Evasive/Defensive Driving

Evasive/Defensive Driving

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wolfy1988

Original Poster:

1,426 posts

162 months

Saturday 30th May 2015
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Hi Guys,

We are currently living in Kuwait and have received potentially dangerous road rage on a few occasions.

The driving standards here are terrible, Kuwait has the highest amount of car crashes as well as the highest amount of related deaths. From my experience a majority of the dangerous driving is done by drivers of large, heavy 4x4's such as; Landcruisers, Silverados and Patrols etc

My wife and I travel together 99% of the time but 2 months ago whilst I was out of the country on business, she was followed home, not in a typical way such as following from a distance, but instead the man circled here car as she was driving, attempted to push her from the lane and repeatedly slammed on his brakes in front of her, he gave up following before she got close to home. My advice to her if this was to happen agian was, do NOT stop. DO not drive home, drive to busy well lit area (petrol Station forecourt, police station, etc) and stand on the horn with doors locked and if the situation were to escalate so much that her life should be in danger, use the vehicle as her weapon.

Yesterday, whilst driving at the posted speed limit past a speed camera (80kph) a Infiniti QX 70 piloted by a well dressed arab lady quickly appeared at the back bumper (3-4ft) and proceeded to flash, beep and gesticulate her anger that we were now holding her up. My wife pulled in as soon as we had passed the slower traffic but gave her the finger (I know, I know. First time she has done it and last) Said Infiniti driver took huge offense to this and proceeded to try and cause an accident by braking sharply and swerving in lane, fortunately she did it with not much effect BUT if that lady was more determined, she could have.

The typical driving style here is extremely aggressive and very offensive, cars are used as weapons.

I have a dash cam in the front, I will get one for the back also. We had a discussion last night and agreed that we should simply get out of the way and keep out heads down. We have ICE numbers in phone to call as well as saved locations to navigate to should we run into trouble.

We are kind of alone from a law enforcement stand point should it escalate again, Locals will be favoured over us. I am painting a bad picture but I am realistic.

What day to day driving habits should we practice? Any other advice welcome

When my wife was followed she was driving a Red 5.7 Dodge Charger, now we are driving a Black Nissan Xterra 4.0 (pictured below)



Edited by wolfy1988 on Saturday 30th May 07:35

davepoth

29,395 posts

198 months

Saturday 30th May 2015
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Get a driver?

R_U_LOCAL

2,676 posts

207 months

Saturday 30th May 2015
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I've written a piece about dealing with other drivers' anger and aggression for the new book. It's written with the UK in mind and is meant for newly qualified drivers but I think a lot of it will be relevent to the situations you describe.

I'll dig it off the laptop a bit later today and post it on here.

wolfy1988

Original Poster:

1,426 posts

162 months

Saturday 30th May 2015
quotequote all
davepoth said:
Get a driver?
We don't want a driver, we like driving and we are terrible passengers.

A lot of people have drivers but its just not for us

wolfy1988

Original Poster:

1,426 posts

162 months

Saturday 30th May 2015
quotequote all
R_U_LOCAL said:
I've written a piece about dealing with other drivers' anger and aggression for the new book. It's written with the UK in mind and is meant for newly qualified drivers but I think a lot of it will be relevent to the situations you describe.

I'll dig it off the laptop a bit later today and post it on here.
Thanks Reg, I look forward to reading it.

R_U_LOCAL

2,676 posts

207 months

Saturday 30th May 2015
quotequote all
Ok, like I said earlier, this is part of a chapter of my second book which is only currently about half finished. Its aimed at newly-qualified drivers, primarily in the UK, but I think most of the advice is still valid:

Dealing with Anger and Aggression

If you’re out shopping and someone walks into you accidentally, or steps into your path forcing you to step around them, what happens?

In a very British way, everyone apologises profusely to everyone else, we generally smile at each other, shrug and carry on with our shopping.

But out on the road, things change – dramatically.

Inside the protective environment of a car, many people’s behaviour changes beyond recognition. Pull out accidentally in front of some people when they’re driving, and they seem to become psychotic, aggressive animals. It never ceases to amaze me how a normally mild-mannered and polite person can change their personality so dramatically just by sitting in the driving seat of a car.

I used to have a dog that, when I took it out for a walk, would become ridiculously aggressive towards a neighbour’s dog when it was safely locked behind a gate. The two of them would bark and snarl and growl at each other through the bars of the gate and you would have thought that, given the slightest opportunity, they would rip each other to pieces.

However, whenever my neighbour was out walking his dog, the two dogs would meet politely, sniff each other’s bums, wag their tails and generally act like the friendly dogs they were.

It was only the presence of the gate which made them feel like they were safely separated, so they could play the big, hard dog routine.

