Knowing the road
Discussion
This might be just the ones I know. But I get the impression that drivers and riders who are most concerned with whether or not they 'know the road' are generally pretty awful. If they think they do know the road they go too fast on the basis that there won't be any hazards coming up that weren't there last week. If they don't know it they won't exceed 40 odd on anything that doesn't look like an airport runway.
It's as if it doesn't occur to them to read the road.
I can think of places where knowing the road is helpful, allowing you to deal with a tightening bend with more finesse or to anticipate possible overtaking opportunities. But I think it's pretty marginal.
What does everyone else think?
It's as if it doesn't occur to them to read the road.
I can think of places where knowing the road is helpful, allowing you to deal with a tightening bend with more finesse or to anticipate possible overtaking opportunities. But I think it's pretty marginal.
What does everyone else think?
I started a thread on this subject back in the day...
http://www.pistonheads.com/gassing/topic.asp?h=0&a...
http://www.pistonheads.com/gassing/topic.asp?h=0&a...
Back in the day Reg said:
There is a road I drive along when I go to pick my children up from school. It's not particularly long - a couple of miles at most, and it's not a particularly fast road. It's single carriageway NSL, but it twists and turns with a whole variety of different corners. It has varying degrees of negative and positive camber, uneven patches of tarmac, areas where it's less grippy than others and is interspersed with double white line systems.
Now, I've been driving along this road, on average, three or four times a week for at least the last ten years - possibly longer. I know the road intimately - I know where it stays wet after a rainstorm and where it dries more quickly. I know where patches of frost tend to linger into the afternoon, and where it thaws out. I know which farm entrances are likely to have mud near to them, and which ones a herd of cattle is prone to emerge from occasionally. I know which junctions are blind and difficult to emerge from, and which ones I've got a good, early view into. I know exactly where I can overtake (two areas in one direction and, helped by a downhill stretch if I'm behind something slow), three in the other direction.
With all this detailed local knowledge, you'd think that it would be one of the safest roads I could possibly drive along, wouldn't you?
Well, I've been giving this some thought today and I've decided that it's actually quite the opposite - it's probably the most dangerous road that I use.
The problem with familiarity with a road is that there is an inevitable "autopilot" mode that kicks in, whether you want it to or not. Now, I'm not saying that I blindly drive along this road without thinking, but I monitored myself as I drove along it today, and I realised that, because I knew it so well, I was automatically looking in the same places for a view, I wasn't assessing bends, because I knew how tight they were, my attention was placed in well-rehearsed areas along the length of the road, and my thought patterns, generally, seemed to be pre-determined, rather than free-thinking.
If I drive an unfamiliar piece of road, I have to assess bends for their severity, look for areas of visibility and invisibility, spot actual and potential hazards, work out driving plans and alternative plans, etc, etc. On the familiar road, I've pretty much got one single driving plan for the whole road. Of course, circumstances change every time I drive the road, but It's very easy to think that you've seen everything before and you've already got a plan for it happening. I know where the stables are, for instance and I've seen enough horses on that road to know exactly what I'm going to do if I come across one. I know where to deal with cyclists, and not just where to overtake other vehicles, but what gear I need to be in and how to carry out the overtakes.
The problem is - and this is what was bugging me today - because I'm not approaching the road with a fresh, open mind, I could end up in deep trouble if something genuinely unexpected happened. We all know about the safe stopping rule, but I know for a fact that I'll carry more speed into a corner if I know it well, than I will if it's unfamiliar. Would I still be able to stop on my own side of the road if something unexpected happened? I asked myself that very question whilst driving today. The answer was yes - I could, but it'd be a close thing. Closer than I'd like it to be anyway.
You see, although I've encountered pretty much everything that I'm likely to on that road, there are still many situations that I haven't, and which are a real possibility. I've never encountered a fallen tree, for instance, or a cyclist who's had a fall, or a recent accident. The fact that I'm probably giving these possibilities less credence than I would if I didn't know the road is what's been bothering me.
