Does anyone change gear anymore

[SVS]

Nearlyretired said:

There is not such thing as "Advanced" Driving.
Everyone drives to a different standard, some good, some bad.

Much as I dislike the term "advanced", it's commonly used to refer to post-test training (such as, but not limited to, the IAM, RoADAR and HPC). Sometimes it can be helpful to make the distinction between L-test and "advanced" driving, because the latter has some techniques, e.g. Limit Point Analysis, which aren't generally taught for the L-test.

[p1esk]

NiceCupOfTea said:

Vipers said:

Had my auto for a service last year, got a curtesy car, a manual.

I was very conscious in town I was foreverI changing gear, hardly had time for two hands on the steering wheel.

Autos for me.

Any one remember having to double de clutch on those with a crash gearbox?

My daily for several years was a Saab 9000 manual with no synchro on 2nd. The only way to change down into second was by double declutching. I just did it without thinking, and I still do it irrespective of the car I drive.

I have no objections to autos but prefer a manual when I am driving for fun. Also, autos seem to give bigger bills.

Quite early on in my driving days I acquired the habit of double declutching for most downward gearchanges, and I still do it. Most of my cars didn't really need it, although on the Jaguar 3.8 litre Mark 2 the synchromesh was generally weak, and non-existent on 1st gear.

As for bigger bills, I expect automatics are more expensive to repair when they go wrong, but on the other hand a persistently clumsy driver is more likely to do damage to a manual gearbox than with an automatic.

[Vipers]

Dr Jekyll said:

Vipers said:

Had my auto for a service last year, got a curtesy car, a manual.

I was very conscious in town I was foreverI changing gear, hardly had time for two hands on the steering wheel.

Autos for me.

Any one remember having to double de clutch on those with a crash gearbox?

I've ridden with people who drive like that and I don't understand it, up to third for 50 yards, then back to second for one hazard, then third again.

Blow it, just leave it in second until you can stay at 25-30 for a decent length of time, the engine won't explode just because you exceed 3000rpm. My driving instructor mate used to discourage pupils from rowing the car along with the gear lever with a simple demonstration. Start the car, drive out of town and along an NSL stretch at 60, then back into town and park. All in second gear without touching the gear lever. His motto was 'only change gear when you can't think of anything more useful to do'.

Probably easier in a bigger car, when I had a 2ltr Cavalier, I would pull away in 2nd, (long time ago but I think it would pull well to 70 in 2nd), straight into 4th but when your local dealer gives you a freebee something with a thousand cc of snarling death, not that easy.

[Artofkicking]

Stickyfinger said:

oh dear oh dear

popcorn ready

I love shifting gears! I think what happened to a lot of manual transmissions was the cars. Front wheel drive cars in particular aren't nearly the same as rear wheel drive cars when downshifting. Since a lot of "sports cars" are FWD they sucked when downshifting into a corner when handing is extra important. So people staring opting for AT instead of MT and the manufactures started making more cars with AT to meet demands. Are far as mom and dad's cruiser, well it didn't really come with a choice. LOL

[bearman68]

OP, what do you mean does anyone change gear - and what's all this auto transmission I keep hearing about?

[OverSteery]

Idle hands are the devil's playthings

I insist on manual, but it's become ever harder to source a suitable vehicle

[Dogwatch]

I've been driving manuals for so long the whole thing is completely 'automatic'. If I start to think about what gear I'm in, or should be in, things go wrong!

I've nothing against autos but I've probably passed the point of no return now and to move to an auto box would put me in the local paper for driving through a shop window .. or worse.

[spookly]

Depends what I'm using the car for.

For honing around and pushing it a bit: Manual
For cruising along or long distance driving or stuck in traffic: Slush Auto

So, if I have to have one car only: Dual clutch Auto

I find the dual clutch auto a reasonable compromise between the convenience of an auto, but with fairly snappy manual changes... albeit without having to operate a clutch. The amount of traffic these days means that I definitely want an auto when I'm not hooning about, so a manual for me is not an option unless it is a second car.

My current main car has a DSG (6 gear, wet clutch). I quite like it.

[WokkaWokka]

I've got an automatic and I enjoy leaning on it and down changing because it blips the throttle better than I ever could when I drove manuals. Even as a younger driver I revelled in the pleasure of blipping the throttle and down changing. Such good fun but alas the car does it for you now. Going to Italy in a few weeks where I will drive my favourite budget car, a fiat panda and it will definitely be a manual.

[DocSteve]

CrutyRammers said:

People always bring up manual ignition advance etc in these conversations, but there is a massive difference. Ignition timing, starting, choke, can all be controlled in a set manner. For this load and this throttle at this rpm, this is the best ignition setting. Whereas gear selection isn't like that, because it requires situational awareness and anticipation of what is ahead. not a valid comparison Imo.

