So what's wrong with IT?
Discussion
Totally agree with all of the above, if you want to be 5 grand worse off/spend 3 years to get a fairly worthless qualification go ahead.
As an IT Manager I only hire people that can do the job, don't care what qualifications they have, a guy who works with me at present has no IT quals, and at 22 hardly any commercial experience, but has taught himself over the years by building stuff at home/reading manuals and frankly he is a lot more knowledgeable than some graduates I've known.
Incidentally I got started in 1st line support, gives you a good broad grounding especially if you work for a large company/public sector.
As an IT Manager I only hire people that can do the job, don't care what qualifications they have, a guy who works with me at present has no IT quals, and at 22 hardly any commercial experience, but has taught himself over the years by building stuff at home/reading manuals and frankly he is a lot more knowledgeable than some graduates I've known.
Incidentally I got started in 1st line support, gives you a good broad grounding especially if you work for a large company/public sector.
There is no money in IT.
All those dreams of easy money for exciting work are just that - dreams.
There's still money in business. Even the IT business. But, as Matt pointed out about contractors, it can be hard to distinguish your, totally expert, professional, hardworking and competent software company from the bunch up the road offering to do it for a quarter the money - despite the fact it will never work.
Sometimes I despair.
Other times I bank the big cheques.
All those dreams of easy money for exciting work are just that - dreams.
There's still money in business. Even the IT business. But, as Matt pointed out about contractors, it can be hard to distinguish your, totally expert, professional, hardworking and competent software company from the bunch up the road offering to do it for a quarter the money - despite the fact it will never work.
Sometimes I despair.
Other times I bank the big cheques.
The key corporate IT skill, is the ability to recognise those in power, who also know nothing about technology, and feeding them with bulls**t.
It's an expanding industry with too few skilled people, what else can you expect?
It's bad if you're at the peer level, you know what you're doing, and you're not really looking for promotion into managerial tree, or expect to achieve promotion on the basis of worth.
It's why I'm out, and better off (although not financially). Peace of mind is a very valuable commodity, so I have got a very high degree of value for money.
I might even retrain as a plumber!
It's an expanding industry with too few skilled people, what else can you expect?
It's bad if you're at the peer level, you know what you're doing, and you're not really looking for promotion into managerial tree, or expect to achieve promotion on the basis of worth.
It's why I'm out, and better off (although not financially). Peace of mind is a very valuable commodity, so I have got a very high degree of value for money.
I might even retrain as a plumber!
Chap I work with was telling me about an MCSE/MSDBA paper waving, thought he knew it all type who got booted yesterday.
Despite the bits of paper he spent the best part of an afternoon puzzling over how it was possible for two machines to have the same IP address (they didn't, he was looking at the default gateway). He also took an afternoon of someones time learning what tables were and how to configure a backup (in SQL server).
The company showing him the door have now written a short technical questionaire for candidates to answer prior to interview.
Despite the bits of paper he spent the best part of an afternoon puzzling over how it was possible for two machines to have the same IP address (they didn't, he was looking at the default gateway). He also took an afternoon of someones time learning what tables were and how to configure a backup (in SQL server).
The company showing him the door have now written a short technical questionaire for candidates to answer prior to interview.
Mark.S said:
The company showing him the door have now written a short technical questionaire for candidates to answer prior to interview.
I have started to get all prospective contractors/employees to do this. The ones that complain are the ones who can't answer or don't want to have to earn their daily rate.
Due to it being a specialist field, they won't find the answers on t'internet either.
The problem with IT is that there are too many people chasing too few jobs. I've got 5 years of education, plus eight years industy experience, and I get paid 27K. Not a bad salary, but hardly top money considering.
I'd love to go into business, or retrain to do something less frustrating, but I've got a mental block on ideas at the moment
I'd love to go into business, or retrain to do something less frustrating, but I've got a mental block on ideas at the moment
Interesting quote on IT graduates on Radio 4 this week.
UK IT graduates last year: 8,000.
India IT graduates last year: 870,000.
Although it does depend if you want an IT graduate who knows where Manchester is...
The real trick is not to know MS/Unix/IT/whatever, but to blend a real perception of business need with the right solution - technology is almost irrelevant.
Thats where the money is...
UK IT graduates last year: 8,000.
India IT graduates last year: 870,000.
Although it does depend if you want an IT graduate who knows where Manchester is...
The real trick is not to know MS/Unix/IT/whatever, but to blend a real perception of business need with the right solution - technology is almost irrelevant.
Thats where the money is...
Witchfinder said:In my humble opinion, the problem with IT is that people think 8 years experience is a lot, it isn't. I know you weren't suggesting it is but I'm still learning after 15 years and have more to learn (and I don't just mean new technologies but how to apply it). This I can deal with but what really gets on my tits is when a manager looks for a contractor with 3-4 years experience and expects them to do a proper job and this keeps me out of work. Firstly for the guy with 3-4 years experience is lying, second the manager is dreaming, thirdly their company is just being cheap. Writing proper software is difficult, takes time and (most importantly) requires decent people at all levels. People pay for it one way or another so why don't they just pay for a proper job rather than pay for it during an extended test (bodge) cycle?
The problem with IT is that there are too many people chasing too few jobs. I've got 5 years of education, plus eight years industy experience, and I get paid 27K. Not a bad salary, but hardly top money considering.
Rant over.
Regards,
Mark
dern said:
The problem with IT is that there are too many people chasing too few jobs. I've got 5 years of education, plus eight years industy experience, and I get paid 27K. Not a bad salary, but hardly top money considering.
In my humble opinion, the problem with IT is that people think 8 years experience is a lot, it isn't. I know you weren't suggesting it is but I'm still learning after 15 years and have more to learn (and I don't just mean new technologies but how to apply it). This I can deal with but what really gets on my tits is when a manager looks for a contractor with 3-4 years experience and expects them to do a proper job and this keeps me out of work. Firstly for the guy with 3-4 years experience is lying, second the manager is dreaming, thirdly their company is just being cheap. Writing proper software is difficult, takes time and (most importantly) requires decent people at all levels. People pay for it one way or another so why don't they just pay for a proper job rather than pay for it during an extended test (bodge) cycle?
Rant over.
Regards,
Mark
I couldn't agree with that more.
Politics from ignorant management always ends up with decent people trying to fix crap software, rather than writing good stuff in half the time.
I think thats why MS is producing so much crap these days myself. To me they seem to have gone into "Jabber".
Once normal people comprehend that this is whats happened, it'll be good for an awful lot of decent IT people.
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