Are driving standards in the UK getting worse?
Discussion
Hi,
I'm doing some research into driving standards in the UK and am looking for the opinions of motorists on the issue. What do you think? Are driving standards getting worse? Is knowledge of cuts to policing meaning people are more likely to engage in more 'dangerous' behaviours because they think they won't get caught?
Thanks,
Chris
I'm doing some research into driving standards in the UK and am looking for the opinions of motorists on the issue. What do you think? Are driving standards getting worse? Is knowledge of cuts to policing meaning people are more likely to engage in more 'dangerous' behaviours because they think they won't get caught?
Thanks,
Chris
I was unemployed for 3 years (2011 -> 2014) and hence I didn't drive very much at all.
However, when I got another job and began driving regularly again, I was quite shocked at the deterioration in driving standards.
People using phones, cutting bends, speeding being the most noticeable.
However, when I got another job and began driving regularly again, I was quite shocked at the deterioration in driving standards.
People using phones, cutting bends, speeding being the most noticeable.
There seems to be more selfish and aggressive behaviour now than in the past.
I put the selfishness down to a general increase in that type of behaviour in society as a whole, which I'd guess is down to the culture of instant gratification we have, where everything we want can be instantly bought and also to the breakdown in social cohesion, where sharing with others and making concessions to the needs of others has greatly decreased.
The socialisation process is failing to equip people to function in a society full of other individuals, I think. Also, parents seem to indulge their kids a lot more these days, so the kids grow into adults who expect that their every whim will be instantly satisfied.
Secondly, I am sure the growth in aggressive driving relates partly to this selfish need for instant gratification, which means people are less prepared to wait and show tolerance for others, but also to the relatively fast, more powerful cars that are readily available. It's much more difficult to be aggressive in a slow, underpowered car. Also of course the traffic congestion leads to frustration, albeit self-inflicted by drivers on themselves.
It has a knock-on effect on cyclists such as myself, as we experience more instances of dangerous driving from speeding, impatient drivers who will not wait a few seconds until it is safe to pass, but who then invariably spend far longer stuck in 'traffic'...
I put the selfishness down to a general increase in that type of behaviour in society as a whole, which I'd guess is down to the culture of instant gratification we have, where everything we want can be instantly bought and also to the breakdown in social cohesion, where sharing with others and making concessions to the needs of others has greatly decreased.
The socialisation process is failing to equip people to function in a society full of other individuals, I think. Also, parents seem to indulge their kids a lot more these days, so the kids grow into adults who expect that their every whim will be instantly satisfied.
Secondly, I am sure the growth in aggressive driving relates partly to this selfish need for instant gratification, which means people are less prepared to wait and show tolerance for others, but also to the relatively fast, more powerful cars that are readily available. It's much more difficult to be aggressive in a slow, underpowered car. Also of course the traffic congestion leads to frustration, albeit self-inflicted by drivers on themselves.
It has a knock-on effect on cyclists such as myself, as we experience more instances of dangerous driving from speeding, impatient drivers who will not wait a few seconds until it is safe to pass, but who then invariably spend far longer stuck in 'traffic'...
BGarside said:
There seems to be more selfish and aggressive behaviour now than in the past.
I put the selfishness down to a general increase in that type of behaviour in society as a whole, which I'd guess is down to the culture of instant gratification we have, where everything we want can be instantly bought and also to the breakdown in social cohesion, where sharing with others and making concessions to the needs of others has greatly decreased.
The socialisation process is failing to equip people to function in a society full of other individuals, I think. Also, parents seem to indulge their kids a lot more these days, so the kids grow into adults who expect that their every whim will be instantly satisfied.
Secondly, I am sure the growth in aggressive driving relates partly to this selfish need for instant gratification, which means people are less prepared to wait and show tolerance for others, but also to the relatively fast, more powerful cars that are readily available. It's much more difficult to be aggressive in a slow, underpowered car. Also of course the traffic congestion leads to frustration, albeit self-inflicted by drivers on themselves.
It has a knock-on effect on cyclists such as myself, as we experience more instances of dangerous driving from speeding, impatient drivers who will not wait a few seconds until it is safe to pass, but who then invariably spend far longer stuck in 'traffic'...
