Undertaking....

[RobM77]

MorganP104 said:

Is there anything more satisfying than undertaking a MLM, at the same time as someone else is overtaking them, at a speed matching yours?

Gives me such a warm feeling.

I did that this morning on the M3. No other cars around, except MLM doing 65 in lane 2, a guy in lane 3 doing about 75 and me in lane 1 doing 70. He didn’t move over - I kept a glancing eye on him as I continued on up the motorway.

[briang9]

MorganP104 said:

Is there anything more satisfying than undertaking a MLM, at the same time as someone else is overtaking them, at a speed matching yours?

Gives me such a warm feeling.

Circling them is even better, specially when they don't even seem to realise what's happening

[p1esk]

MorganP104 said:

Is there anything more satisfying than undertaking a MLM, at the same time as someone else is overtaking them, at a speed matching yours?

Gives me such a warm feeling.

Hmm, could be a bit dodgy though, if the ML twerp suddenly decides to move over from lane 2 to lane 1 when he sees somebody going past him in lane 3, and not noticing what you're doing on his other side. Unlikely? Maybe, but I'd be wary of it.

[p1esk]

briang9 said:

MorganP104 said:

Is there anything more satisfying than undertaking a MLM, at the same time as someone else is overtaking them, at a speed matching yours?

Gives me such a warm feeling.

Circling them is even better, specially when they don't even seem to realise what's happening

Yes, great fun I'm sure - until a police driver spots what you're doing.

Sorry, I'm in miserable old git mode this morning.

[RobM77]

p1esk said:

briang9 said:

MorganP104 said:

Is there anything more satisfying than undertaking a MLM, at the same time as someone else is overtaking them, at a speed matching yours?

Gives me such a warm feeling.

Circling them is even better, specially when they don't even seem to realise what's happening

Yes, great fun I'm sure - until a police driver spots what you're doing.

Sorry, I'm in miserable old git mode this morning.

Yes. However, it's about assessing the situation from a wider perspective. Whilst this would indeed get you pulled over, I would argue that it's safer than changing from lane 1 to 3 and back again when there are cars in lanes 2 and 3. This would also involve either me or the lane 3 car slowing and then speeding up again, which has an environmental impact, and if there are other cars around could have a traffic impact as well. The other consideration is road rage - in my experience MLMs don't mind you undertaking them, but changing across 3 lanes and/or flashing them out of the way doesn't go down too well.

[p1esk]

RobM77 said:

p1esk said:

briang9 said:

MorganP104 said:

Is there anything more satisfying than undertaking a MLM, at the same time as someone else is overtaking them, at a speed matching yours?

Gives me such a warm feeling.

Circling them is even better, specially when they don't even seem to realise what's happening

Yes, great fun I'm sure - until a police driver spots what you're doing.

Sorry, I'm in miserable old git mode this morning.

Yes. However, it's about assessing the situation from a wider perspective. Whilst this would indeed get you pulled over, I would argue that it's safer than changing from lane 1 to 3 and back again when there are cars in lanes 2 and 3. This would also involve either me or the lane 3 car slowing and then speeding up again, which has an environmental impact, and if there are other cars around could have a traffic impact as well. The other consideration is road rage - in my experience MLMs don't mind you undertaking them, but changing across 3 lanes and/or flashing them out of the way doesn't go down too well.

When people talk about 'circling' in this context, I thought they meant moving to lane 3 to overtake a MLM then returning to lane 1, slowing down and letting the MLM overtake them, and then repeating the process. That sounds like circling.

I'm all for a bit of fun in the right place, but why anybody should take the time to mess about like that is something I can't fathom. It seems to me like looking for trouble, whereas although I like to do things my way, I also like an easy life and minimum hassle. Still, we're not all alike.

[RobM77]

p1esk said:

RobM77 said:

p1esk said:

briang9 said:

MorganP104 said:

Is there anything more satisfying than undertaking a MLM, at the same time as someone else is overtaking them, at a speed matching yours?

Gives me such a warm feeling.

Circling them is even better, specially when they don't even seem to realise what's happening

Yes, great fun I'm sure - until a police driver spots what you're doing.

