RE: Chimaera LS6
Discussion
lap_time said:
While we're on the topic, i think I'll add some more fuel to the fire: what about a new Chrysler 5.7 Hemi conversion? Sure it doesn't even have hemispherical combustion chambers, and it's down 50kW (oops 70hp) down on the Chev, but why not? Or, why not even a Viper crate motor? Only the clinically insane need apply.
There is also a 6.1 liter version of the Hemi with 425 or 435 hp, depending on application. I'd go with the Chevy mainly because of the iron block of the Chrysler engine. Also, the Chevy has far more aftermarket support. Still, I'm sure it's a good engine, but that weight...
As for it not having hemispherical combustion chambers, the valves are angled so that it's pretty much that. It's just that the valve angle is not as extreme as the old hemi because that creates too large a combustion chamber which then requires pistons with a huge, heavy dome in order to get a reasonably high compression ratio.
As for the Viper engine for a TVR conversion??? Even though it's all alloy, who would really want a moster 700 (plus) lb engine on the front end of such a light car, especially when, as Boosted said, it's so long that you couldn't place it far back enough? Maybe a Merlin V12...
If you must have a 500 hp engine, you could always use the LS7, which is now available as a crate engine, but how much power do you need in a small sports car? Boosted said:
The viper is a very long engine so won't retrofit into many cars. Not sure about the hemi but I bet it's big and probably quite heavy especially in iron block form.
AFAIK there is no alloy block version of it. The iron block forms (5.7 and 6.1) are the only forms from the factory.
Miguel
Mike,
Are you talking, then, about the old 426 Hemis (7 liters)? There probably are aftermarket aluminum blocks for them. The 5.7 and 6.1 Hemis, OTOH, are the new Hemi engines currently in production. The 340 and 425 hp outputs of these engines are net, not gross. These engines are modern pushrod engines available in the Chrysler 300, Dodge Magnum, and Dodge Charger. The 5.7 is also available in some Dodge trucks and Jeeps. These are fuel injected engines with alloy heads but iron blocks.
Miguel
Are you talking, then, about the old 426 Hemis (7 liters)? There probably are aftermarket aluminum blocks for them. The 5.7 and 6.1 Hemis, OTOH, are the new Hemi engines currently in production. The 340 and 425 hp outputs of these engines are net, not gross. These engines are modern pushrod engines available in the Chrysler 300, Dodge Magnum, and Dodge Charger. The 5.7 is also available in some Dodge trucks and Jeeps. These are fuel injected engines with alloy heads but iron blocks.
Miguel
Okay, okay, so the Chrylser motors won't work, but if you really wanted to go outside the square, how about the 4.3 liter Lexus V8. Sure it only makes a barely adequate 280hp from factory, but look at the potential: 32v, quad cams, all alloy, small engine, strong 9 bolt mains, it's all good. And it's possible to get 600hp with a centrifugal or Whipple style supercharger. But for reliability and useability, add the right exhaust, intake, bolt on a low boost blower, push out 450hp and whack in a six speed Getrag from a Supra and you've got one awesome car. Plus they've still got a nice V8 burble.
Whaddya think?
>> Edited by lap_time on Monday 26th September 02:48
Whaddya think?
>> Edited by lap_time on Monday 26th September 02:48
JonRB said:
At the rate Griff and Chimaera 500's go 'bang' that day may come sooner than we think.
Why do you say that? The Rover V8 has a superb reliability record and I don't hear stories of them going bang left, right & centre. Indeed, the worst I've had happen to my 500 in over 4 years of ownership is a cracked head which was easily weld-repaired by TVR Power.
Jon,
you have been very lucky indeed. It is well known that the engines were built to a price. Despite fastidious maintenance on all four 500's I still ended up with three rebuilds.
But the basic engine is a gem. The problem lies with who puts them together.
The 4.6 in my Range Rover has done 66000 miles and is only just loosening up!