Many drivers are the same. Behind a windscreen and steering wheel, they are invincible beings, impervious to any threats and aggressive in the extreme. If you walked past them in a supermarket, however, or saw them in a pub, they wouldn’t say boo to a goose.

As a learner driver, you will already have experienced some aggression occasionally from other road users. You’ll have stalled in front of someone who may have then blared their horn or pulled out in front of someone by mistake and received a headlight flash or a fist shake.

Generally, however, because you’ve been driving a car with “L” plates displayed, accompanied by an instructor or a qualified driver, other drivers will have given you a little leeway because you were a learner. Most people – even the most aggressive drivers – are a little more understanding of mistakes made by learner drivers.

Now you’ve passed your test, however, you’re going to be on equal terms with every other driver out there. You’ll no longer be advertising the fact that you’re an inexperienced driver, and to everyone else on the road, there is no obvious indication that you’re a new driver.

So here’s what you should expect…

If you make a minor mistake by, perhaps, pulling out in front of another vehicle or stalling at some lights or by changing lanes carelessly, you will receive an aggressive response from approximately 75% of other drivers (this isn’t a scientific 75% by the way – just my estimate based on my own experience).

By “aggressive response”, I mean that they will sound their horn, drive unnecessarily close to you, flash their lights, shake their fist, give you any number of other (non-highway code!) hand signals, and generally behave in a very arsey manner.

There are also a very small minority of drivers who may go even further by getting out of their vehicles when you come to a stop, approaching you and remonstrating with you through the window of your car. I should add that these types of incidents are very rare, but it’s useful for you to be aware that these people are out there, and to know how to deal with these situations if they ever arise.

How to deal with other drivers’ aggression

Here’s my first tip – and it’s probably the most useful tip I can give you for dealing with aggressive drivers…

Apologise!

If you’ve made a mistake and someone is being aggressive with you – apologise.

It sounds simple, doesn’t it? But it’s amazing how many people make a mistake, receive an aggressive response and then respond themselves by sticking up one or two fingers, slamming on their brakes in front of the other driver, or responding in some other, equally aggressive manner.

Wouldn’t it be much better to just acknowledge you’ve made a mistake and hold your hand up to apologise to the other driver?

Acknowledging your mistake, and apologising for it takes almost all the heat out of the situation and most other drivers will see your apology and accept it without escalating their aggressive behaviour. It’s what you’d do if you were walking along the street and you bumped into someone, so why not take the same approach when you’re driving?

Once you’ve apologised, the next tip is to…

Ignore them

Once you’ve given an apology, if you’re still receiving aggression from another driver, just ignore them. Getting involved in any kind of argument or fist-shaking competition will only aggravate the situation and escalate the aggression from the other driver.

They may be making you feel very uncomfortable, but if you completely ignore the aggressive driver – give them no reaction whatsoever – they will very quickly go their own way and you’ll be able to get on with your journey.

Lock your doors

I said that it was very rare for another driver to get out of their vehicle to challenge you, but it does occasionally happen.

To keep yourself safe, the best advice is to lock your car doors before you set off on your journey. Most cars have central locking these days (all the locks operate automatically with the key and a switch inside the car). Get into the habit of locking the doors every time you set off. Many modern cars even have a setting which automatically locks the cars doors for you when you set off – check your cars handbook and switch the function on if it’s fitted.

And if anyone tries to talk you out of locking your car doors by telling you that “you’ll be locked in the car if you have an accident”, tell them they’re talking nonsense. The car’s doors will open in the normal way if you have an accident and anyone else will be able to open the car from the outside. The doors will only lock whilst you’re driving and will unlock if you switch off the ignition or if you have an accident.

Driving with your car doors locked will also protect you from any opportunistic thieves who may want to open your door and grab any valuables from your car.

If someone does approach you

If someone does approach your car in an aggressive manner, ignore them, keep your doors locked and your windows closed and drive away as soon as you possibly can. If you’re actually being physically threatened by someone, use your mobile phone to dial 999 and ask for police assistance – remember that you’re allowed to use your phone whilst driving if it is an emergency.

If another vehicle appears to be following you, drive to the nearest safe place – a police station would be perfect, but anywhere else where there are other people will be fine. A fire or ambulance station, a garage forecourt, a supermarket, shopping centre or anywhere else where there are other people present. The presence of other people will generally put off the aggressive driver and they are far more likely to leave you alone.

Please don’t worry too much though – being approached or followed is extremely rare and the chances are so small that it shouldn’t in any way put you off driving.

Learn from your mistakes

If you’ve been subject to an aggressive response from another driver, try to use it as a learning experience. As I’ve already mentioned, you’re at a point in your driving career where you’re looking to increase your experience as much as possible. Building up your experience does not mean getting things right all the time – you need to make mistakes so that you can learn from them and change your driving to avoid making the same mistake again.

