Breaking the National Speed Limit
Discussion
Riggie said:
I did a speed awareness course for my sins of 82 mph. I accept that I was breaking the law, but enforcement should be about safety rather than just revenue.
Quite. An attentive (an even an inattentive) driver at 82mph on a well-sighted dual carriageway is easy to 'catch', but hardly a major issue or likely to cause an accident. The people who don't slow down when forward vision or available space is reduced are the problem.Ps. Did you reveal your former job to the people at the course?
MC Bodge said:
Quite. An attentive (an even an inattentive) driver at 82mph on a well-sighted dual carriageway is easy to 'catch', but hardly a major issue or likely to cause an accident. The people who don't slow down when forward vision or available space is reduced are the problem.
Ps. Did you reveal your former job to the people at the course?
The guy running the course was an ex traffic man from my force but a different base, however, he did recognise my name! I didn't mention it to my fellow offenders....Ps. Did you reveal your former job to the people at the course?
MC Bodge said:
Quite. An attentive (an even an inattentive) driver at 82mph on a well-sighted dual carriageway is easy to 'catch', but hardly a major issue or likely to cause an accident. The people who don't slow down when forward vision or available space is reduced are the problem.
Ps. Did you reveal your former job to the people at the course?
The guy running the course was an ex traffic man from my force but a different base, however, he did recognise my name! I didn't mention it to my fellow offenders....Ps. Did you reveal your former job to the people at the course?
Byteme said:
I need to maintain a clean licence but in any case it's average speeds that dictate arrival times and unless you're on two wheels there are few opportunities to ever make speeding worthwhile.
Whilst I'm not sure it's entirely relevant either way - after all, who says arrival time has to be the motivation for wishing to drive faster and overtake people - if your point were true I'd wonder why our blue light friends bothered with their speed limit exemptions. And if arrival time is your goal, given the choice between driving faster and driving slower, which would you choose 
SK425 said:
Whilst I'm not sure it's entirely relevant either way - after all, who says arrival time has to be the motivation for wishing to drive faster and overtake people - if your point were true I'd wonder why our blue light friends bothered with their speed limit exemptions. And if arrival time is your goal, given the choice between driving faster and driving slower, which would you choose
In hindsight, now, I'd prefer always to get there a few minutes later rather than not at all.I did eight years of overseas Royal Convoy work, mostly at the rear of the lead vehicle pack, the most trusted and difficult position to maintain. The front Police escort "arrow" diverts oncoming traffic while their sirens move the nearside locals off the road. Far, far more aggressive than the UK.
I can think of numerous occasions where I exceeded 285kph on single carriageway roads, with other users in both directions. Playing catch-up while a traffic light was missed because the local plod got bored was usual. I suppose that ultimately it was always my choice but try later replaying that journey while trying to sleep when you were in an entirely different frame of mind earlier in the day.
It still gives me nightmares, even ten years later! At least in the UK the local ambulance service and hospital will probably not make things worse when the inevitable happens.
If I had to stick at 70mph on any motorway I'd be bored and inattentive. It wouldn't begin to challenge me in any way. Exceeding the limit keeps me in a zone where I am much more completely focused, alert and 'on it' as it were. I am a safer driver for exceeding the limit. That's before we start talking about the challenge & satisfaction from controlling smoothly a car at speed. (Allegedly).
Byteme said:
I've never been close to that speed on a bike. Mostly a RUF CTR2, a Twin supercharged Aston Martin and an XJ220.
Is this you?robbyd said:
If I had to stick at 70mph on any motorway I'd be bored and inattentive. It wouldn't begin to challenge me in any way. Exceeding the limit keeps me in a zone where I am much more completely focused, alert and 'on it' as it were. I am a safer driver for exceeding the limit. That's before we start talking about the challenge & satisfaction from controlling smoothly a car at speed. (Allegedly).