Totally agree with your post you have summed things up correctly. I passed my driving test in the year 2000 and I found drivers less aggressive then. I hate driving now because there is always pressure to drive faster from people behind you. I think now people have safer cars with better brakes they have a false sense of security and think that driving at high speeds is safe because they have all these safety features that will save them if things go wrong. I personally hate driving, now but living in a small village with no banks or supermarkets I have to do it. When I was younger I would go out for a drive to enjoy it but now it is a chore. I have changed cars in the attempt to re enjoy my younger days but has made no difference. I now look after my 91 year old dad and drive him around his own car a clio sport 2006 model and I hate it because so many people want to race me. If I don`t race they overtake me on a blind bend. They could have overtaken me several times safely on a straight part of road but they always choose the most dangerous part of road to overtake me. I put the selfishness down to a general increase in that type of behaviour in society as a whole, which I'd guess is down to the culture of instant gratification we have, where everything we want can be instantly bought and also to the breakdown in social cohesion, where sharing with others and making concessions to the needs of others has greatly decreased.
The socialisation process is failing to equip people to function in a society full of other individuals, I think. Also, parents seem to indulge their kids a lot more these days, so the kids grow into adults who expect that their every whim will be instantly satisfied.
Secondly, I am sure the growth in aggressive driving relates partly to this selfish need for instant gratification, which means people are less prepared to wait and show tolerance for others, but also to the relatively fast, more powerful cars that are readily available. It's much more difficult to be aggressive in a slow, underpowered car. Also of course the traffic congestion leads to frustration, albeit self-inflicted by drivers on themselves.
It has a knock-on effect on cyclists such as myself, as we experience more instances of dangerous driving from speeding, impatient drivers who will not wait a few seconds until it is safe to pass, but who then invariably spend far longer stuck in 'traffic'...
Interesting topic and yes I think that driving standards have got worse.
Not sure if you are looking for a cross UK picture because there has always been some regionality to it. I started driving in the late 60's based up in Yorkshire. My first adventure into London , probably around 1969 was an eye opener, but even so completely civilised compared to today. So is there a regional effect or is it down to population density, traffic density or something else. Then there's the question of people driving who didn't learn in Uk, is that an influence or insignificant.
Certainly when you drive off the ferry in Dover, by Christ it's a shock to the system that you don't get to the same extent leaving the ferry ports of Harwich, or Hull and Newcastle say.
Sorry OP for asking more questions than giving answers but depending where you are in your research, sometimes it's better to have people saying what about this and that.
Problem is that it's the extremes which we notice rather than the millions of completely unremarkable vehicles and drivers going about their way. So is it that instances have become more frequent, or that they haven't just that things reach greater extremes?
Not sure if you are looking for a cross UK picture because there has always been some regionality to it. I started driving in the late 60's based up in Yorkshire. My first adventure into London , probably around 1969 was an eye opener, but even so completely civilised compared to today. So is there a regional effect or is it down to population density, traffic density or something else. Then there's the question of people driving who didn't learn in Uk, is that an influence or insignificant.
Certainly when you drive off the ferry in Dover, by Christ it's a shock to the system that you don't get to the same extent leaving the ferry ports of Harwich, or Hull and Newcastle say.
Sorry OP for asking more questions than giving answers but depending where you are in your research, sometimes it's better to have people saying what about this and that.
Problem is that it's the extremes which we notice rather than the millions of completely unremarkable vehicles and drivers going about their way. So is it that instances have become more frequent, or that they haven't just that things reach greater extremes?
People will always answer "yes" to that question, OP.
Statistically, it's got safer.
Anecdotally, I would certainly say that jumping red lights is now far more prevalant than it was.
General standards? I dunno, probably much of a muchness tbh. More cars on the road means more chance for people to come into conflict or get frustrated.
Statistically, it's got safer.
Anecdotally, I would certainly say that jumping red lights is now far more prevalant than it was.
General standards? I dunno, probably much of a muchness tbh. More cars on the road means more chance for people to come into conflict or get frustrated.
CrutyRammers said:
More cars on the road means more chance for people to come into conflict or get frustrated.
Quite so. I'm not convinced that standards have fallen in general but there are just so many cars on the road now that we see more examples of mupppetry on any given drive. With the volume of traffic now it only takes one idiot lane hogger, dawdler etc to quickly cause major queues and frustration which then worsens the driving of others around them.TonyRPH said:
I was unemployed for 3 years (2011 -> 2014) and hence I didn't drive very much at all.
However, when I got another job and began driving regularly again, I was quite shocked at the deterioration in driving standards.
People using phones, cutting bends, speeding being the most noticeable.
I am surprised. It must be pointed out that as each of us gets both older and more experienced our perceptions change. My perception is that speeds are significantly lower than they used to be. I put this down to the extent of the enforcement regime as well as the all pervasive reduction in limits. Most people drive extremely safely as confirmed by the accident stats. However, when I got another job and began driving regularly again, I was quite shocked at the deterioration in driving standards.
People using phones, cutting bends, speeding being the most noticeable.
chaz1234 said:
Totally agree with your post you have summed things up correctly. I passed my driving test in the year 2000 and I found drivers less aggressive then. I hate driving now because there is always pressure to drive faster from people behind you......