So, if something you have done has wound up another driver, have a think about what you did, make a mental note of the circumstances which led up to you making that mistake, try to spot the same circumstances when you next go for a drive, and change your approach so that you don’t make the same mistake again.

So many people make the same mistakes over and over again without learning from them – you’re better than that!

Mistakes happen, but if the same mistake continues to happen, you’ve got a driving fault which needs to be corrected.

davepoth

29,395 posts

198 months

Saturday 30th May 2015
quotequote all
wolfy1988 said:
davepoth said:
Get a driver?
We don't want a driver, we like driving and we are terrible passengers.

A lot of people have drivers but its just not for us
I like driving too, but if it got to be an issue of personal safety for my wife (or me, for that matter) I'd be much happier if there was a trustworthy and burly man in the car at all times. From discussions I've had with former ex-pats in places both sandy and jungly having a driver really is the way to go, as it takes a lot of the stress out of the situation.

Gary C

12,312 posts

178 months

Tuesday 2nd June 2015
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Do you think you might be having trouble because your obviously European ?

wonder if heavily tinting the widows would help (as long as you can see out ok)

Also, if you respond with the finger, they cant see you !

Swanny87

1,265 posts

118 months

Wednesday 3rd June 2015
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Wow.

Is "use the car as a weapon" advice you were given or just something you have adopted? Either way I don't blame you!

Are there any expat/foreign national security firms you could get in contact with? Maybe they can provide some training...

V8forweekends

2,481 posts

123 months

Wednesday 3rd June 2015
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Having visited Kuwait (but mercifully having been driven everywhere by others) I sympathise - however from everything I saw there, one thing is very clear - as you say, as a non-local, you are considered pretty low.

It's a shock coming from a society where (officially at least) racism isn't promoted, to one where it's expected, but one of many problems with being an expat (and one reason I could never do it) is that you have to adapt to cultures you find troubling.

One of the guys I was working with was an Indian - he (trying to do the right thing) went to take his driving test. The examiner began (and ended) the test by asking if he was Indian. When he said yes, the guy told him there was no way he'd be getting a licence.

If I had to live there, I guess I'd wind my neck in as far as possible. If some berk is inches off my bumper, the sooner I can let 'em past (without issuing any finger based rebukes) the better.

I have no personal idea, but maybe the finger is more serious there than here (although I take it pretty ill when I'm on the receiving end).

wolfy1988

Original Poster:

1,426 posts

162 months

Thursday 4th June 2015
quotequote all
R_U_LOCAL said:
Lots of helpful stuff
Thanks Reg, you give some good advice. Thanks for taking the time to share that!

wolfy1988

Original Poster:

1,426 posts

162 months

Thursday 4th June 2015
quotequote all
Gary C said:
Do you think you might be having trouble because your obviously European ?

wonder if heavily tinting the widows would help (as long as you can see out ok)

Also, if you respond with the finger, they cant see you !
I think the fact we are European does have some negative impact for sure, although certainly not as much as other nationalities here.

I think your suggestion of window tinting is a great idea however, I have heard that the local police views are not that of the government and can be much stricter and harsher, I have heard of instances where cars were impounded! But I will look into it

wolfy1988

Original Poster:

1,426 posts

162 months

Thursday 4th June 2015
quotequote all
Swanny87 said:
Wow.

Is "use the car as a weapon" advice you were given or just something you have adopted? Either way I don't blame you!

Are there any expat/foreign national security firms you could get in contact with? Maybe they can provide some training...
'use your car as a weapon' is my advice to my OH if things get out of hand, it comes from advice that she was given from her grand mother when she had passed her test, she said ' A car is likely to be the most powerful weapon you will ever own, be careful' Im not sure she meant it in this context wink but great piece of wisdom non the less!

I would actually love to do some training, good call. I shall investigate that further!

wolfy1988

Original Poster:

1,426 posts

162 months

Thursday 4th June 2015
quotequote all
V8forweekends said:
Having visited Kuwait (but mercifully having been driven everywhere by others) I sympathise - however from everything I saw there, one thing is very clear - as you say, as a non-local, you are considered pretty low.

It's a shock coming from a society where (officially at least) racism isn't promoted, to one where it's expected, but one of many problems with being an expat (and one reason I could never do it) is that you have to adapt to cultures you find troubling.

One of the guys I was working with was an Indian - he (trying to do the right thing) went to take his driving test. The examiner began (and ended) the test by asking if he was Indian. When he said yes, the guy told him there was no way he'd be getting a licence.

If I had to live there, I guess I'd wind my neck in as far as possible. If some berk is inches off my bumper, the sooner I can let 'em past (without issuing any finger based rebukes) the better.