I have spoken to several v8 specialists about this, and all of them have little regard for the engines that came out of TVR power.
lap_time said:
Okay, okay, so the Chrylser motors won't work, but if you really wanted to go outside the square, how about the 4.3 liter Lexus V8. Sure it only makes a barely adequate 280hp from factory, but look at the potential: 32v, quad cams, all alloy, small engine, strong 9 bolt mains, it's all good. And it's possible to get 600hp with a centrifugal or Whipple style supercharger. But for reliability and useability, add the right exhaust, intake, bolt on a low boost blower, push out 450hp and whack in a six speed Getrag from a Supra and you've got one awesome car. Plus they've still got a nice V8 burble.
Whaddya think?
>> Edited by lap_time on Monday 26th September 02:48
I agree, in australia in drag racing in particular the lexus 4.3 has been used very successfully by some home tuners, and apparently has awesome potential for increasing its power. A company called bullet here builds MX-5's with the lexus conversion, with their top spec model running 320kw (around 435hp!) They do this relatively easy and I'm pretty sure they give a warranty on the car (which costs $120000 australian) so I'm sure its a proven, reliable unit.
Ali.
FestivAli said:
Okay, okay, so the Chrylser motors won't work, but if you really wanted to go outside the square, how about the 4.3 liter Lexus V8. Sure it only makes a barely adequate 280hp from factory, but look at the potential: 32v, quad cams, all alloy, small engine, strong 9 bolt mains, it's all good. And it's possible to get 600hp with a centrifugal or Whipple style supercharger. But for reliability and useability, add the right exhaust, intake, bolt on a low boost blower, push out 450hp and whack in a six speed Getrag from a Supra and you've got one awesome car. Plus they've still got a nice V8 burble.
Whaddya think?
>> Edited by lap_time on Monday 26th September 02:48
I agree, in australia in drag racing in particular the lexus 4.3 has been used very successfully by some home tuners, and apparently has awesome potential for increasing its power. A company called bullet here builds MX-5's with the lexus conversion, with their top spec model running 320kw (around 435hp!) They do this relatively easy and I'm pretty sure they give a warranty on the car (which costs $120000 australian) so I'm sure its a proven, reliable unit.
Ali.
Ah, yes that would be the Bullet SS. Uses a Sprintex blower, I beleive. Now why wouldn't you want one of those?
In a TVR a nice LS engine would be nice, and a tuned Lexus(Toyota) would also be possible just like the good swap Lotus did with there Elise from rover to Toyota, that worked out perfect...
But if you want real "standard" power(500+) and a nice name too than I would like the new Chevy LS7!!
say in a nice Ultima GTR
but ofcorse also in a nice TVR...I vote a yes...come on TVR lets do it
René
But if you want real "standard" power(500+) and a nice name too than I would like the new Chevy LS7!!
say in a nice Ultima GTR
but ofcorse also in a nice TVR...I vote a yes...come on TVR lets do it René
lap_time said:
Okay, okay, so the Chrylser motors won't work, but if you really wanted to go outside the square, how about the 4.3 liter Lexus V8.
There is a fantastic F40 replica in NZ that uses a twin-turbo'd Lexus V8 that is pushing out somewhere in the region of 700 bhp, so there certainly is potential in that suggestion.
Miguel said:
Mike,
Are you talking, then, about the old 426 Hemis (7 liters)? There probably are aftermarket aluminum blocks for them.
Indeed, Keith Black started out by making all-alloy copies of the 426 Hemi engines, before going on to his own designs, so you could get one if you wanted.
>> Edited by Jay GTi on Monday 26th September 09:54
>> Edited by Jay GTi on Monday 26th September 09:55
Miguel said:
Mike,
Are you talking, then, about the old 426 Hemis (7 liters)? There probably are aftermarket aluminum blocks for them. The 5.7 and 6.1 Hemis, OTOH, are the new Hemi engines currently in production. The 340 and 425 hp outputs of these engines are net, not gross. These engines are modern pushrod engines available in the Chrysler 300, Dodge Magnum, and Dodge Charger. The 5.7 is also available in some Dodge trucks and Jeeps. These are fuel injected engines with alloy heads but iron blocks.
