Lotus Exige V6 SC (Exige (S3?) - New Elise SC

[Hedgerley]

Scuffers said:

in order:

the review is lame, same old stuff might just as well been lifted from Lotus press-releases

If you remember back, the Evora got the same rave reviews - that went well...

Jurno's are cheap....

And no, as there are next to sod all of them actually in exsistance.

In order:

I don't recall any Lotus press releases saying the Exige S is better than a 911 GT3. And when a car has such a stand out package of chassis/suspension/steering/performance than yes, I would expect the reviews to come up with similar comments.

Agreed but they also pointed out the Evora's deficiencies at the time, primarily the gearbox, below par quality and high price. I don't recall punches being pulled in that regard and maybe that has had a direct impact on sales, which is probably the way it should be. Lotus has taken heed and I agree the Evora should be doing a lot better.

I would challenge you to say that face to face with Chris Harris.....

Demo's are only just being sent out to dealers but that's my point - you or I haven't had a chance to drive one yet so we rely on these initial reviews. In the absence of demo's we have to rely on them to get early impressions and opinions. It was ever thus and I don't see a problem with that.

I guess you would have been a lot happier if the car had been universally derided Scuffers. Certainly your reluctance to accept what all these reviewers are saying about how good it is seems to imply you want it/Lotus to fail, which I don't believe to be the case, surely?

Edited by Hedgerley on Tuesday 3rd July 20:09

Edited by Hedgerley on Tuesday 3rd July 20:10

[Scuffers]

Hedgerley said:

I would challenge you to say that face to face with Chris Harris.....

no problem, although I doubt Chris could be arsed...

as for the rest of it:

[Hedgerley]

So much for healthy debate. You're a lost cause mate.

[Scuffers]

Hedgerley said:

So much for healthy debate. You're a lost cause mate.

not at all, just it's all been said before, many times....

After many years one tends to get all a bit jaded with it.

Look, I want Lotus to survive just as much as anyone, but be honest, what has the management of them actually done that's positive, bullst free and real in the last few years?

Yes, I am sure the Exige S might well be a decent car, but, let's let history tell us...

[bobo]

Having driven the thing I'm not sure it needs even more hp! Sure anything is possible and gains can be made but having come from some 'fairly' quick cars it occurred to me that more hp isn't the immediate requirement ...


A smaller air box would give it that more exotic sound from inside the cockpit which for me would be the priority.

[Scuffers]

bobo said:

Having driven the thing I'm not sure it needs even more hp! Sure anything is possible and gains can be made but having come from some 'fairly' quick cars it occurred to me that more hp isn't the immediate requirement ...

it's all relative though...

I used to think 200Hp on 700Kg's was fast, these days it's pedestrian.

Currently at 400Hp in ~750Kg's, and that can still feel slow.

For a road car, then yes, it;s probably enough, but then is the Exige S supposed o be a road car?

[bobo]

It's a daily driver for me plus 10 track days a year. If a 400hp upgrade comes out you can bet your coulo I will get it so agree but as it stands its a good start

Scuffers said:

it's all relative though...

I used to think 200Hp on 700Kg's was fast, these days it's pedestrian.

Currently at 400Hp in ~750Kg's, and that can still feel slow.

For a road car, then yes, it;s probably enough, but then is the Exige S supposed o be a road car?

[bobo]

Scuffham call me old fashioned but I used to get a bit bored w my k20a s1 exige w no s/c on track. It was quick enough on track that unless something special turned up you ended up lapping most things . Frankly there was more fun to be had racing my 2 stroke kart! Completely different I admit but I see the v6 as more day to day than an elise ! So v diff prospect to an s1.

Ffs man, book up a go and tell us what you think! You are without doubt the most experienced chap on this chit chat. Be good to know what u think even if completely negative.

Scuffers said:

it's all relative though...

I used to think 200Hp on 700Kg's was fast, these days it's pedestrian.

Currently at 400Hp in ~750Kg's, and that can still feel slow.

For a road car, then yes, it;s probably enough, but then is the Exige S supposed o be a road car?

[C43]

I think the reason Scuffers does not have a go is that his big head will not fit.

I agree, with the V6 the Exige should be much easier every day as overtaking will be so easy, something the Honda engined cars always suffer from as you have to be in the right gear all the time.

C43

[Thorburn]

C43 said:

I agree, with the V6 the Exige should be much easier every day as overtaking will be so easy, something the Honda engined cars always suffer from as you have to be in the right gear all the time.

Not driven a Honda powered car, but that certainly isn't true of the supercharged ones I've passengered in. Considerably lighter than the Exige S and with a big punch.

I don't think the 'right gear all the time' comment is even the case in the naturally aspirated ones. The larger capacity means it's got more mid-range grunt than something like the 111R in n/a form, not to mention the fact that the S1's and early S2's used for most Honda conversions will normally be a fair bit lighter.

That said speaking with others I get the impression that if you sent someone of modest ability round a track in both they'd probably be quicker in the new Exige S than a Honda converted car thanks to the electronics.

Edited by Thorburn on Wednesday 4th July 22:10

[bobo]

Scuffham call me old fashioned but I used to get a bit bored w my k20a s1 exige w no s/c on track. It was quick enough on track that unless something special turned up you ended up lapping most things . Frankly there was more fun to be had racing my 2 stroke kart! Completely different I admit but I see the v6 as more day to day than an elise ! So v diff prospect to an s1.