I have no personal idea, but maybe the finger is more serious there than here (although I take it pretty ill when I'm on the receiving end).
I agree with all of the above, re the licence, now you have to prove that you earn more that 1600 per month, have at least a bachelors degree and are in one of the exempt professions before you qualify for a licence, otherwise you will need all of the above AND wait 2 years.



Hackney

6,810 posts

207 months

Thursday 4th June 2015
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R_U_LOCAL said:
How to deal with other drivers’ aggression

Here’s my first tip – and it’s probably the most useful tip I can give you for dealing with aggressive drivers…

Apologise!

If you’ve made a mistake and someone is being aggressive with you – apologise.

It sounds simple, doesn’t it? But it’s amazing how many people make a mistake, receive an aggressive response and then respond themselves by sticking up one or two fingers, slamming on their brakes in front of the other driver, or responding in some other, equally aggressive manner.
Some sound adice there for all drivers.
Although the number of people who make a mistake and then go straight to being aggressive themselves though. Pedestrians who step out into a busy road without looking , get pipped and then respond with aggressive words or gestures.

Sad to see how people are incapable of doing something wrong.

R_U_LOCAL

2,676 posts

207 months

Thursday 4th June 2015
quotequote all
Some further, slightly more advanced tips for more experienced drivers:

Remain fully aware of whats happening 360 degrees around your car at all times. Never get lazy and keep practising good all-round observations.

If you think a vehicle is following you there are a few techniques you can use to confirm whether it is following you or not, and a couple of simple counter-surveillance techniques you can use to get rid of them if they are following you.

To check if you're being followed, one of the simplist techniques is just to pull over by the side of the road and stop. See if the suspect vehicle does the same, or if it passes you and continues with its journey.

Go around the block. Turn left, then left again, then left again and then back onto the road you were originally on. It's unlikely that anyone else would want to go around the same random block, so if they do, they may be following you.

In a similar way, carry out what we used to call a "reciprocal" at the next roundabout - go all the way around and then either double-back on yourself or do a 360 and carry on in your original direction. A vehicle following you won't necessarily know where you're heading and will follow you on your pointless circuit.

If you think you are being followed, it's good practice to try to get the following vehicle to pass you - either in traffic or by carrying out a 360 at a roundabout or by going round a short block.

Once the vehicle is in front of you, wait till it's passed a junction or roindabout exit and then turn off quickly to the left (or right if you drive on the left - it doesn't require you to wait for a break in traffic). Turn off again and take a random series of turns. Leave it 10 or 15 minutes before you resume your original route.

If you have a regular journey at regular times, take different routes on different days. Keep varying your routine and avoid - at all costs - doing the same route at the same time every day.

Drive legally and non-aggressively at all times and don't enter into any conflicts with other drivers or road users.

These are a few techniques I used to teach to protection drivers during the road phase of a security escort course. Other stuff we used to teach involved escape and evasion techniques, ramming, close convoy driving etc.

If you'd like me to come over to the Middle East and run a course for you, just let me know! I'm quite cheap!

BNC47

80 posts

142 months

Monday 22nd June 2015
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wolfy1988 said:
We don't want a driver, we like driving and we are terrible passengers.

A lot of people have drivers but its just not for us
Get a Glock. evil

davidc1

1,544 posts

161 months

Monday 22nd June 2015
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Nice tips here.
I remonstrated a few months ago with a car at Bluewater in Kent as I was driving in. Guy did not pull away from a junction and when I went round him he was on the phone.
I gave him a dirty look , and that was all it took...
He then chased me for the next 5 minutes like a man possessed. I was alone and he had his 7 year old son with him.he got out the car at one stage , but I drove off. Scary stuff as u don't know what the lunatic
Is going to do.
Once I Sussed he was following me by taking a few turns ,
I shook him off by going round and round a couple of roundabouts.
A 200hp clio has a nice advantage over a 10 year old zafira..

If I was like minded who knows how that would have ended....
Nice to have a fast car at a time like that.





7mike

3,005 posts

192 months

Monday 22nd June 2015
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wolfy1988 said:
I would actually love to do some training, good call. I shall investigate that further!
If you're still looking have a chat with this guy: http://www.keithlane.com/

He's worked in the Middle East for years and has lots of contacts out there. Or pm me, some of my collegues have ex-sf and/or plod backgrounds and are experienced trainers in the ME.

p1esk

4,914 posts

195 months

Tuesday 23rd June 2015
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R_U_LOCAL said:
I'm quite cheap!
But he's exceedingly good value.... smile

Best wishes all,
Dave.

PS. He once told me I wouldn't pass an advanced test. I'm sure that was right: it still is. frown