Dunlop 24 Hour April 23rd to 26th 2015

Dunlop 24 Hour April 23rd to 26th 2015

Author
Discussion

parkpre

7 posts

108 months

Monday 27th April 2015
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indigorallye said:
I'm not sure myself!
mike
a
t
106
maxi.co
.uk
On their way....

Paul Dishman

4,701 posts

237 months

Monday 27th April 2015
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markbates said:
Was this event really as good as its been made out, I didn't come down based on the poor entry list. With only 14 cars finishing and being spread over such a big track no cars on the same lap and 5 different classes (only 2 of the finishers didn't win a trophy). I would have thought the people in the safety car were up for a top place finish. A lot of promises and wild statements seem to be made in press releases prior to this meeting and non seem to come through. I cant see it being run again unfortunately as it just cant be paying its way. And I heard that all the grandstands were shut during the night so spectators that did go had to stand in the rain if they wanted to watch the safety car drive round.....
I will declare an interest here as James Tucker is my brother in law. We were discussing the thin field on Saturday and James said that he had had many discussions with drivers and teams at the Autosport Show in January, but only about 30% of those who had said that would definitely enter a car actually did so.

indigorallye

555 posts

225 months

Monday 27th April 2015
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He told me that 80 teams had entered in January.
Shame really, their loss as we had a great time.

hazy

1,173 posts

268 months

Tuesday 28th April 2015
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The sooner Creventic do a deal with Silverstone the better, bigger grids and I cant see them allowing teams to be kicked off halfway through the race....disgraceful state of affairs and the reason I wont be doing the Silverstone 24 in its current format

andy97

4,703 posts

222 months

Tuesday 28th April 2015
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hazy said:
The sooner Creventic do a deal with Silverstone the better, bigger grids and I cant see them allowing teams to be kicked off halfway through the race....disgraceful state of affairs and the reason I wont be doing the Silverstone 24 in its current format
It would certainly seem to make sense if Silverstone 24 was part of a 12/24 hour international series, but maybe a 24 hour race is just too expensive for the UK market and maybe they should stick to 12?

What are you referring to with the comment about "teams being kicked off ", I have not seen a reference to that elsewhere.

SpeckledJim

31,608 posts

253 months

Tuesday 28th April 2015
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Myself and a couple of mates were there as spectators. We were very pleased with the breadth of the entries, especially the Fiesta, 968 and Marcos entries. But twice as many cars, preferably toward the normal end of things, would be nice to see.

That said, learning that the Fiesta team used so many wheel bearings was a good illustration that the necessary level of cost and preparation means we will never be entering, not even with an Avis Astra on a weekend deal, so fair play to anyone that makes it to the start line.

Once we had popped back to the campsite for dinner and the heavens opened we sheepishly decided not to head back to the track that night, so learning that they had closed all the grandstands in a downpour is interesting.

Did someone get black-flagged? We caught half a message on the tannoy about it, but never worked out what if anything had happened.

indigorallye

555 posts

225 months

Tuesday 28th April 2015
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We only did so many bearings due to a cock up early in the weekend.
Once the crew realised the cock up we were fine.

Other than the bearings we changed a driveshaft and an ABS sensor.

Don't be put off, it's achievable and should be promoted better within the lower budgets of Motorsport.

SpeckledJim

31,608 posts

253 months

Tuesday 28th April 2015
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Out of interest, and no bother if you would rather not, but can you give a ballpark figure on what the whole shebang cost?


Obiwonkeyblokey

5,399 posts

240 months

Tuesday 28th April 2015
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One car was black flagged for noise around 7pm, BMW M3 I believe, another driver ( speedworks Aston) was removed from the event for " causing an avoidable collission" aka, destroying a Marcos through lack of observation.

AndyAlfa18

52 posts

125 months

Tuesday 28th April 2015
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Paul Dishman said:
markbates said:
Was this event really as good as its been made out, I didn't come down based on the poor entry list. With only 14 cars finishing and being spread over such a big track no cars on the same lap and 5 different classes (only 2 of the finishers didn't win a trophy). I would have thought the people in the safety car were up for a top place finish. A lot of promises and wild statements seem to be made in press releases prior to this meeting and non seem to come through. I cant see it being run again unfortunately as it just cant be paying its way. And I heard that all the grandstands were shut during the night so spectators that did go had to stand in the rain if they wanted to watch the safety car drive round.....
I will declare an interest here as James Tucker is my brother in law. We were discussing the thin field on Saturday and James said that he had had many discussions with drivers and teams at the Autosport Show in January, but only about 30% of those who had said that would definitely enter a car actually did so.
Paul, with respect, you can't hold non existant people responsible for the low turn out!!

