a little strange in the sense that there are veteran and vintage vehicles, which seem to be defined by age, with anything newer falling into the "classic" category where there is no real definition.
I like cars and in particular older ones, whether classic by everyone's definition or not. There were lots of cars I never liked when I was younger but when I go to shows or see one on the road I am glad we are all different and someone felt they were worth saving.
LordBretSinclair said:
It's very very simple Russ.
On this forum any mundane, ordinary piece of sh*te whether it was made by BL, Vauxhall, Ford etc magically becomes a "classic" overnight when it's 25 years old.
That's interesting view, equally I am not sure that just because something is expensive or out of the ordinary it is any more deserving of the label.On this forum any mundane, ordinary piece of sh*te whether it was made by BL, Vauxhall, Ford etc magically becomes a "classic" overnight when it's 25 years old.
stuartmmcfc said:
Someone once suggested to me a classic car is one that has a club for it.
I thought this was pretty accurate.
Mebbe in pre-web-forum days, but...I thought this was pretty accurate.
http://www.daciaownersclub.com/
http://www.kiaownersclub.co.uk/
http://www.hyundaiownersclub.co.uk/
What about the Austin A35? Only ever designed as a mundane and utterly forgettable runaround, and frankly fairly hideous too look at. Now suddenly it's a race car with a whole series and an academy built around it! Sorry, I just don't see it. With the greatest of respect to those involved and who no doubt have a great time racing them.............then again I might have just answered my own question!
I can't be doing with snobbery or elitism, coming as I do from a very modest background and having done it the hard way, but nonetheless, I still adhere to the ethos that a classic has to have a certain extra something other than years under its' belt and that other cars of a similar vintage just don't possess.
Mishima thinks along the same lines as me methinks.
I can't be doing with snobbery or elitism, coming as I do from a very modest background and having done it the hard way, but nonetheless, I still adhere to the ethos that a classic has to have a certain extra something other than years under its' belt and that other cars of a similar vintage just don't possess.
Mishima thinks along the same lines as me methinks.
It's all down to personal preference . Many BL products from the 70's and 80'sare now fairly rare , are they classics ?
Escorts and such are pretty plentiful but are regarded as classics .
I personally cannot see the attractions of Triumph Stags .
Vauxhall Cavaliers were coveted as company cars when they first came out but not very highly prized now .
Luckily we have freedom of choice to spend more and more money on the thing blocking the drive or garage , thats if the OH never finds out .
Escorts and such are pretty plentiful but are regarded as classics .
I personally cannot see the attractions of Triumph Stags .
Vauxhall Cavaliers were coveted as company cars when they first came out but not very highly prized now .
Luckily we have freedom of choice to spend more and more money on the thing blocking the drive or garage , thats if the OH never finds out .
Never really thought of a definition of 'classic' in relation to cars. I always thought it was too personal to decide.
But does a car (or type of car) reach classic status when you consider the value reaches a point of inflexion on its depreciation? (ie the value starts rising again - potentially based on guides). So a particular car could be a classic whilst others of the same model might not due to particular provenance 9ownership/ historic rallying etc?).
I have a 34 year old vehicle but I don't really think of it as a classic. To be fair some examples that are still on the road are tatty, dragging prices down - thus potentially not a classic??
Anyone think of exceptions to this general rule?
Mike
But does a car (or type of car) reach classic status when you consider the value reaches a point of inflexion on its depreciation? (ie the value starts rising again - potentially based on guides). So a particular car could be a classic whilst others of the same model might not due to particular provenance 9ownership/ historic rallying etc?).
I have a 34 year old vehicle but I don't really think of it as a classic. To be fair some examples that are still on the road are tatty, dragging prices down - thus potentially not a classic??
Anyone think of exceptions to this general rule?
Mike
I think a classic needs to be iconic, to represent something. But not necessarily Goodwood, it can be an icon of an era, Mini does it for the sixties, but so does just about anything else that was around then individual cars were iconic of the individual experience. Hillman Minx on the beach, that sort of thing. Nothing to do with good cars or bad cars, just if they mean something to someone .
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