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VinceFox

19,173 posts

58 months

[news] 
Sunday 26th August 2012 quote quote all
TobyLaRohne said:
Hey everyone, I was wondering if you could clarify something for me, I had discussion with a friend last night in a bar (who has apparently done a defensive driving course) who said his wife did the seemingly extremely dangerous thing of turning her head to check her blind spot before changing lane etc..apparently you should never take your eye off straight ahead even for a split second. I checked the highway code which says to check your blind spots by turning your head. He said because he was a defensive driver trained guy you're taught to check your blind spot with your mirrors... what does the IAM say about checking blind spots? I always thought you should place your mirrors well to allow for the best visability and still check your blindspot by physically looking.
Try not to talk to this person again.

Benbay001

3,668 posts

43 months

[news] 
Tuesday 28th August 2012 quote quote all
If he is so close to the car in front that losing vision of it for a split second could result in a horrendous accident then checking his blind spot isnt his biggest issue.
For me, i always check my blind spot, including coming off of roundabouts when they are busy, this has already saved my bacon twice.
In the works van it has wonderful blind spot mirrors which seem to provide a brilliant view of (almost)anything you wish to see.

MikeGTi

1,509 posts

87 months

[news] 
Monday 3rd September 2012 quote quote all
Lifesaver. Always.

TobyLaRohne

Original Poster:

4,495 posts

92 months

[news] 
Monday 3rd September 2012 quote quote all
If it's good enough for the IAM it's good enough for me. wink

Of course I haven't stopped checking over my shoulder smile

sinizter

3,348 posts

72 months

[news] 
Monday 3rd September 2012 quote quote all
I used to keep an eye out so I knew what was approaching, and passing, so I used to just check in the mirrors and lane change.

Until I did a multiple lane change with mirror check and found an Orange Focus ST, so close to my rear that it scared the living st out of me. A few inches either way and it could have been an RTA.

I now do a shoulder check almost all of the time.
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JustNeil

599 posts

113 months

[news] 
Tuesday 4th September 2012 quote quote all
This is a requirement for a motorcycle test (called a lifesaver), so he's saying that everyone who has passed their motorbike test is riding dangerously? What utter tosh!

He needs to take a few more lessons with someone who knows what they're talking about, or get his money back.

TobyLaRohne

Original Poster:

4,495 posts

92 months

[news] 
Tuesday 4th September 2012 quote quote all
JustNeil said:
This is a requirement for a motorcycle test (called a lifesaver), so he's saying that everyone who has passed their motorbike test is riding dangerously? What utter tosh!

He needs to take a few more lessons with someone who knows what they're talking about, or get his money back.
...I don't want to put the guy down. I just wanted to be sure in myself that I'm exercising best practice (regardless of level of driver training) by physically turning my head to check your blindspot (either stationary or in motion).

OlberJ

13,974 posts

119 months

[news] 
Tuesday 4th September 2012 quote quote all
They don't teach it these days either as basic tuition. I went apoplectic with my younger sister when she told me she never turns her head because it's too dangerous.


7mike

2,431 posts

79 months

[news] 
Tuesday 4th September 2012 quote quote all
JustNeil said:
This is a requirement for a motorcycle test (called a lifesaver), so he's saying that everyone who has passed their motorbike test is riding dangerously? What utter tosh!
What I can't figure out is why, when I'm training van drivers that hold Cat A licences, do they not consider a blindpot check in a van to be important. It realy is quite a common occurance in my experience.

7mike

2,431 posts

79 months

[news] 
Tuesday 4th September 2012 quote quote all
OlberJ said:
They don't teach it these days either as basic tuition. I went apoplectic with my younger sister when she told me she never turns her head because it's too dangerous.
By 'they' you obviously mean every ADI on the DSA register? A look to the right is not quite the same as a neck straining 'look examiner, I'm checking my blindspot' contortionist act. The later almost put me under an arctic once because daddy had given his precious little daughter the benefit of his wisdom. Should you ever take a learner on to a dual carriageway for the first time, by all means get them to have a good look over their shoulder; just be ready to grab the wheel!

BOF

931 posts

109 months

[news] 
Wednesday 5th September 2012 quote quote all
I was taught by some very experienced advanced drivers...John Lyon and some excellent Traffic men...that I should be looking in my mirrorS...(scanning all three) every seven to nine seconds.

In other words...to be constantly aware of what is going on...front back and sides...and to create and maintain my own 'bubble of space' in all and any road conditions.

