Motorway Switching Lanes - Advice Needed

[MakaveliX]

ScoobyChris said:

I don’t think anyone was really at fault. The moment you can see him changing lanes, your plan has to change so you set speed to either merge in front or behind him. It’s good that you’re analysing decisions you made, but it’s also worth adding a dollop of perspective and don’t dwell too much on it.

Chris

Valid point. Thank you. I'd have liked him to at least indicated a bit longer. It is a thing though isn't it, when people tend to indicate as they are switching lanes rather than before switching. Seen it many times before.

[NRG1976]

MakaveliX said:

Merging on the M6 north earlier when this happened.
Did my usual checks to ensure I had a safe gap to merge into, when Blue Car in lane 2 decides to move into lane 1 just as I was about to merge.

Who is at fault here ? Looking at the video he may have indicated for a split second, but that could just be the reflections.

If it were me in Lane 2, I would have waited until after the slip road to move into Lane 1, rather than blocking my entry

Edited by MakaveliX on Saturday 1st July 17:24

If I was in the cam car I would have tried to match the speed of the traffic being merged into - you’re coming in too fast.

If I was in the blue car I would have stayed in lane 2 until I got past the merge point.

[ScoobyChris]

MakaveliX said:

Valid point. Thank you. I'd have liked him to at least indicated a bit longer. It is a thing though isn't it, when people tend to indicate as they are switching lanes rather than before switching. Seen it many times before.

In a lot of cases the indicator is used as a “justifier” so when the inevitable happens they can tell you “But I was indicating…”. When driving, seeing an indicator forms part of the available information, but more telling is the “chassis language” which gives a clue as to the actual intent. Sometimes they might even agree!

Chris

[whimsical ninja]

Agree it's mostly one of those things, the only concern I have is did you check where the white lorry was when you moved out - you'd gone a decent distance past him but when you braked sharply and came out was there still a safe distance behind?

[Pica-Pica]

MakaveliX said:

Merging on the M6 north earlier when this happened.
Did my usual checks to ensure I had a safe gap to merge into, when Blue Car in lane 2 decides to move into lane 1 just as I was about to merge.

Who is at fault here ? Looking at the video he may have indicated for a split second, but that could just be the reflections.

If it were me in Lane 2, I would have waited until after the slip road to move into Lane 1, rather than blocking my entry

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rfUaNq5tbis&ab...

Edited by MakaveliX on Saturday 1st July 17:24

That was an extremely crass move by the Evoque, to pull into lane 1 at that point. If I were approaching on the slip road, as the camera car, then on seeing the white truck, and nothing in front of it, I would have put a lot more speed on, and claimed the gap in front. At one point it seemed as if the camera car was trying to match the truck’s speed!
Your ‘usual checks’ could never have seen anything alongside the truck, hence a faster entry speed needed, or drop back completely.

[MakaveliX]

whimsical ninja said:

Agree it's mostly one of those things, the only concern I have is did you check where the white lorry was when you moved out - you'd gone a decent distance past him but when you braked sharply and came out was there still a safe distance behind?

Thanks for all the info guys really appreciate it. Only been driving 18 months or so but slowly learning.

To answer your very valid question, yes of course. Here you can see from the rear dashcam how much space I had to pull out. I always do a few final checks before merging, and in this instance it paid off.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=t_SpQ9FITm0&ab...


Generally when going up/down a sliproad as soon as the traffic is visible I physically turn my head right and look through the front offside window to see exactly who is where, much more than I use my side mirrors as they can sometimes be misleading in regard to how much space there is between me and people in lane 1

[modellista]

Pica-Pica said:

That was an extremely crass move by the Evoque, to pull into lane 1 at that point. If I were approaching on the slip road, as the camera car, then on seeing the white truck, and nothing in front of it, I would have put a lot more speed on, and claimed the gap in front. At one point it seemed as if the camera car was trying to match the truck’s speed!
Your ‘usual checks’ could never have seen anything alongside the truck, hence a faster entry speed needed, or drop back completely.

No doubt the Evoque should have stayed in lane 2. However if you watch the video again you'll notice the camera car was gaining on the truck at all times (not matching speed) and appears to accelerate even more at around 20s, bringing it potentially into conflict with the Evoque, which is travelling more slowly than the camera car, despite still overtaking the truck as they are entitled to do.

This is the fundamental error here. When joining a motorway, you are by definition going to be in lane 1, so your speed should be less than anything in lane 2, otherwise you will be undertaking and/or coming into conflict with vehicles completing an overtake and returning to lane 1 (as in this case).

Far better to decide on your position in relation to traffic in lane 1, in this case in front of the truck is fine, but then keep speed a sensible balance between lane 1 and lane 2. If that had happened here, the Evoque would have been ahead at all times and could have returned to lane 1 without causing a conflict.

TL;DR - don't use excessive speed joining motorways.