Sorry, I'm in miserable old git mode this morning.

Yes. However, it's about assessing the situation from a wider perspective. Whilst this would indeed get you pulled over, I would argue that it's safer than changing from lane 1 to 3 and back again when there are cars in lanes 2 and 3. This would also involve either me or the lane 3 car slowing and then speeding up again, which has an environmental impact, and if there are other cars around could have a traffic impact as well. The other consideration is road rage - in my experience MLMs don't mind you undertaking them, but changing across 3 lanes and/or flashing them out of the way doesn't go down too well.

When people talk about 'circling' in this context, I thought they meant moving to lane 3 to overtake a MLM then returning to lane 1, slowing down and letting the MLM overtake them, and then repeating the process. That sounds like circling.

I'm all for a bit of fun in the right place, but why anybody should take the time to mess about like that is something I can't fathom. It seems to me like looking for trouble, whereas although I like to do things my way, I also like an easy life and minimum hassle. Still, we're not all alike.

Yes I admit I wouldn't do that. I was referring to cruising along L1 on 70mph cruise control and coming across someone doing 65 in L2 whilst there's a car doing 75 in L3. I often feel it's safer to just continue in the same lane and nobody has to change speed or course.

[p1esk]

Rob - I agree with you. To go past in lane 1 with a smallish speed differential, and a wary eye on 'the opposition' is, I'm sure, the safest way to deal with it, and I think it would be grossly unfair to get nicked for doing that.

[RobM77]

p1esk said:

Rob - I agree with you. To go past in lane 1 with a smallish speed differential, and a wary eye on 'the opposition' is, I'm sure, the safest way to deal with it, and I think it would be grossly unfair to get nicked for doing that.

Normally you'd be able to observe the driver's behaviour for a minute or two before you reach him. I wouldn't do it to an erratic driver, and I'll usually put my car right over to the left hand side of the lane, often even a gear down from normal if necessary. I've done this for years and not had a single issue.

[anonymous-user]

p1esk said:

Rob - I agree with you. To go past in lane 1 with a smallish speed differential, and a wary eye on 'the opposition' is, I'm sure, the safest way to deal with it, and I think it would be grossly unfair to get nicked for doing that.

I do the following:

stay in l1 a good distance back, pretty much match speeds and observe idiot in l2. Take a long, hard look and assess if they are am "i'm here for ever" or might actually look like they could move back into l1. Usually, this is extremely obvious

close up a bit, but make sure i'm not overlapped yet

Check i have a clear lane (hardshoulder counts) to my left, into the distance, should an avoiding swerve be required

double check for movement, or signs of life

accelerate past, with a decent speed to minimize the overlap time, but not so fast i couldn't brake (and swerve if necessary) to avoid them

[smallgun]

p1esk said:

MorganP104 said:

Is there anything more satisfying than undertaking a MLM, at the same time as someone else is overtaking them, at a speed matching yours?

Gives me such a warm feeling.

Hmm, could be a bit dodgy though, if the ML twerp suddenly decides to move over from lane 2 to lane 1 when he sees somebody going past him in lane 3, and not noticing what you're doing on his other side. Unlikely? Maybe, but I'd be wary of it.

Mostly you have the hard shoulder to move over onto if that should happen.

[p1esk]

smallgun said:

p1esk said:

MorganP104 said:

Is there anything more satisfying than undertaking a MLM, at the same time as someone else is overtaking them, at a speed matching yours?

Gives me such a warm feeling.

Hmm, could be a bit dodgy though, if the ML twerp suddenly decides to move over from lane 2 to lane 1 when he sees somebody going past him in lane 3, and not noticing what you're doing on his other side. Unlikely? Maybe, but I'd be wary of it.

Mostly you have the hard shoulder to move over onto if that should happen.

That's perfectly true, and it would be very useful to have that space, but I'd still rather not have to take evasive action at short notice.

I'm sure you'll appreciate my concern: me being an aged driver with slow reactions etc.

[carguy143]

To me, undertaking is the act of changing lanes and passing something on the wrong side just to make progress. I see nothing wrong in passing something without changing lanes and I often so this.