Gear selection can be done without a clutch pedal - more quickly with the right setup. This argument can go on - some enjoy (perfectly reasonably) the technical challenge of H&T but the idea you can't have rapid, commanded gear changes without a clutch pedal is romantic nonsense in my view.

[footnote]

I've never driven an automatic or used a mobile when driving but this thread has answered my previous befuddlement at how drivers were always able to have a mobile in one hand and still drive - duh!!!

May explain why autos are more popular too, one less job to do when you've got more imortant stuff going on...

Edited by footnote on Monday 20th February 07:46

[Butter Face]

Who are these 'most people' you lot are referencing.

Manuals still outsell autos in this country, IME by probably 20:1 (from what I selll anyway) and 'most podlike' don't like/don't drive autos.

[Vipers]

Butter Face said:

Who are these 'most people' you lot are referencing.

Manuals still outsell autos in this country, IME by probably 20:1 (from what I selll anyway) and 'most podlike' don't like/don't drive autos.

Was same in the states, not sure about now. Either boxes don't suit all.

[TurboHatchback]

There is a time and a place for a manual box however these are ever more fleeting. If all of the following are true then a good manual is great:

• Small (<=3.0l) audible petrol engine
• Lightweight focused chassis
• No traffic

For most drivers 99% of the time this is not the case. Diesel manuals are horrid, inaudible petrols are irritating having to constantly watch the rev counter, manual barges are just nonsensical and traffic is just awful in a manual car. That rare moment where there is a fun open road in front of you and you're in your little sports car is joyous but that happens so rarely. For 95% of driving the auto is a no-brainer, if I could only own one car it would be an auto though thankfully I can own both.

[MorganP104]

I think a better question would be; "Do people with automatic gearboxes change gears themselves?"

Personally, with every automatic car I get (most of my cars over the last 15 years have been autos), I play with the tiptronic function a couple of times, then leave the car in "D" thereafter!

How many of the flappy paddle brigade change gear themselves as a matter of course?

[gdaybruce]

My wife ran a Freelander with the manual transmission, swearing she would never drive an auto. However, she then developed a problem with her leg, such that pressing the clutch became painful and so I found a replacement with the auto gearbox while our daughter took over custody of the manual. So we now have two Freelanders in the family, one auto and one manual. The auto is a conventional 6 speed torque converter unit.

I always thought the manual change was extremeley good - light and precise - but I also enjoy the sheer simplicity of driving the auto. On the manual, the dual mass flywheel gave up the ghost at around 90,000 which is a problem that won't afflict the auto since it won't have one. However, who knows what problems might beset the auto in fulness of time! I reckon I can drive the manual more smoothly (at least when I'm concentrating!) and you certainly have more control over the car in terms of selecting the precise gear you want at any given moment. I think the auto is more economical, probably in part because on a light throttle it changes up more readily than my wife would when driving the manual. However, the engine is in a different state of tune and the manual was running on all terrain tyres so a direct comparison is difficult.

If I was choosing between them now for just my own use? A really hard decision but despite doing loads of town driving I think I'd go back to the manual.

[del mar]

A lot depends on the car.

For years I had owned 2litre turbo charged cars, you had to change gear regularly to keep them "on the boil". I then bought a larger engined car and you don't need to change gear anywhere near as often to keep the car moving - do you become lazier because of it ?

I have also hired small engine cars that unless you change down at every undulation in the road it just died - they are a lot of work.

I have one automatic and never change the gears, but that gives you a far more relaxed drive.

[Vipers]

MorganP104 said:

I think a better question would be; "Do people with automatic gearboxes change gears themselves?"

Personally, with every automatic car I get (most of my cars over the last 15 years have been autos), I play with the tiptronic function a couple of times, then leave the car in "D" thereafter!

How many of the flappy paddle brigade change gear themselves as a matter of course?

Don't have tiptronic, just bog standard auto, bung it in D and go, only use L is when I am coming down the ramps in the multi story carparks.

And on odd occasions R to go backwards

[66mpg]

I am going to keep on changing gear manually until I can do it right.

[Crippo]

Manuals are the epitome of Sports car driving. They involve you to use your skill...as in a sport. Anything else is just allowing technology to do it for you and hence diminishes the element of skill. If you like driving then you like developing this skill.
I had a few company cars with DSG type gearboxes and I used them to develop my left foot braking skills... now I left foot brake, heel and toe whilst driving my sports car manual....so I took the opportunity presented to enjoy my driving more.
At the end of the day driving is either a mundane must do activity or something to be enjoyed...I choose to enjoy it and it's not really about setting World Record speeds down a B road but is about enjoyment...end of!