Upgrading Elise to 111R spec..?

[RichwiththeS2000]

Just wondering, what is involved (A better question might be; what are the engine differences) between say a 135/111S Elise and a 111R?

As I understand it these are all 1.8 Toyota engines (correct me if I'm wrong!). The 135 to 190bhp power hike is pretty substantial - Is upgrading the lower power models possible/realistic? The reason for asking is I've seen a couple of 135s I quite like the look of, but I prefer the 111R power/delivery (coming from an S2000..!)


Many thanks

[kambites]

The 111S and 135R are Rover K-series engined, the 135 is a mildly tuned version of the normal K-series, the 111S has variable valve timing and lift. To "upgrade" from one of them to a 111R you'd need to change:

Both clamshells, the fornt access pannels and the boot
The diffuser
The rear subrfame
The engine, gearbox, driveshafts, etc.
The wheels
The radiator
A fair chunk of the braking system
Various bits of electronics
Three of the wheel hubs
The wiring loom
From a 135R you'd also be replacing the roof, roll-bar cover, etc.
And probably a whole load of other stuff.

Basically you keep the front suspension, the tub, the doors, most of the interior and that's about it. Probably not worth it.


Upgrading from an S (130bhp Toyota engine) to an 111R would be much easier but they're newer cars so it'd be cheaper just to buy a 111R.

Edited by kambites on Wednesday 20th May 14:18

[otolith]

And if you were going to put a different engine into one of the Rover engined cars you would be better going for a Honda or Duratec conversion.

(or a VAG turbo, if you really must)

[RichwiththeS2000]

Ah, fair enough. Guess I totally mis understood the differences then. ha


Thanks

[otolith]

There is a lot to be said for an early S2 converted to Honda power - they end up lighter and more powerful than the 111R - but the conversion isn't cheap and the converted cars command decent prices.

[RichwiththeS2000]

I do like the sound of a Honda conversion but I guess it's a bit more of an unknown quantity. How well the conversion was done / any niggles left / what happens if it goes wrong type stuff. Probably not a huge deal, really. And I could keep my VTEC hat on ;-)

[otolith]

No doubt a standard 111R is a safer bet, and the integration of the high lift cam profile on the Toyota engine is more like the older Honda VTECs than the newer ones if you like that kind of thing - but there are a number of companies which have been doing the conversions for a while, so it's a well trodden path.

I had my 111R reflashed to lower the cam change point, which gives a less abrupt changeover more like the K20 engines, but some people like the drama.

[400SE Dave]

There is of course the 135bhp, 1.8 Toyota engined Elise S, perhaps that is the engine the OP is referring to.

I am sure someone told me that the engine in that one was a 1zz and the one in the 111r was a 2zz so I guess in that case it would not be simple to upgrade to 111r spec

[otolith]

Yes. Different bore and stroke (and cylinder liner composition) as well as different head.