Totally agree, it seems to be impossible to drive in a relaxed, sensible way and observe the speed limits without some impatient, aggressive, arrogant pr!ck racing up behind and tailgating to try to force you to speed up. It's not at all relaxing driving in the UK these days.
There may be some truth in it, but it's as much about 'our' impatience with the impatient/aggressive ones IYSWIM.
I've recently made a conscious decision to be more relaxed and patient in my life, especially driving. Rather than get annoyed I try to forgive and forget, even pretend I haven't noticed their 'fault' and it's certainly helped me to be more calm.
I think it was Reg who quoted something from one of his instructors; forgive them for they know not what they've done - or similar.
I've recently made a conscious decision to be more relaxed and patient in my life, especially driving. Rather than get annoyed I try to forgive and forget, even pretend I haven't noticed their 'fault' and it's certainly helped me to be more calm.
I think it was Reg who quoted something from one of his instructors; forgive them for they know not what they've done - or similar.
waremark said:
I am surprised. It must be pointed out that as each of us gets both older and more experienced our perceptions change. My perception is that speeds are significantly lower than they used to be. I put this down to the extent of the enforcement regime as well as the all pervasive reduction in limits. Most people drive extremely safely as confirmed by the accident stats.
I'd agree on speeds, particularly on the motorway. I think that happened when the large rise in fuel prices happened a few years back, and it shot up over £1 up to £1:30 or wherever in a very few months. The change from "how fast does it go, mate?" to "what mpg does it do, mate?", which had been happening since I'd guess the late 90s, was then complete.BGarside said:
There seems to be more selfish and aggressive behaviour now than in the past.
I put the selfishness down to a general increase in that type of behaviour in society as a whole, which I'd guess is down to the culture of instant gratification we have, where everything we want can be instantly bought and also to the breakdown in social cohesion, where sharing with others and making concessions to the needs of others has greatly decreased.
The socialisation process is failing to equip people to function in a society full of other individuals, I think. Also, parents seem to indulge their kids a lot more these days, so the kids grow into adults who expect that their every whim will be instantly satisfied.
Secondly, I am sure the growth in aggressive driving relates partly to this selfish need for instant gratification, which means people are less prepared to wait and show tolerance for others, but also to the relatively fast, more powerful cars that are readily available. It's much more difficult to be aggressive in a slow, underpowered car. Also of course the traffic congestion leads to frustration, albeit self-inflicted by drivers on themselves.
It has a knock-on effect on cyclists such as myself, as we experience more instances of dangerous driving from speeding, impatient drivers who will not wait a few seconds until it is safe to pass, but who then invariably spend far longer stuck in 'traffic'...
great post, like someone else said.I put the selfishness down to a general increase in that type of behaviour in society as a whole, which I'd guess is down to the culture of instant gratification we have, where everything we want can be instantly bought and also to the breakdown in social cohesion, where sharing with others and making concessions to the needs of others has greatly decreased.
The socialisation process is failing to equip people to function in a society full of other individuals, I think. Also, parents seem to indulge their kids a lot more these days, so the kids grow into adults who expect that their every whim will be instantly satisfied.
Secondly, I am sure the growth in aggressive driving relates partly to this selfish need for instant gratification, which means people are less prepared to wait and show tolerance for others, but also to the relatively fast, more powerful cars that are readily available. It's much more difficult to be aggressive in a slow, underpowered car. Also of course the traffic congestion leads to frustration, albeit self-inflicted by drivers on themselves.
It has a knock-on effect on cyclists such as myself, as we experience more instances of dangerous driving from speeding, impatient drivers who will not wait a few seconds until it is safe to pass, but who then invariably spend far longer stuck in 'traffic'...
And of course this lack of good socialisation leads to impatient/inconsiderate cyclists too. (and pedestrians)
just sayin' ;-)
I think perceived change is as much to do with personal development as with any real change in the nation's driving habits. After we pass our test (1988 in my case) we get a few years' proper driving experience under our belt, at which point we are probably at a maximum ratio of personal confidence to hazard perception. It's not that the roads are especially safe at this point, just that they seem that way to us junior road gods, and that becomes our baseline for assessing future changes.
Then as we gain more experience - at the wheel and in life - our hazard perception improves and taking every corner at the car's limit of adhesion, regardless of what might be just out of sight, no longer seems such a smart idea. But other, newer drivers are still at their JRG stage so we see them do it and think the world has gone raving mad. As we get older still, our personal confidence may also decline and the roads seem more hazardous than ever.
