can't stand this place anymore

can't stand this place anymore

Author
Discussion

Le Pop

4,492 posts

233 months

Thursday 11th December 2014
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Le Pop said:
Time for a little moan from me. Now I know the French are paranoid about losing their language, I know that. But in the uk we provide translations (into all sorts of languages!) in significant/official situations, but nowhere in France is there any concession to those of us who grapple with the language a bit. Even official letters/documents are often written in a tiny or unusual font which doesn't scan well, so google translate can't be used. Now this morning I've had a telephone message left that needs me to ring a number to confirm an ERDF appointment, but I have to ring back on one of the most complicated numbers I've ever heard. I've re-listened to the message about eight times now and still can't definitely get the number. Grrrrr.
Well, it turns out that was a scam call. The number she told me to call back on was an 0899 premium rate line, not ERDF at all. Live and learn....

AndrewCrown

2,280 posts

113 months

Thursday 11th December 2014
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I was going to have a little rant about Avis at Merignac Airport on my last visit. I always order a C Class Mercedes for the weekend... However I was presented with a Skoda Octavia automatic 1.6tdi..... I argued that these were not the same type of car... But they responded in a computer says 'non' attitude ... Saying the Octavia and c class were both large cars and automatic therefore in same class...of rental...the Octavia was actually quite good....

However.... Today I turned up with my BA pre paid voucher...at the 'preferred' desk. Firstly they accused me of not having a booking... Then not being a preferred member.... It's weird I am there every three weeks.....
Then bizarrely she said I have a little present for you and handed me the keys to a box fresh Mercedes ML 350... No extra charge...Kind of cool....

Driller

Original Poster:

8,310 posts

277 months

Friday 12th December 2014
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Here's my latest. Brace yourselves hehe

Went to FNAC this evening. You know, FNAC, that upmarket store that positions itself in the upper echelons of product quality and customer service with a price that generally follows suite?

We had ordered and paid for a Macbook Air on the FNAC website and went to the local store to collect it. Stood in a very long queue with the baby strapped to me because due to the ridiculous URSSAF charges they can't afford to have enough staff.

Showed the documents they asked us to bring to prove we had paid: carte identité, carte banquaire and the code form the website we were given upon purchase. Guy checks the documents, says all ok, and we leave with the computer. We walk out of the shop past the security, nothing goes beep on the way out.

We get 10 paces and the security guy shouts "monsieur, I need to stamp your receipt".

You have to know we have been walking around the shops for hours, me with a 1 year old strapped to me, and we've paid for this very expensive Apple computer. I'm not interest in having my facture "stamped" (his words).

So we continue walking to the car and get a few more paces and the guy shouts again "Monsieur, il faut mettre un tampon". Now I've really had enough of this bullst and ask him if he's accusing me of stealing the computer. He says "non" so we walk on. A few meters to go to the car and two security guys run out of the shop towards us shouting again about the now famous stamp on the receipt.

I take the computer from my wife, go around the back of the Audi, open the motorised boot and put it inside. I push the button for it to close and the tt puts his hand in just before it closes. I yell at him to pull it out but he ignores me and of course the boot closes and traps his finger.

I open it slightly to release his finger and immediately close it again with the computer safely inside.

Now I go to get in the front seat of the car with my 1 year old baby still strapped to me and the wker blocks the door and places his hands on the car. I'm not an idiot and certainly not interested in getting in a fight with baby on me so I ask him to take his hands off my car and stop blocking my way. He moves away and I get the car door open and then he pushes towards me pushing up against the baby.

I complain and he moves away and I sit in the front seat. However he then grabs the door and won't let me close it.

During all this I must have asked 10 times if I was suspected of stealing anything and they replied "non".

By this time I am so outraged by this aggression that I am in no mood for cooperation. All I want to do is get the hell out of there. I had done nothing wrong, not broken any laws, just paid for and collected goods which were now mine and wanted to go home. I considered started the engine and pulling away but with the risk of injury to him decided against it.

I had given the baby to my wife by this time and she'd put her in the back baby seat.

The director of the shop then arrives and tries to calm things down by saying "you have to understand we have theft sometimes". I tell him I'm not interested in his theft problems and if that's the way they treat paying customers then they deserve to go out of business. I had paid for my goods and had done nothing wrong and wasn't being accused of anything so why had these apes accosted me and my family?

Yes of course I could have just coughed up my papers like a good boy when called to but FFS why should I? Why should paying customers be treated like that?

Anyway the director was very apologetic (although I wasn't having any of it) and said to come back another day and he would give us "recompense".

Ah, commerce in France in all its glory.

A Common Lawyer, any idea what the legal situation is with this? Assault, false imprisonement? (yeah, yeah, I know, I'm just very angry). I'm going to speak to a lawyer friend tomorrow.