I tried to pass this on to IAM Associates for nine years - think it worked most times - it is NOT difficult if practised...it becomes a reflex process for the brain...try it!

BOF

_Neal_

1,275 posts

105 months

[news] 
Wednesday 5th September 2012 quote quote all
BOF said:
I was taught by some very experienced advanced drivers...John Lyon and some excellent Traffic men...that I should be looking in my mirrorS...(scanning all three) every seven to nine seconds.

In other words...to be constantly aware of what is going on...front back and sides...and to create and maintain my own 'bubble of space' in all and any road conditions.

I tried to pass this on to IAM Associates for nine years - think it worked most times - it is NOT difficult if practised...it becomes a reflex process for the brain...try it!

BOF
So you never do a shoulder check? And teach associates never to check either? If so, that's surprising from an experienced observer.

As mentioned above, I was taught (and try to do) the same thing as you, and teach associates the same - but you can get caught out. A glance over your shoulder, that allows you to know (not just think you know) that no-one's there is, in my view, vital. Personally, I come down hard on associates if they don't do a shoulder check.

BOF

931 posts

109 months

[news] 
Thursday 6th September 2012 quote quote all
_Neal_ said:
BOF said:
I was taught by some very experienced advanced drivers...John Lyon and some excellent Traffic men...that I should be looking in my mirrorS...(scanning all three) every seven to nine seconds.

In other words...to be constantly aware of what is going on...front back and sides...and to create and maintain my own 'bubble of space' in all and any road conditions.

I tried to pass this on to IAM Associates for nine years - think it worked most times - it is NOT difficult if practised...it becomes a reflex process for the brain...try it!

BOF
So you never do a shoulder check? And teach associates never to check either? If so, that's surprising from an experienced observer.

As mentioned above, I was taught (and try to do) the same thing as you, and teach associates the same - but you can get caught out. A glance over your shoulder, that allows you to know (not just think you know) that no-one's there is, in my view, vital. Personally, I come down hard on associates if they don't do a shoulder check.
It goes without saying that I always do a life saver and teach the same...also 'inside mirror check' when leaving roundabouts...got a RoSPA test coming up in a few months so need to start polishing the performance - talking to myself - as I choose to do a full commentary on test...



BOF

henrycrun

1,638 posts

126 months

[news] 
Thursday 6th September 2012 quote quote all
If the lifesaver is not being taught everywhere, then those involved in training policy need to get it on their agenda ASAP

WeirdNeville

5,887 posts

101 months

[news] 
Thursday 6th September 2012 quote quote all
Yep, I always do it and it's prevented a collision/ near miss on a few occasions. Your observations give you the time and space to make the check safely, but I've often been amazed at how cyclists/motocyclists etc can slip into that blind spot un-noticed.

BOF

931 posts

109 months

[news] 
Thursday 6th September 2012 quote quote all
Kind of on subject for those involved in the IAM - or ANY kind of driver education...I have found it useful sometimes to emphasise certain points to associates by giving them PRINTED quotes...example re lifesavers and bikers...

""It's a traffic man's phrase;

"At the end of a long set of skid marks, is usually a bunch of flowers""

I have dozens of quotes and posts by people like Vonhosen that I have used (with his and others permission) as it was my personal experience that when I started advanced training I was so involved (or thick?) that I did not recall as much as I would have liked to...anyone ever EXACTLY remember the route they took on the IAM or RoSPA test?

A printed note can be better digested when they get home and have a cup of coffee?

Just a thought...


BOF

Dave Hedgehog

7,270 posts

90 months

[news] 
Thursday 6th September 2012 quote quote all
if you are driving faster than everyone else there are no blind spots biggrin

BOF

931 posts

109 months

[news] 
Thursday 6th September 2012 quote quote all
Dave Hedgehog said:
if you are driving faster than everyone else there are no blind spots biggrin
How I wish Jim Clarke had read this before Hockenheim...

BOF

_Neal_

1,275 posts

105 months

[news] 
Thursday 6th September 2012 quote quote all
BOF said:
It goes without saying that I always do a life saver and teach the same...also 'inside mirror check' when leaving roundabouts...got a RoSPA test coming up in a few months so need to start polishing the performance - talking to myself - as I choose to do a full commentary on test...

BOF
Glad to hear it, had me worried for a minute smile

BOF

931 posts

109 months

[news] 
Saturday 8th September 2012 quote quote all
I just noticed the comment from Neville...

"" Your observations give you the time and space to make the check safely""

That is one of the basic precepts of advanced driving ( or further education?)

BOF
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