Yes, I'm noticing more of certain pet peeves - red lights meaning 'time for three more', drivers who expect lane 1 traffic to make way at motorway junctions - but this must be mitigated by other faults that occur less now - smoking, drink-driving, not wearing a seatbelt. Air conditioning improves the view out, tyres grip better in the wet, brakes no longer fade at the slightest provocation. And the accident statistics suggest we're generally safer than a generation ago.
I tend to agree that asking us - a self-selecting sample - for our views and calling it research is pretty meaningless and poor scientific practice. We remember examples of bad driving precisely because good driving ought generally to go unnoticed. And - unless we're very old - we remember recent events more clearly than those in the distant past.
Then as we gain more experience - at the wheel and in life - our hazard perception improves and taking every corner at the car's limit of adhesion, regardless of what might be just out of sight, no longer seems such a smart idea. But other, newer drivers are still at their JRG stage so we see them do it and think the world has gone raving mad. As we get older still, our personal confidence may also decline and the roads seem more hazardous than ever.
Yes, I'm noticing more of certain pet peeves - red lights meaning 'time for three more', drivers who expect lane 1 traffic to make way at motorway junctions - but this must be mitigated by other faults that occur less now - smoking, drink-driving, not wearing a seatbelt. Air conditioning improves the view out, tyres grip better in the wet, brakes no longer fade at the slightest provocation. And the accident statistics suggest we're generally safer than a generation ago.
I tend to agree that asking us - a self-selecting sample - for our views and calling it research is pretty meaningless and poor scientific practice. We remember examples of bad driving precisely because good driving ought generally to go unnoticed. And - unless we're very old - we remember recent events more clearly than those in the distant past.
BGarside said:
Totally agree, it seems to be impossible to drive in a relaxed, sensible way and observe the speed limits without some impatient, aggressive, arrogant pr!ck racing up behind and tailgating to try to force you to speed up.
What makes you think that the guy close behind is trying to make you speed up? Isn't he just using his normal following distance with which he is quite comfortable? Does he bother you more or less than the driver driving too slowly in front of you? How do you deal with each? I don't think either causes me any stress.
waremark said:
What makes you think that the guy close behind is trying to make you speed up? Isn't he just using his normal following distance with which he is quite comfortable?
Does he bother you more or less than the driver driving too slowly in front of you? How do you deal with each? I don't think either causes me any stress.
They guy following close behind will crash into the back of you if you have to stop suddenly, that's the problem.Does he bother you more or less than the driver driving too slowly in front of you? How do you deal with each? I don't think either causes me any stress.
Dr Jekyll said:
waremark said:
What makes you think that the guy close behind is trying to make you speed up? Isn't he just using his normal following distance with which he is quite comfortable?
Does he bother you more or less than the driver driving too slowly in front of you? How do you deal with each? I don't think either causes me any stress.
They guy following close behind will crash into the back of you if you have to stop suddenly, that's the problem.Does he bother you more or less than the driver driving too slowly in front of you? How do you deal with each? I don't think either causes me any stress.
vonhosen said:
Dr Jekyll said:
waremark said:
What makes you think that the guy close behind is trying to make you speed up? Isn't he just using his normal following distance with which he is quite comfortable?
Does he bother you more or less than the driver driving too slowly in front of you? How do you deal with each? I don't think either causes me any stress.
They guy following close behind will crash into the back of you if you have to stop suddenly, that's the problem.Does he bother you more or less than the driver driving too slowly in front of you? How do you deal with each? I don't think either causes me any stress.
There is this infuriating double standard that says that if we follow too closely it's tailgating and running into the back of the other car is our fault. But if they follow too closely and run into the back of us it's our fault for stopping too quickly. We are the ones in the wrong either way.
Why can't they back off a bit, at least to a 2 second rule distance?
Dr Jekyll said:
vonhosen said:
Dr Jekyll said:
waremark said:
What makes you think that the guy close behind is trying to make you speed up? Isn't he just using his normal following distance with which he is quite comfortable?
Does he bother you more or less than the driver driving too slowly in front of you? How do you deal with each? I don't think either causes me any stress.
They guy following close behind will crash into the back of you if you have to stop suddenly, that's the problem.Does he bother you more or less than the driver driving too slowly in front of you? How do you deal with each? I don't think either causes me any stress.
There is this infuriating double standard that says that if we follow too closely it's tailgating and running into the back of the other car is our fault. But if they follow too closely and run into the back of us it's our fault for stopping too quickly. We are the ones in the wrong either way.
Why can't they back off a bit, at least to a 2 second rule distance?
The expectation is that we look out for each other. Poor driving by another doesn't absolve you of your responsibility to drive well & look out for them. If you drive poorly (for what ever reason), their poor driving does not absolve you, you are still guilty of poor driving. Collisions in the main occur when both parties driving poorly encounter one another. Again I said in the main.
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