Edited by Driller on Friday 12th December 21:23

Geekman

2,863 posts

145 months

Friday 12th December 2014
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No sympathy from me on that one I'm afraid. Stamping the receipt would have taken what, one minute? Instead you've decided to be awkward and turn a simple mistake on their part into a massive fiasco.

It's one thing to complain about certain aspects of french life (in fact, I totally agree with a lot of your complaints) but I'm afraid in that situation it just looks like you were going out of your way to cause trouble and found out they were more than happy to give you some.

crossy67

1,570 posts

178 months

Friday 12th December 2014
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Geekman said:
No sympathy from me on that one I'm afraid. Stamping the receipt would have taken what, one minute? Instead you've decided to be awkward and turn a simple mistake on their part into a massive fiasco.

It's one thing to complain about certain aspects of french life (in fact, I totally agree with a lot of your complaints) but I'm afraid in that situation it just looks like you were going out of your way to cause trouble and found out they were more than happy to give you some.
clap

Driller

Original Poster:

8,310 posts

277 months

Friday 12th December 2014
quotequote all
Geekman said:
No sympathy from me on that one I'm afraid. Stamping the receipt would have taken what, one minute? Instead you've decided to be awkward and turn a simple mistake on their part into a massive fiasco.

It's one thing to complain about certain aspects of french life (in fact, I totally agree with a lot of your complaints) but I'm afraid in that situation it just looks like you were going out of your way to cause trouble and found out they were more than happy to give you some.
No security alert sounded, no-one told us we'd have to show our papers on the way out. We'd brought something in good faith and were minding our own business.

If you're happy to pay money and be treated like cattle by a couple of heavies at the door of , that's up to you. Every other shop seems to manage to make it work without effectively frisking their customers at the door.

Fair enough for your point of view, I knew it would be controversial story to tell but just another brick in the wall as far as I'l concerned.

ETA BTW you did realise that "stamping the receipt" was a euphemism for "making sure I'm not a dirty thief" right?

Edited by Driller on Friday 12th December 22:44

Fatt McMissile

330 posts

132 months

Friday 12th December 2014
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Awesome Driller! You showed 'em!
I especially liked the bit about pushing the button to close the boot (I haven't got one of those buttons) and the guy putting his hand in.
What did your wife say/think?
Stewie

Driller

Original Poster:

8,310 posts

277 months

Friday 12th December 2014
quotequote all
Not sure that's irony or not Stewie wink.

I don't know about showing them but I am of course regretting sticking to my principles (I can be a bit Aspergersy) but actually the Frenchy wife agreed with me that it's ridiculous we had to prove purchase when we collected the goods inside the shop and once again at the door whereas no other shop we know of has to do this.

She's now getting excited at the prospect of getting free stuff out of the shop for our trouble FFS!

I still don't get it and am trying to imagine the furore if they tried it in an Apple Store or, say, John Lewis.

Fatt McMissile

330 posts

132 months

Friday 12th December 2014
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[quote=Driller]Not sure that's irony or not Stewie wink.

quote]

It's American fCs they don't have irony....

Stevie

Fatt McMissile

330 posts

132 months

Friday 12th December 2014
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I like you Driller, but I wouldn't like you to do anything to my teeth....
Stewie
or Steve too

Driller

Original Poster:

8,310 posts

277 months

Friday 12th December 2014
quotequote all
Certainly not guaranteed that I would want to tongue out

Fatt McMissile

330 posts

132 months

Friday 12th December 2014
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nice teeth mate...good breath....

Driller

Original Poster:

8,310 posts

277 months

Friday 12th December 2014
quotequote all
hehe

AndrewCrown

2,280 posts

113 months

Friday 12th December 2014
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Sir....I think you had a bit of an 'i paddy'

Driller

Original Poster:

8,310 posts

277 months

Saturday 13th December 2014
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Yeah, I know what you mean. It's been a hard week. I do appreciate the ihumour though smile

In the clarity of morning light it would have been better to demand the manager and complain to him rather than sticking to principles and continuing to walk to the car. It's typical French ambiguity though: we say we have no suspicion of you stealing anything but you're going to be roughed up by a couple of heavies until you prove you haven't.

For Steve "Fat Mcmissile"and a few, you've disagreed with my POV from the start of this thread, so I certainly didn't expect any agreement from you on this even if no-one else agrees either.

This has become a nice little outlet to have a spleen vent about France though which really helps.


Driller

Original Poster:

8,310 posts

277 months

Saturday 13th December 2014
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Had a word with my lawyer friend this morning and he confirmed to me that what they did was absolutely illegal. The goods were legally mine and they had no right to ask me for anything let alone lay a hand on me or the car.