Its the responsiblity of the Promoter to make the event attractive & cost effective enough for people to follow through on their word & enter - and clearly Britcar is not engaging with their audience (for whatever reason). Noone said it was easy, and it was good to see some high profile entries and it was good for the event to have Beechdean winning it, but more needs to be done.

Devil is in the detail, and things like charging teams £100 for motorhome slots in the paddock is taking the piss, and this is just one example of continually battering the few (who entered) for more and more income.

We proudly took our place on the grid (#66 SEAT) because of a long association with Britcar. But the Silverstone race weekend is 50% more expensive than Barcelona 24, and the same price as Dubai 24 (for a low budget team transporting minimal equipement to Dubai). And that is the fact - its too expensive for what it is & the experience that you have.

arabian

503 posts

175 months

Tuesday 28th April 2015
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Firstly, well done to the fiesta boys, great effort. I popped over to the garage but it all seemed rather frenetic at that point (possibly one of the bearing issues...) so briefly chatted to one of your mechanics to wish you luck.

As a spectator i was disappointed with the lack of 'entertainment' laid on by silverstone compared to other events but of course its a catch 22, they need increased support to make money to supply more food kiosks, retail options, beer tents etc, but to sell more tickets they need reason for people to come. car displays would have been something and free to organise, but there was nothing to encourage families or non-race fanatics to attend.

another gripe was the shocking access to the track from the snoozeboxes which have been moved from the infield to outside the circuit at Club. The "Social Hub" at snoozebox had a bar, did food, and had a terrace above the bar which gave you a restricted view of club chicane between 2 granstands. a good facility. Next to the "Social Hub" was a turnstile which only allowed exit from the track not into it, the gates adajacent were padlocked. So, despite being the default onsite accommodation, we had to walk down the road, round the outside of the track and into the main entrance which was rubbish.

the grandstands were prety much empty and were closed from 10pm. For a 24 hour race this is disgraceful, especially when it started hammering down with rain, which simply made everyone head for a bar (or home) rather than continue to watch the race - i think that is missing the point somewhat if they want to encourage increased numbers.

Overall it was a good weekend and i am glad i went, but to my mind the venue needs to invest in the event if they are to encourage a larger grid of cars.

SpeckledJim

31,608 posts

253 months

Tuesday 28th April 2015
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We were a 15 minute walk from the track and if we had decided to brave the rain and head back to the track after dinner to find all the grandstands shut, I think we would have been a bit pissed off. Especially when the ticket said something like "roving grandstand access" and we didnt see any warning that they would be closed.

As it was, we were playing cards in a tent, so it didnt make much odds! Hard-core race fans, you see...

Ash MP4 12C

Original Poster:

3,836 posts

241 months

Tuesday 28th April 2015
quotequote all
arabian said:
Firstly, well done to the fiesta boys, great effort. I popped over to the garage but it all seemed rather frenetic at that point (possibly one of the bearing issues...) so briefly chatted to one of your mechanics to wish you luck.

As a spectator i was disappointed with the lack of 'entertainment' laid on by silverstone compared to other events but of course its a catch 22, they need increased support to make money to supply more food kiosks, retail options, beer tents etc, but to sell more tickets they need reason for people to come. car displays would have been something and free to organise, but there was nothing to encourage families or non-race fanatics to attend.

another gripe was the shocking access to the track from the snoozeboxes which have been moved from the infield to outside the circuit at Club. The "Social Hub" at snoozebox had a bar, did food, and had a terrace above the bar which gave you a restricted view of club chicane between 2 granstands. a good facility. Next to the "Social Hub" was a turnstile which only allowed exit from the track not into it, the gates adajacent were padlocked. So, despite being the default onsite accommodation, we had to walk down the road, round the outside of the track and into the main entrance which was rubbish.

the grandstands were prety much empty and were closed from 10pm. For a 24 hour race this is disgraceful, especially when it started hammering down with rain, which simply made everyone head for a bar (or home) rather than continue to watch the race - i think that is missing the point somewhat if they want to encourage increased numbers.

Overall it was a good weekend and i am glad i went, but to my mind the venue needs to invest in the event if they are to encourage a larger grid of cars.
Typical Silverstone, not a thought for the fans, closing the stands, probably a health and safety thing, complete cock and balls.



Jon280

195 posts

137 months

Tuesday 28th April 2015
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I was at the race as a spectator after having been to a few of them before. We planned our trip quite meticulously as the plan was to be track-side for the entire 24hrs of the race. We went fully prepared with food, a camping stove, full waterproofs and plenty of layers of clothing, umbrellas and chairs, and plenty of beer and other warming beverages.