On the way back home, I approached the road with a different mindset. I pretended that I didn't know it. The difference was surprising. Although my lines through corners didn't change, the way in which I assessed them certainly did, and my entry speeds were slower as a result. I found myself looking in places that I haven't looked for ages - probably years - and assessing possibilities that hadn't really come up before.
I've decided that this is something that I'm going to do on all the routes I use regularly, starting with my route to work, as that's probably the route I drive most often, so it's almost certainly the route I've become most complacent with.
Have a go yourself - you'll probably be quite surprised at how many possibilities you haven't considered on roads that you know well.
Now, I've been driving along this road, on average, three or four times a week for at least the last ten years - possibly longer. I know the road intimately - I know where it stays wet after a rainstorm and where it dries more quickly. I know where patches of frost tend to linger into the afternoon, and where it thaws out. I know which farm entrances are likely to have mud near to them, and which ones a herd of cattle is prone to emerge from occasionally. I know which junctions are blind and difficult to emerge from, and which ones I've got a good, early view into. I know exactly where I can overtake (two areas in one direction and, helped by a downhill stretch if I'm behind something slow), three in the other direction.
With all this detailed local knowledge, you'd think that it would be one of the safest roads I could possibly drive along, wouldn't you?
Well, I've been giving this some thought today and I've decided that it's actually quite the opposite - it's probably the most dangerous road that I use.
The problem with familiarity with a road is that there is an inevitable "autopilot" mode that kicks in, whether you want it to or not. Now, I'm not saying that I blindly drive along this road without thinking, but I monitored myself as I drove along it today, and I realised that, because I knew it so well, I was automatically looking in the same places for a view, I wasn't assessing bends, because I knew how tight they were, my attention was placed in well-rehearsed areas along the length of the road, and my thought patterns, generally, seemed to be pre-determined, rather than free-thinking.
If I drive an unfamiliar piece of road, I have to assess bends for their severity, look for areas of visibility and invisibility, spot actual and potential hazards, work out driving plans and alternative plans, etc, etc. On the familiar road, I've pretty much got one single driving plan for the whole road. Of course, circumstances change every time I drive the road, but It's very easy to think that you've seen everything before and you've already got a plan for it happening. I know where the stables are, for instance and I've seen enough horses on that road to know exactly what I'm going to do if I come across one. I know where to deal with cyclists, and not just where to overtake other vehicles, but what gear I need to be in and how to carry out the overtakes.
The problem is - and this is what was bugging me today - because I'm not approaching the road with a fresh, open mind, I could end up in deep trouble if something genuinely unexpected happened. We all know about the safe stopping rule, but I know for a fact that I'll carry more speed into a corner if I know it well, than I will if it's unfamiliar. Would I still be able to stop on my own side of the road if something unexpected happened? I asked myself that very question whilst driving today. The answer was yes - I could, but it'd be a close thing. Closer than I'd like it to be anyway.
You see, although I've encountered pretty much everything that I'm likely to on that road, there are still many situations that I haven't, and which are a real possibility. I've never encountered a fallen tree, for instance, or a cyclist who's had a fall, or a recent accident. The fact that I'm probably giving these possibilities less credence than I would if I didn't know the road is what's been bothering me.
On the way back home, I approached the road with a different mindset. I pretended that I didn't know it. The difference was surprising. Although my lines through corners didn't change, the way in which I assessed them certainly did, and my entry speeds were slower as a result. I found myself looking in places that I haven't looked for ages - probably years - and assessing possibilities that hadn't really come up before.
I've decided that this is something that I'm going to do on all the routes I use regularly, starting with my route to work, as that's probably the route I drive most often, so it's almost certainly the route I've become most complacent with.
Have a go yourself - you'll probably be quite surprised at how many possibilities you haven't considered on roads that you know well.
R_U_LOCAL said:
I started a thread on this subject back in the day...
http://www.pistonheads.com/gassing/topic.asp?h=0&a...
How handy - that saves me having to work out how to say what I wanted to say http://www.pistonheads.com/gassing/topic.asp?h=0&a...