Miguel
Thanks Miguel,
Yes, you're probably right. I've only seen the top fuel stuff so they will be the older engines. The newer stuff isn't so common over here so I haven't seem it.
Boosted.
vjj said:What justification do you have for this statement - which I for one find hard to believe. In all my years of 500 Chim ownership I have no recollection of any reputation of fragility being attributed to the 500 engine. How many engines are you aware of "going bang"? Details, and justification, please.
At the rate Griff and Chimaera 500's go 'bang' that day may come sooner than we think.
thirsty said:Thirsty - they go forward same as in std car - but MUCH better than std rubbish system (all those Huge bore changes and goiing from 2 to 1 to 2 just murder the gas flow. And engine is only SLightly bigger (a tad a cross the heads).
That engines takes up a lot of space, but It still looks cleaner that with the Rover V8. Part of that I suppose is the fact that the exhaust does not run forward into the catalytic converters, which I always found strange.
I would assume that things are much cooler under the bonnet??
tvrolet said:it is the 0.82 (std is 0.80) - (not long geared one) and working with a std 3.45 rear Crown wheel & pinion - so vertually as per standard - but with loads more power and revs availible!
Sooooo, it say you have a TKO600 in there. Presumably you've used the one with the lower 5th gear, and not the really tall 5th? Any idea what the diff ratio is you're using? Mine's a 3.73 and having done the maths, I was thinking it was maybe going to be a bit low geared. Interested to know what your final drive is and how you feel the gearing is.
WB
cyberface said:
As the article said, the Chevy V8 may be great but it's too much for a Chim!!! with interest!!
No dis respect to Ted but he did not drive the car above 2/3 full revs and it is on std (softish late Griff / Chim suspension rates).
THE ONLY DIFFERENCE between a chim and a tuscan is the suspension quality / spring / damper rates. (Tuscan chassis is virtually identical only in round tube vs square).
This car will EASILY handle 400+ bhp. IT IS ALOTEasy to drive with 1.5 time RV8 TVR500 power as the power delivery is SO much more progressive than realatively peaky (to get even reasonable power from an old design) rover. Most TVR 500 make 245 - 275 real bhp! and high 280 - 300 ft/lbs.
victormeldrew said:
At the rate Griff and Chimaera 500's go 'bang' that day may come sooner than we think.
What justification do you have for this statement - which I for one find hard to believe. In all my years of 500 Chim ownership I have no recollection of any reputation of fragility being attributed to the 500 engine. How many engines are you aware of "going bang"? Details, and justification, please.
Mr Meldrew
3 rebuilds of my own.....all less than 40000 miles.
I ran them as company cars for years before the baby came along in 2002, averaging 35000 miles per year.
Of the twenty or so 500's within my circle of friends,including my own vehicles, only six have not had either a major rebuild of the existing lump or a replacement from V8 Developments or John Eales.
The evidence is there. Ask mark Adams.
Hughesie2 said:
Most TVR 500 make 245 - 275 real bhp! and high 280 - 300 ft/lbs.
But OMG, the sounds better
Indeed it does . . . however maybe Ted can give us a soundbyte to prove the opposite. Cerbs V8 sound a big lot better. Pops and bangs alone scare the hell out of ya. Those yank V8s sound . . . . cosy - no offence - and when hammered predictable. The Griffs have that promise-to-give-performance howl and spit and the Cerb's have a different sounds signature each of their own. Or is it my ears?
jellison said:
My engine (and not been fully Wortec'd) till wed is making > 300ft/l from virtually tickover (1800 to the redline). And LS1 red line is 6250, LS6 6600. An Rv8 500 as a long stroke older design is not safe for extended periods over 6 and power is all done by 57 in anycase.
And to think,Jons is the wee tiddler of all the tvr/chev transplants..
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