After some nice weather to start, and some time spent at Copse, when it started raining, we were round by the Hanger straight, and managed to find a small grandstand on the inside of the track (over the bridge) that was not locked, so spent quite a while there watching the safety car periods. We then wandered on further round, and found that the far end of the Club/International Pits grandstand had an open gate, so took cover in there for a while as well till the rain eased off a bit. By this point we had heard on the commentary that the Woodcote grandstand had been shut (to be fair, the signs on it said this would be shutting at 11pm, but James Tucker had also said on the commentary it would be open all night...) so set up with our chairs and umbrellas for a while there.

Overall we all enjoyed the race, and some of the group did manage to be at the track for the full race, but it was rather cold and having a grandstand or two open at different points would have provided some shelter which would have been good.

We did note there was a lot less 'entertainment' this year, unless you wanted to buy a model car of a rug, and lots less food vendors, though with less spectators this is to be expected, and we were not relying on them.

Our main annoyance was the commentary. Before the commentary has always been broadcast on FM, and so we expected the same this year, but our trusty ebay special radios were FM only, and the commetary was on AM. The Silverstone shop only had FM radios, so a trip on Sat morning to Argos was required to get something we could listen to it on overnight. The commentators though were ace and provided lots of amusement, particularly in the early hours of the morning!

The race - We enjoyed there being quite a mix of cars, yes, more would have been nice, but we enjoyed ourselves, particularly seeing the Ginetta race off, then have issues, and the Audi and Aston battling it out, not forgetting of course the Fiesta plodding around. We were disappointed not to see any Moslers, and the Jazz from a couple of years ago. The numbers on the side of the cars showing their position were brilliant, and really helped to keep a track of what was going on.

For us as spectators, it would be nice if there were more people around. It was quite busy at the start of the race, but then seemed deserted most of the rest of the time, and quite thin on the ground in the Grandstand at the finish line for the end of the race. It was also a struggle to hear what was happening on the Podium as the PA in the grandstand was turned off at this point, so had to rely on the speakers on the podium only, which were quite a way from us.

Our feelings were that it needs to build momentum, and that is only going to happen if it is every year, and not things like the 1000km race instead of a full 24hr. We are hoping that it will be back next year, though it would be nice if it was in July for a better chance of good weather!!!



markbates

90 posts

135 months

Tuesday 28th April 2015
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hazy said:
The sooner Creventic do a deal with Silverstone the better, bigger grids and I cant see them allowing teams to be kicked off halfway through the race....disgraceful state of affairs and the reason I wont be doing the Silverstone 24 in its current format
What is a discracful state of affairs? If the car was breaking the noise limit that was set down in the regulations race control would have very little option, and to be fair to Britcar this is not a call they can make or have any influence in.
I was at the last one and a diesel seat got black flagged during the night due to noise. Everyone knew the limits before starting the race, if you didnt read them or thought you could get away with it you deserved to be called in.
Noise has been discussed on this forum a lot, personally I dont mind noisy cars when im at a race track but if the locals complain and tracks abuse the limits put on them by the local council (as per Mallory), they are not above the law. So they are interested in keeping a good harmony with the locals. If they dont you wouldnt have another 24 hour race.

rwstokes

196 posts

144 months

Tuesday 28th April 2015
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Well I am glad it wasnt just me who was unimpressed with the treatment of spectators. I did actually complain to Silverstone about the overall treatment of fans, but they havent responded.

My gripes were the same as most of the above, shutting grandstands overnight at a 24hr race, especially given the weather forcast was not ideal.

MW radio was a pain, again I could only listen to it in the car which was annoying, makes it impossible to follow the race apart from in the car. More annoying is that we all know they have 87.7fm for Radio Silverstone, or even streaming it would have been better. As it was that was a pain.

And closing more than half the track to spectators towards the end of the evening was annoying. I was trying to get down to Stowe to do some long exposure shots with less fence in the way, but got stopped by security by car and on foot, and told likely wouldnt open that end of the track Sunday morning anyway.

I'd gone down prepared to sleep in the car, had camping stove etc for food. So I wasnt just popping by, I had planned my weekend, and was really looking forward to it. Sadly after that treatment I wont be rushing back to Silverstone. They seemed to not care about how they treated their spectators, which seems rather rubbish.

However, the race was itself was good, and was really pleased to see via TSL that the Fiesta finished smile

stewartm

63 posts

127 months

Tuesday 28th April 2015
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The feeling I get from the organiser's side of things, is that sadly spectators are just an inconvenience. The trend in facilities seems to have been on a downward slope since our 1st visit a few years ago, but the very limited quantity of stands open at all, the fact that they were all closed over night, the fact that spectators were blocked from accessing the bottom half of the circuit during night qually, the massively reduced quantity of food outlets, etc, is all taking the event to rock bottom for spectators (despite it being hyped as going to be the 'biggest ever').