How much do you exceed the limit by on motorways???!!!I get the point about the risk of boredom and inattention - I think that's always a potential problem when the rate at which new things come up that you need to incorporate into your driving plan is noticeably less than the rate at which you can incorporate them. That's basically what driving at an appropriate speed for the conditions is (but only if you're incorporating everything you should into your driving plan). But on a lightly trafficked motorway, the speed you'd need to do to bring the rate of new things happening back up would be astronomical. Motorways are huge roads with enormously long sight lines and driving to the conditions would be highly detrimental to your licence.
robbyd said:
If I had to stick at 70mph on any motorway I'd be bored and inattentive. It wouldn't begin to challenge me in any way. Exceeding the limit keeps me in a zone where I am much more completely focused, alert and 'on it' as it were. I am a safer driver for exceeding the limit. That's before we start talking about the challenge & satisfaction from controlling smoothly a car at speed. (Allegedly).
Really?So when you get "bored and inattentive" at 80 then 90 and then 110 because that becomes normal. What happens then? Perhaps 130 on a bike, or why not 160?
Most modern cars look after themselves and few drivers are even aware of how much TCS and/or active ride is controlling their car, even at relatively low speeds. Perhaps you should credit your smooth driving achievements to the car designers who now "baby" all modern car drivers, that is until ultimate limits are encountered and things suddenly go pear shaped when air bags and vehicle structures take over.
If your driving needs challenging I would suggest you try and impress a police driving instructor at 30mph. I guarantee that you'll never get "bored" while driving again and if you had any real ability he would probably have the good grace to deflate your ego gently.
Byteme said:
Really?
So when you get "bored and inattentive" at 80 then 90 and then 110 because that becomes normal. What happens then? Perhaps 130 on a bike, or why not 160?
People don't get bored an inattentive because they are used to the speed, but because the decisions are coming up too slowly. If decisions come up at 90 quickly enough for the driver to stay alert then it's irrelevant whether the speed is 'normal' or not.So when you get "bored and inattentive" at 80 then 90 and then 110 because that becomes normal. What happens then? Perhaps 130 on a bike, or why not 160?
Impressing a police driver at 30 in a built up area is certainly a challenge, doing so at 70 or even 80 on a quiet motorway isn't simply because there is so little to think about.
I've had police instructors encouraging me (I declined) to get up to 80 or 90 even on single carriageway roads precisely because they were getting bored.
Byteme said:
Really?
So when you get "bored and inattentive" at 80 then 90 and then 110 because that becomes normal. What happens then? Perhaps 130 on a bike, or why not 160?
Most modern cars look after themselves and few drivers are even aware of how much TCS and/or active ride is controlling their car, even at relatively low speeds. Perhaps you should credit your smooth driving achievements to the car designers who now "baby" all modern car drivers, that is until ultimate limits are encountered and things suddenly go pear shaped when air bags and vehicle structures take over.
If your driving needs challenging I would suggest you try and impress a police driving instructor at 30mph. I guarantee that you'll never get "bored" while driving again and if you had any real ability he would probably have the good grace to deflate your ego gently.
My cars don't have TCS or any sort of active ride control and I don't drive anywhere near the limit, though I do know well they handle in a variety of circumstances and how well they'll come to a stop if that action is ever needed. I would say that anyone who is used to higher speeds on a regular basis is usually safer than anyone who never exceeds 69mph.So when you get "bored and inattentive" at 80 then 90 and then 110 because that becomes normal. What happens then? Perhaps 130 on a bike, or why not 160?
Most modern cars look after themselves and few drivers are even aware of how much TCS and/or active ride is controlling their car, even at relatively low speeds. Perhaps you should credit your smooth driving achievements to the car designers who now "baby" all modern car drivers, that is until ultimate limits are encountered and things suddenly go pear shaped when air bags and vehicle structures take over.
If your driving needs challenging I would suggest you try and impress a police driving instructor at 30mph. I guarantee that you'll never get "bored" while driving again and if you had any real ability he would probably have the good grace to deflate your ego gently.
At lower speeds you're more amongst the cut and thrust of traffic on a motorway because there's a lot of stuff going faster than you that you have to deal with. When you're the fastest person on the road everything is effectively going backwards from in front of you to behind you, just at varying rates. At 70mph you're planning a lot more lane changes and negotiating your way around slower traffic without conflicting with what's coming up behind.
Pedantically stick to the speed limit and you can cause grief though. I've encountered situations of people pulling into the outside lane to overtake traffic that then speeds up, for example if the lead car in the line in the middle lane has moved over. They then begin an overtake that drags on for mile after mile as they inch past the slightly slower traffic while the blood pressure of everyone behind rises and patience runs out and often someones tries some dodgy manoeuvre passing vehicles on the inside and cutting into the line in the outside lane. Whilst those people shouldn't be behaving like that it's best not to create a situation which encourages it and puts you in danger.