If they had suspected me of stealing they could have made a citizen's arrest but if shown to be without evidence or proven otherwise, the st hits the fan for them.

He's going to write them a legal type email, should be interesting but I haven't got the time or the desire to pursue it further. I'm not interested in anything except maybe an explanation from the director and to tell him they need to review their Nazi door policy.

I've known him for a while but have just discovered that this sort of totalitarian thing (his words) is a pet hate and drives him insane too. When he gets asked to turn out his bag when he walks into a store in his leathers or followed by 5 security guys into the store because he didn't hear them ask this, whilst everyone else walks through un-harassed, he flashes his card and they immediately back off. Funny that.


rdjohn

6,135 posts

194 months

Saturday 13th December 2014
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So, what happened to the season of goodwill to all men?

The guys you are referring to are probably at the bottom rung of the employment ladder; low wages, flexible hour contracts and a crap task, yet still willing to risk loosing their fingers in your fancy boot just to do their employers bidding. Is it not you who is now adopting the arrogant attitude of the intolerant Parisian, that much of this thread is aimed at?

Having a pop at over paid, under worked civil-servants is one thing, but it really is unfair not to recognise that the ability to walk into FNAC to buy a high end laptop, does not excuse you from failing to stop for a brief moment, when asked, and have your reciept stamped like everyone else. It just is not such a big deal in the scheme of things.

Russwhitehouse

962 posts

130 months

Saturday 13th December 2014
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I think it extremely unlikely that the security guards are on any form of dodgy contract or are considered bottom of any ladder. Such things don't exist in France.
Saying that, I think you overreacted a tad there driller. The stamping bits of paper bullst is nothing new, especially at Christmas. Far easier and less stressful to just let them do their thing and go on your way with jaunty bonne journée. At the risk of sounding patronising, be careful not to go out of your way to find things to be pissed off and annoyed with. There is plenty of it every day without looking for more. There comes a time when going with the flow makes life easier for everyone (says Mr calm and pious!)

Geekman

2,863 posts

145 months

Saturday 13th December 2014
quotequote all
Driller said:
No security alert sounded, no-one told us we'd have to show our papers on the way out. We'd brought something in good faith and were minding our own business.

If you're happy to pay money and be treated like cattle by a couple of heavies at the door of , that's up to you. Every other shop seems to manage to make it work without effectively frisking their customers at the door.

Fair enough for your point of view, I knew it would be controversial story to tell but just another brick in the wall as far as I'l concerned.

ETA BTW you did realise that "stamping the receipt" was a euphemism for "making sure I'm not a dirty thief" right?

Edited by Driller on Friday 12th December 22:44
Haha, yes, of course I realised that! I suspect if you adopted a similar attitude in England and challenged anything and everything which offended your principles, you'd find just as many things to complain about. As I said before, France isn't perfect, and I agree with a lot of what you've said previously, but when you move to a new country, there's a definite element of your experience being what you make it.

Driller

Original Poster:

8,310 posts

277 months

Saturday 13th December 2014
quotequote all
rdjohn said:
So, what happened to the season of goodwill to all men?

The guys you are referring to are probably at the bottom rung of the employment ladder; low wages, flexible hour contracts and a crap task, yet still willing to risk loosing their fingers in your fancy boot just to do their employers bidding. Is it not you who is now adopting the arrogant attitude of the intolerant Parisian, that much of this thread is aimed at?

Having a pop at over paid, under worked civil-servants is one thing, but it really is unfair not to recognise that the ability to walk into FNAC to buy a high end laptop, does not excuse you from failing to stop for a brief moment, when asked, and have your reciept stamped like everyone else. It just is not such a big deal in the scheme of things.
I hear you John but know that the treatment I ask from others is no more than and certainly not as much as the politeness, respect and goodwill I extend to them.

If you asked any of my patients they will tell you that. I came to work this morning to fit a bridge for a patient so that she would have it for christmas (I don't come in on weekends normally).

I give out a mobile number so that patients can call me at home in the evenings. I will often call them myself from home in the evening after surgery to find out how they are.

If I treated my patients anywhere near as badly as that they would tell me to get lost and rightly so.

Policing and roughing up customers is not on and my friend has confirmed this. If it happened in the UK it wouldn't be on either but in France the two heavies at the door is a much commoner occurrence.

Both you and Steve have mentioned my "fancy" automatic tailgate- is this some kind of strange jealousy or something? It's very odd, a lot of cars have this system these days. That guy had no right to put his hand on me or on the car or in the boot. He has no more right to do that than any of the people in the street.

Yes, I felt a little bad for him but it was his own stupid fault, even if it was just a pinch that he was playing on.

I dunno maybe it's an Ile de France thing getting harassed at the door by these guys.

How does it work in the shops in Province?


Edited by Driller on Saturday 13th December 16:15