When you look at the numbers that British GT pulls in, the potential is obviously there for the crowd to be a significant player in the commercial success of the event. Unfortunately I can't imagine that should the event run next year, the numbers won't have reduced further still and that opportunity will again have been missed.

On the positive side, the rest of the people involved were fantastic. Teams as ever, more than happy to chat to interested spectators. Marshalls throughout the night cheerfully chatting to any passing spectators, despite them surely having been thoroughly drenched and uncomfortable. And the commentators (once we had found them - unsurprisingly, I didn't see the unusual band/freq for the radio advertised anywhere, until I finally caught mention of it over the tannoy) were fantastic. I had thought it a shame that the Radio Le Mans chaps visit had been a one off a couple of years back, but the team for this event really made it for us. The nice balance of chaotic entertainment and information really seemed to suit the event well. Hope they are back for future events.

So just to repeat what has been previously been said - big congratulations to the teams that made the start line, and more so those that also saw the finish. Despite the relatively small grid, we still found the action and stories behind each teams race compelling. Also massive thank you to the marshalls, who didn't have the choice to head back to their tents to miss the worst of the weather in the early part of the night, as we did.

Incidentally, no doubt Silverstone will see this as a problem to be fixed for next time, but the little stand next to Wellington Bridge and the large stand on the inside of the circuit on the approach to Vale, do not have any kind of gate on them. (You can guess where we spent 00:00->04:00 wink) Thanks must go to the SRC, who tried to fill the void of facilities, by making their stand available to spectators during the night.

Paul Dishman

4,701 posts

237 months

Tuesday 28th April 2015
quotequote all

AndyAlfa18 said:
Paul, with respect, you can't hold non existant people responsible for the low turn out!!

Its the responsiblity of the Promoter to make the event attractive & cost effective enough for people to follow through on their word & enter - and clearly Britcar is not engaging with their audience (for whatever reason). Noone said it was easy, and it was good to see some high profile entries and it was good for the event to have Beechdean winning it, but more needs to be done.

Devil is in the detail, and things like charging teams £100 for motorhome slots in the paddock is taking the piss, and this is just one example of continually battering the few (who entered) for more and more income.

We proudly took our place on the grid (#66 SEAT) because of a long association with Britcar. But the Silverstone race weekend is 50% more expensive than Barcelona 24, and the same price as Dubai 24 (for a low budget team transporting minimal equipement to Dubai). And that is the fact - its too expensive for what it is & the experience that you have.
Andy, I'm sure you're correct , I was just repeating what James told me. I'm not really in the loop anymore when it comes to the cost of racing so can't comment on that

FurtiveFreddy

8,577 posts

237 months

Tuesday 28th April 2015
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Despite management changes over the years, Silverstone has been like this for as long as I've been involved in Motorsport (35 years).

Palmer has his critics, but he does know how to operate a circuit.

spyderman8

1,748 posts

156 months

Tuesday 28th April 2015
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A few comments and observations.

The Ferrari didn't "destroy" the Marcos but it certainly made a mess of it while a friend of mine, Gerry Taylor, was driving. The Ferrari driver responsible was disqualified from the race. Both Marcoses went on to finish.

The decision to relocate the Snoozeboxes is down to Snoozebox and certainly nothing to do with Britcar. I wonder if it has anything to do with F1? Agreed, having them all outside the wire, especially for this event, was daft.

Its not unusual for grandstands to be locked - its probably a cost-saving and/or health and safety issue. Agreed, though, that for a 24 its particularly daft.

Considering just how much effort went in to getting the 24 back at Silverstone at all, its not surprising that Britcar had to be particular about noise. Sad to see anyone DQd for noise, but the limit was in the regs.

Regards cost - I was given a number of offers to drive, the cheapest being £8k. I nearly teamed up with some guys to run in a Porsche Boxster but that would have been similar money. I believe the fuel was at least twice street price per litre. I don't know how much it cost James to hire Silvertone GP for three days but I would have been way in excess of £35k.

James has the contract to run the 24 for a number of years but as has been stated, it really needs at least twice the number on the grid to make it self-sustaining. As Paul says, its so easy for drivers to say at Autosport "yes, I'll do the 24" but until the money's paid, you can't count on anyone. I do know that having the race early in the season was seen as a negative factor by some teams, but I have to assume that the date was part of the deal to run it at all - at a time of year when locals aren't sitting in their gardens trying to enjoy a quiet Pimms.

Incidentally Silverstone village is about to see a large number of new homes built - its a shame the current Government didn't see fit to introduce a law disallowing noise complaints from people moving into a pre-existing "noisy" area.

Its my ambition to take part in the Silverstone 24 and in retrospect I really should have done it this year. Instead I did my media role and the event paid me instead of the other way around.

Chris.