[MakaveliX]

modellista said:

No doubt the Evoque should have stayed in lane 2. However if you watch the video again you'll notice the camera car was gaining on the truck at all times (not matching speed) and appears to accelerate even more at around 20s, bringing it potentially into conflict with the Evoque, which is travelling more slowly than the camera car, despite still overtaking the truck as they are entitled to do.

This is the fundamental error here. When joining a motorway, you are by definition going to be in lane 1, so your speed should be less than anything in lane 2, otherwise you will be undertaking and/or coming into conflict with vehicles completing an overtake and returning to lane 1 (as in this case).

Far better to decide on your position in relation to traffic in lane 1, in this case in front of the truck is fine, but then keep speed a sensible balance between lane 1 and lane 2. If that had happened here, the Evoque would have been ahead at all times and could have returned to lane 1 without causing a conflict.

TL;DR - don't use excessive speed joining motorways.

Very good points there and I will certainly take them on board. Had I been a bit slower to begin with, the evoque wouldn't have caused an issue.

I Was going too fast to be merging into lane one. A more appropriate speed would be matching the speed of the traffic in lane one which is usually about 55mph right ?

See what you're saying. Once I was past the truck I could have backed off a bit and would have made it a bit better

Thanks

[modellista]

MakaveliX said:

Very good points there and I will certainly take them on board. Had I been a bit slower to begin with, the evoque wouldn't have caused an issue.

I Was going too fast to be merging into lane one. A more appropriate speed would be matching the speed of the traffic in lane one which is usually about 55mph right ?

See what you're saying. Once I was past the truck I could have backed off a bit and would have made it a bit better

Thanks

Credit for accepting constructive comments

Assuming the Evoque is doing about 70mph, I would merge in front of the truck at around 60mph and wait and see what the Evoque does. Assuming they end up pulling back into lane 1 in front of me, I would then accelerate to crusing speed (77mph indicated or whatever you prefer) and overtake Evoque if/when necessary.

I find 30 seconds' "settling time" on the motorway useful so you can properly observe who's around you doing what, before finding your own space in the traffic and getting up to full cruising speed.

[ScoobyChris]

Don’t get hung up on a particular speed. On approach you identify a gap and match your speed so that the gap arrives at the same time you do. However, things can change before you get there so be prepared to change your plan as soon as that happens.

Chris

[TechBod]

MakaveliX said:

Just a quick one.

Let's say you are in Lane 3 and want to move back into Lane 2.

There is a car in Lane 1, in your blind spot and could potentially also want to move into lane 2.

Is it best to cancel the signal, keep driving until you can see them and then confirm if they are signalling or not and then move across
OR should the car in lane 1's indications be visible when leaning forward and looking in the front nearside mirror ?

Bear in mind. The person in lane 1 should be able to see us indicating, but we may not be able to see them ( due to the blind spot )

I do a fair amount of driving but rarely on motorways or anything more than a 2 lane A road hence my question

Thanks

Edited by MakaveliX on Sunday 18th June 18:00

Turn your bloody head and look!! If its not safe to move DONT!! If it is safe, MOVE OVER!!

What do they teach people these days?? And you get motorway tuition too!!! FFS!!!

[MakaveliX]

TechBod said:

Turn your bloody head and look!! If its not safe to move DONT!! If it is safe, MOVE OVER!!

What do they teach people these days?? And you get motorway tuition too!!! FFS!!!

Dont get angry at me mate I was just asking for peoples advice as I am relatively new to driving on the motorway - and everyone else has been perfectly helpful.

Just for your information when I passed my test in 2010 learners were not allowed on the motorway. Due to personal circumstances I did not drive for 11 years or so, so had a long long break from driving

Edited by MakaveliX on Monday 10th July 08:00

[TechBod]

MakaveliX said:

Just for your information when I passed my test in 2010 learners were not allowed on the motorway. Due to personal circumstances I did not drive for 11 years or so, so had a long long break from driving

Edited by MakaveliX on Monday 10th July 08:00

If you had added this in the first place, your comment would have made more sense...

However, my comments still apply, TURN YOUR HEAD AND LOOK!! ETC.ETC.

[Solocle]

Well, this is how not to do it, immediately go from slip road to lane 2 placing yourself inches from a vehicle that is travelling faster than you:

[PhilAsia]

ScoobyChris said:

Don’t get hung up on a particular speed. On approach you identify a gap and match your speed so that the gap arrives at the same time you do. However, things can change before you get there so be prepared to change your plan as soon as that happens.

Chris

This.

Driving, for the most part, is not an exact science. Because the playing field is continuously fluid the approach is required to be also. Any adjustment may require further adjustment, may require further adjustment, may require further adjustment - and that comes from observational awareness, gathering of information and the continual reassessment of the information you are working with, for positive outcomes..

That said, the OP has the right credentials and great to see an enquiring mind at an early stage.