[overunder12g]

So, is it legal to undertake or not? Any true confirmed answers?
Sees if you get pulled for undertaking the answer is " It says on Pistonheads is "
Might not hack it I think.

[850R]

I normally find when approaching a
MLM a touch of Lucas helps, if said driver does not move over into L1 then I'm happy to proceed into L1 and undertake and give a fine 5 fingered salute!! (Tongue in cheek btw) before anyone gets into hand gestures!

I drive a HGV1 and I find those MLM a complete menace.

[vonhosen]

carguy143 said:

To me, undertaking is the act of changing lanes and passing something on the wrong side just to make progress. I see nothing wrong in passing something without changing lanes and I often so this.

A different interpretation in relation to that

Highway Code said:

Rule 268
Do not overtake on the left or move to a lane on your left to overtake..........

[lyonspride]

If you think that the MLM is bad here, try driving around Australia for a month.... Over there almost everyone is a MLM, not helped by the fact that their road system is a bit strange in that the LH lane (they drive on the same side as the UK) often filters off down minor side roads and then closes afterwards, only to open up again a few hundred yard later, as well parked cars sometimes in lane 1 of those roads.

Their main roads (equal to our A roads) are almost all dual carriageways (with 2 or 3 lanes per side), their highways (motorway) are also 3 lanes and so people just drive in lane 2 everywhere, undertaking is as illegal/legal there as here, BUT the problem of the MLM is SO bad that the Police don't bother to enforce it.

It's infuriating in one sense, but the combination of being able to undertake AND the fact that they don't have 42mph drivers like we do, makes the experience much less stressful than the UK.

[Len Woodman]

lyonspride said:

If you think that the MLM is bad here, try driving around Australia for a month.... Over there almost everyone is a MLM, not helped by the fact that their road system is a bit strange in that the LH lane (they drive on the same side as the UK) often filters off down minor side roads and then closes afterwards, only to open up again a few hundred yard later, as well parked cars sometimes in lane 1 of those roads.

Their main roads (equal to our A roads) are almost all dual carriageways (with 2 or 3 lanes per side), their highways (motorway) are also 3 lanes and so people just drive in lane 2 everywhere, undertaking is as illegal/legal there as here, BUT the problem of the MLM is SO bad that the Police don't bother to enforce it.

It's infuriating in one sense, but the combination of being able to undertake AND the fact that they don't have 42mph drivers like we do, makes the experience much less stressful than the UK.

Under our Road Rules (2014) overtaking on the left (undertaking to you all) is completely legal where lanes are marked on any road. On roads with a speed limit greater than 80 km/h (50 mph) a driver must KEEP LEFT UNLESS OVERTAKING [words on sign] or if the speed limit is lower and THAT sign is displayed. It means one can legally drive in lane two, where there is one, indefinitely.

Yes we do have 68 km/h drivers on our main roads.

It's gone midnight and it's 34 deg C so I'm going to bed now - I will cover why legalised undertaking is bad tomorrow! In my opinion it's one of the reasons drivers are generally quite bad here.

[Chris944]

Hmmmm.Undertaking and the Highway Code gives me a problemette.

Situation (A): It's okay to undertake (pass on the left) if the traffic in the lane you are in is travelling faster than traffic in the lane on the right, subject to speed limit observance. Okay. Fair enough.

Situation (B): It's not okay to come upon a MLM in lane 2 who is going slower than you, go into lane 1, pass them and carry on.

Right. With situation A, at some stage I moved from lane 2 to lane 1 and that enabled me to pass the MLM in lane 2.

How far behind said MLM do I have to be before my move into lane 1 becomes Highway code legal?

100 yards? 500 yards? One mile?

Also what is "traffic"?
A stream of two cars, three cars, four cars? One car?

The f*ck with it. If BIB are not around and MLM looks set in their MLM ways then undertake the sad f*cker. Life's too short, etc. to be held up by a moron.

[vonhosen]

You can do absolutely anything of your choosing if A) You don't get caught or B) You'll accept the consequences that follow if you do get caught.