.I agree with everything you wrote there. I find that when I've had the luxury of unfamiliar roads for a few days and really got my driving brain firing on all cylinders, it can be a bit of an eye opener to come back to my familiar route to work. Driving an unfamiliar road very well takes a lot of mental effort - searching out all the information as early as possible and deciding what to do with it. But I think driving a familiar road that well takes at least as much effort in a different way - making sure I am basing my decisions only on real information and not assumed information.
Pretty much as above. Thinking about it, I think the ability to know when possible overtaking spots are comming up is probably the most valuable thing about knowing the road. Knowing the layout doesn't help a lot, as you'll drive to what you can see, and not being on a track, are not having to get repeatably the highest speed round each corner. The exception would be in the dark or fog etc, when knowing what's comming up will enable you to be more relaxed and hence reduce fatigue.
Oh and welcome back to Mr. Local
Oh and welcome back to Mr. Local
The guys who were the police driving school "staff developers" were always laughed at behind their backs, because they only ever did their "demonstration drives" on roads they knew like the back of their hands...woe betide anyone who ever suggested a different route!
An expert will apply his skills to any road, familiar or unfamiliar, and the sensible ones will realise the familiar is the most dangerous.
An expert will apply his skills to any road, familiar or unfamiliar, and the sensible ones will realise the familiar is the most dangerous.
R_U_LOCAL said:
I started a thread on this subject back in the day...
http://www.pistonheads.com/gassing/topic.asp?h=0&a...
One of the best things I have read on Pistonheads for a long timehttp://www.pistonheads.com/gassing/topic.asp?h=0&a...
Back in the day Reg said:
There is a road I drive along when I go to pick my children up from school. It's not particularly long - a couple of miles at most, and it's not a particularly fast road. It's single carriageway NSL, but it twists and turns with a whole variety of different corners. It has varying degrees of negative and positive camber, uneven patches of tarmac, areas where it's less grippy than others and is interspersed with double white line systems.
Now, I've been driving along this road, on average, three or four times a week for at least the last ten years - possibly longer. I know the road intimately - I know where it stays wet after a rainstorm and where it dries more quickly. I know where patches of frost tend to linger into the afternoon, and where it thaws out. I know which farm entrances are likely to have mud near to them, and which ones a herd of cattle is prone to emerge from occasionally. I know which junctions are blind and difficult to emerge from, and which ones I've got a good, early view into. I know exactly where I can overtake (two areas in one direction and, helped by a downhill stretch if I'm behind something slow), three in the other direction.
With all this detailed local knowledge, you'd think that it would be one of the safest roads I could possibly drive along, wouldn't you?
Well, I've been giving this some thought today and I've decided that it's actually quite the opposite - it's probably the most dangerous road that I use.
The problem with familiarity with a road is that there is an inevitable "autopilot" mode that kicks in, whether you want it to or not. Now, I'm not saying that I blindly drive along this road without thinking, but I monitored myself as I drove along it today, and I realised that, because I knew it so well, I was automatically looking in the same places for a view, I wasn't assessing bends, because I knew how tight they were, my attention was placed in well-rehearsed areas along the length of the road, and my thought patterns, generally, seemed to be pre-determined, rather than free-thinking.
If I drive an unfamiliar piece of road, I have to assess bends for their severity, look for areas of visibility and invisibility, spot actual and potential hazards, work out driving plans and alternative plans, etc, etc. On the familiar road, I've pretty much got one single driving plan for the whole road. Of course, circumstances change every time I drive the road, but It's very easy to think that you've seen everything before and you've already got a plan for it happening. I know where the stables are, for instance and I've seen enough horses on that road to know exactly what I'm going to do if I come across one. I know where to deal with cyclists, and not just where to overtake other vehicles, but what gear I need to be in and how to carry out the overtakes.
The problem is - and this is what was bugging me today - because I'm not approaching the road with a fresh, open mind, I could end up in deep trouble if something genuinely unexpected happened. We all know about the safe stopping rule, but I know for a fact that I'll carry more speed into a corner if I know it well, than I will if it's unfamiliar. Would I still be able to stop on my own side of the road if something unexpected happened? I asked myself that very question whilst driving today. The answer was yes - I could, but it'd be a close thing. Closer than I'd like it to be anyway.