Pedantically stick to the speed limit and you can cause grief though. I've encountered situations of people pulling into the outside lane to overtake traffic that then speeds up, for example if the lead car in the line in the middle lane has moved over. They then begin an overtake that drags on for mile after mile as they inch past the slightly slower traffic while the blood pressure of everyone behind rises and patience runs out and often someones tries some dodgy manoeuvre passing vehicles on the inside and cutting into the line in the outside lane. Whilst those people shouldn't be behaving like that it's best not to create a situation which encourages it and puts you in danger.
During a Bike Safe assessment, this is where two bikers ride with a police motorcyclist and he assesses your riding skills offering tips and tricks, anyway. Before we went on our ride his requirements with respect to speed was always heed 30, 40 and 50 mph zones but in national speed limit areas try to make progress. I asked what that meant and he said, sometimes it’s ok to go beyond 60 mph but that depends upon the road type, visibility etc.
I use this thought process through driving a car. I don’t speed through 30,40,50 mph zones and when I get to NSL areas I don’t put my foot down and zoom off but I take a little less notice of my speed and more about the situation. Years of experience should tell you if you’re going over in excess of 60. If the road is clear but narrow then I drive to the conditions, 40/50 mph if however the road is wide, empty and visibility is good then 60/65 + mph.
Enjoyment form driving for me is about handling the car smoothly through a corner and accelerating away, breaking, dropping a gear and existing if done right is great fun. Excessive speed however is a bit too, dare I say, ‘chavy’ , it’s too easy, most cars can do 100mph it ‘aint that cool.
Motorways are great for making pace; my happy medium is 80 mph, that’s indicated on the speedo so probably an actual 73 but an indicated 80 is ok for me.
Speed is an emotive subject.
I use this thought process through driving a car. I don’t speed through 30,40,50 mph zones and when I get to NSL areas I don’t put my foot down and zoom off but I take a little less notice of my speed and more about the situation. Years of experience should tell you if you’re going over in excess of 60. If the road is clear but narrow then I drive to the conditions, 40/50 mph if however the road is wide, empty and visibility is good then 60/65 + mph.
Enjoyment form driving for me is about handling the car smoothly through a corner and accelerating away, breaking, dropping a gear and existing if done right is great fun. Excessive speed however is a bit too, dare I say, ‘chavy’ , it’s too easy, most cars can do 100mph it ‘aint that cool.
Motorways are great for making pace; my happy medium is 80 mph, that’s indicated on the speedo so probably an actual 73 but an indicated 80 is ok for me.
Speed is an emotive subject.
But what do you do when a perfectly good NSL gets reduced to a 40mph?
Do you question it, or follow blindly as a sheep?
That's the reason I just drive to whatever speed I feel is safe/good these days.... although I am very aware of the posted limit...
I used to be the guy holding up traffic doing 30 in a 30, twenty years ago, but it all wen tits up.
Do you question it, or follow blindly as a sheep?
That's the reason I just drive to whatever speed I feel is safe/good these days.... although I am very aware of the posted limit...
I used to be the guy holding up traffic doing 30 in a 30, twenty years ago, but it all wen tits up.
robbyd said:
But what do you do when a perfectly good NSL gets reduced to a 40mph?
Do you question it, or follow blindly as a sheep?
I follow it because I know perfectly well that a camera partnership and half the local police force are hiding in the bushes in the hope of pulling me for speeding. Why do you think they lower such speed limits in the first place?Do you question it, or follow blindly as a sheep?
I got caught during a safe overtake of a lorry and two other cars that were reluctant to do so on a straight downhill stretch by a mobile camera van in a layby. I got the NIP in the post at 77mph and I know they flashed me on my overtake as my "Road Angel" flashed up "Mobile" during said manoeuvre. I wrote to appropriate dept. saying I felt it was unfair as it was a safe overtake and how silly it would have been to stick to 60 etc. The response I had back was that they could prosecute at 1 mph over the limit if they chose. So how much can you break it by??? None if the laser officers are about
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