Ffs man, book up a go and tell us what you think! You are without doubt the most experienced chap on this chit chat. Be good to know what u think even if completely negative.

Scuffers said:

it's all relative though...

I used to think 200Hp on 700Kg's was fast, these days it's pedestrian.

Currently at 400Hp in ~750Kg's, and that can still feel slow.

For a road car, then yes, it;s probably enough, but then is the Exige S supposed o be a road car?

[C43]

Thorburn said:

C43 said:

I agree, with the V6 the Exige should be much easier every day as overtaking will be so easy, something the Honda engined cars always suffer from as you have to be in the right gear all the time.

Not driven a Honda powered car, but that certainly isn't true of the supercharged ones I've passengered in. Considerably lighter than the Exige S and with a big punch.

I don't think the 'right gear all the time' comment is even the case in the naturally aspirated ones. The larger capacity means it's got more mid-range grunt than something like the 111R in n/a form, not to mention the fact that the S1's and early S2's used for most Honda conversions will normally be a fair bit lighter.

That said speaking with others I get the impression that if you sent someone of modest ability round a track in both they'd probably be quicker in the new Exige S than a Honda converted car thanks to the electronics.

Edited by Thorburn on Wednesday 4th July 22:10

Agreed the electronics would help a lot. Sorry I was comparing the overtaking of the Honda engined cars to my Europa. The mid range grunt of the Europa makes them a lot easier to overtake in compared with the Honda engined cars which always feel like you have to get the revs right for overtaking. I image the V6 Exige will be a lot more of the same hence should be very easy to make good progress on the road. Not driven the Exige yet (I dare not) but certainly the V6 Evora S is very easy to pick up speed in much like the later Esprits used to be.

C43

[Loafing Wafu]

No sure I agree with you about the Honda. Ok say you were in 6th and doing 40mph and you wanted to overtake a gear change is called for. But unless you really want to power past someone there is no issue with their in gear acceleration. I've never struggled anyway in either my Honda car or the Audi one. The Audi you could be lazier though.

Edited by Loafing Wafu on Friday 6th July 07:08

[OlberJ]

It's the difference between driving quickly with something in reserve instantly on demand and chasing a top end up the rev range.

People seem to think it will be a dull engine to drive with. It's anything but.

[The Pits]

Whatever. The truth is the Exige is primarily a road car, just like the last one. The new one may have more lower and mid-range torque but unless you've lost the will to live it's not really essential to going about your business on the road. I certainly would not be buying one for that reason. If low end torque is really what floats your boat get a diesel.

But to suggest that the Exige S is merely an extreme track car is as deluded and out of touch as those who think the 911 GT3 is a good track car.

[C43]

Lets face it the new Exige looks great and will go like stink on road or track.....what is there not to like?

I will take mine in black please

C43

[otolith]

I would have thought a Honda engined car would plenty of performance in the wrong gear for day to day use - even a 111R does, and that has less power and less mid range torque and typically more weight.

[OlberJ]

The Pits said:

Whatever. The truth is the Exige is primarily a road car, just like the last one. The new one may have more lower and mid-range torque but unless you've lost the will to live it's not really essential to going about your business on the road. I certainly would not be buying one for that reason. If low end torque is really what floats your boat get a diesel.

That suggests that only an engine you have to work feels good to drive quickly.

It's not a boring engine, you won't get half way through your favourite hoon and think about putting on Radio 4.

You simply re-adjust to where your brain thinks you need to be to make progress. Like it or not, road driving is not the same as track driving. You'll get more enjoyment more of the time out of this than you would a highly strung 4 pot. I'm not talking about low rev pootling and overtaking without changing gear, that's a bonus but to only use all that torque for such would be a waste.

Going through a series of corners where you have an even spread of torque is so much nicer than a peaky set up that you're chasing all the time.

You tend not to know the roads your on like you would a track so being in the right gear all the time is not as easy. Traffic, weather conditions, condition of the road etc, all mean that flexibility of the engine is something which is not to be scoffed at.

And that's all before you mention the extra that the noise will bring to the party.

Live with it for a while before you condemn this new set up as diesel-like.

[Scuffers]

The Pits said:

But to suggest that the Exige S is merely an extreme track car is as deluded and out of touch as those who think the 911 GT3 is a good track car.

I think that's the crux of the issue here, what exactly is it?

at £50K+ you have to take a step back and actually look at what your competing against (and please don't bang on about the 911).

for example, the new Audi RS4 is what? ~£55K, same for the new M3 coupe or the AMG C63

Yes, I appreciate none of these are the same, and may not float your boat, but the point still stands, and on the road, I know what I would rather be driving round in 99% of the time.

At which point, you will say the Exige S is faster on track, but then are you now telling me it's a trackday car?

[otolith]

Scuffers said:

Yes, I appreciate none of these are the same, and may not float your boat, but the point still stands, and on the road, I know what I would rather be driving round in 99% of the time.

Me too, and it isn't the German barge. But I guess it depends what kind of motoring you do, and whether you want a one car solution. Big power saloons and estates just don't interest me, if I had to spend 50k and come away with an estate car, I'd have a brand new Elise S and whatever used automatic diesel estate you can buy with the change.