You see, although I've encountered pretty much everything that I'm likely to on that road, there are still many situations that I haven't, and which are a real possibility. I've never encountered a fallen tree, for instance, or a cyclist who's had a fall, or a recent accident. The fact that I'm probably giving these possibilities less credence than I would if I didn't know the road is what's been bothering me.
On the way back home, I approached the road with a different mindset. I pretended that I didn't know it. The difference was surprising. Although my lines through corners didn't change, the way in which I assessed them certainly did, and my entry speeds were slower as a result. I found myself looking in places that I haven't looked for ages - probably years - and assessing possibilities that hadn't really come up before.
I've decided that this is something that I'm going to do on all the routes I use regularly, starting with my route to work, as that's probably the route I drive most often, so it's almost certainly the route I've become most complacent with.
Have a go yourself - you'll probably be quite surprised at how many possibilities you haven't considered on roads that you know well.
Now, I've been driving along this road, on average, three or four times a week for at least the last ten years - possibly longer. I know the road intimately - I know where it stays wet after a rainstorm and where it dries more quickly. I know where patches of frost tend to linger into the afternoon, and where it thaws out. I know which farm entrances are likely to have mud near to them, and which ones a herd of cattle is prone to emerge from occasionally. I know which junctions are blind and difficult to emerge from, and which ones I've got a good, early view into. I know exactly where I can overtake (two areas in one direction and, helped by a downhill stretch if I'm behind something slow), three in the other direction.
With all this detailed local knowledge, you'd think that it would be one of the safest roads I could possibly drive along, wouldn't you?
Well, I've been giving this some thought today and I've decided that it's actually quite the opposite - it's probably the most dangerous road that I use.
The problem with familiarity with a road is that there is an inevitable "autopilot" mode that kicks in, whether you want it to or not. Now, I'm not saying that I blindly drive along this road without thinking, but I monitored myself as I drove along it today, and I realised that, because I knew it so well, I was automatically looking in the same places for a view, I wasn't assessing bends, because I knew how tight they were, my attention was placed in well-rehearsed areas along the length of the road, and my thought patterns, generally, seemed to be pre-determined, rather than free-thinking.
If I drive an unfamiliar piece of road, I have to assess bends for their severity, look for areas of visibility and invisibility, spot actual and potential hazards, work out driving plans and alternative plans, etc, etc. On the familiar road, I've pretty much got one single driving plan for the whole road. Of course, circumstances change every time I drive the road, but It's very easy to think that you've seen everything before and you've already got a plan for it happening. I know where the stables are, for instance and I've seen enough horses on that road to know exactly what I'm going to do if I come across one. I know where to deal with cyclists, and not just where to overtake other vehicles, but what gear I need to be in and how to carry out the overtakes.
The problem is - and this is what was bugging me today - because I'm not approaching the road with a fresh, open mind, I could end up in deep trouble if something genuinely unexpected happened. We all know about the safe stopping rule, but I know for a fact that I'll carry more speed into a corner if I know it well, than I will if it's unfamiliar. Would I still be able to stop on my own side of the road if something unexpected happened? I asked myself that very question whilst driving today. The answer was yes - I could, but it'd be a close thing. Closer than I'd like it to be anyway.
You see, although I've encountered pretty much everything that I'm likely to on that road, there are still many situations that I haven't, and which are a real possibility. I've never encountered a fallen tree, for instance, or a cyclist who's had a fall, or a recent accident. The fact that I'm probably giving these possibilities less credence than I would if I didn't know the road is what's been bothering me.
On the way back home, I approached the road with a different mindset. I pretended that I didn't know it. The difference was surprising. Although my lines through corners didn't change, the way in which I assessed them certainly did, and my entry speeds were slower as a result. I found myself looking in places that I haven't looked for ages - probably years - and assessing possibilities that hadn't really come up before.
I've decided that this is something that I'm going to do on all the routes I use regularly, starting with my route to work, as that's probably the route I drive most often, so it's almost certainly the route I've become most complacent with.
Have a go yourself - you'll probably be quite surprised at how many possibilities you haven't considered on roads that you know well.
Thanks
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