1:72 Tornado GR4, Dambusters70th Anniversary

[dr_gn]

HoHoHo said:

dr_gn said:

They probably look wrong because theyre not fitted yet. The jet pipes and exhausts are separate assemblies that fit into the two holes at the rear. All there is at the moment are the thrust reverser buckets and two open holes.

That makes sense and my intention was by no means to be rude.

Still looks bloody brilliant to me!

Thats OK I took it as genuine observation, although I'm surprised you didn't also note the lack of tailerons (tailplanes) too!

Here's an image of an assembled exhaust (although its 180 degrees off as shown), and the components in pieces. the silver block represents the thrust reverse bucket gears, and the photo etch is supposed to be an afterburner ring:





They all need overspraying with Alclad "jet exhaust" to darken them a bit.

[HoHoHo]

Well it was quite late at night!

Looking really good and I'm looking forward to seeing the final result

[perdu]

The new extension to that exhaust duct looks as if it will do the job nicely when you fair it in doc

Do you remember I said I have the Airfix MRCA kit in a box here?

Looks like I have to mould a canopy for that if I ever build it, I must have used the old one for that GR1 I made a century ago...

Time fuggit dunnit

Back on track, this really is becoming good

Shame the decalcomanies are letting you down

[dr_gn]

perdu said:

The new extension to that exhaust duct looks as if it will do the job nicely when you fair it in doc

Do you remember I said I have the Airfix MRCA kit in a box here?

Looks like I have to mould a canopy for that if I ever build it, I must have used the old one for that GR1 I made a century ago...

Time fuggit dunnit

Back on track, this really is becoming good

Shame the decalcomanies are letting you down

As you know, I've got two of the Airfix GR4's - if you want one of those canopies? I was looking at the Airfix F3 hanging in my son's room yesterday, and it has a completely different canopy from the GR4 version. I'd guess the GR4 transparency (which only represents the top glazed part) would be the same as the MRCA?

[perdu]

dr_gn said:

perdu said:

The new extension to that exhaust duct looks as if it will do the job nicely when you fair it in doc

Do you remember I said I have the Airfix MRCA kit in a box here?

Looks like I have to mould a canopy for that if I ever build it, I must have used the old one for that GR1 I made a century ago...

Time fuggit dunnit

Back on track, this really is becoming good

Shame the decalcomanies are letting you down

As you know, I've got two of the Airfix GR4's - if you want one of those canopies? I was looking at the Airfix F3 hanging in my son's room yesterday, and it has a completely different canopy from the GR4 version. I'd guess the GR4 transparency (which only represents the top glazed part) would be the same as the MRCA?

Well I was/am only going to give this a go if the moon is in the seventh bungalow and I'm in the mood so it isn't really important

If you don't mind though maybe you could bring one of them (yes I would appreciate one of them thanks) to one of the shows we are doing at the same time

Cosford or even Telford, I can't make Huddersfield because those silly chaps have picked our club day for their show (grr!)

And it is our Hospice Competition day

So all in all I have to miss it this year and having never been to a Huddy show it is one I would like to get under my belt some yea

[15peter20]

Doc, fyi - the green bit on the probe is actually tape wound around a frangible collar and is there to try and prevent any of the metal debris / rivets dropping off into the righthand donk in the event that the probe is snapped off. Looks great by the way!

[dr_gn]

15peter20 said:

Doc, fyi - the green bit on the probe is actually tape wound around a frangible collar and is there to try and prevent any of the metal debris / rivets dropping off into the righthand donk in the event that the probe is snapped off. Looks great by the way!

Thanks for that info - is it a transparent green tape?

Do you know what the small rectangular bulged panels below the probe are? They are each side of the fuselage in that area. I've painted them buff/light grey colour.

Ta.

[15peter20]

No, It's solid like electricians tape.

Those panels are aerodynamic additions to try and improve accuracy of the three static ports on each side (just ahead of the panels) through the transonic range

[dr_gn]

15peter20 said:

No, It's solid like electricians tape.

Those panels are aerodynamic additions to try and improve accuracy of the three static ports on each side (just ahead of the panels) through the transonic range

Ah well, I think my clear green is just about opaque enough to pass at this scale.

Interesting about the bumps. Presumably then, the short tubes on the extensions (if that's what they are) either side of the cockpit, and on the nose probe are not pitot-static tubes, just pitot tubes? Is it just for instruments, or are they part of the flight control system too?

[15peter20]

Those short tubes provide AoA data - they physically rotate. The placement of the probe means that the righthand under reads by a unit

[dr_gn]

15peter20 said:

Those short tubes provide AoA data - they physically rotate. The placement of the probe means that the righthand under reads by a unit

Yes the AoA probes Ive got, but there are also what look like pitot tubes further back mounted away from the fuselage on short protrusions aligned with the airflow.

[Ian Lancs]

dr_gn said:

15peter20 said:

Those short tubes provide AoA data - they physically rotate. The placement of the probe means that the righthand under reads by a unit

Yes the AoA probes Ive got, but there are also what look like pitot tubes further back mounted away from the fuselage on short protrusions aligned with the airflow.

They're also part of the air data system - you have pitot probe on the nose, static side ports and the pitot side ports. It's been a while since I last looked at the system diagrams so there might be more I've forgotten!

[dr_gn]

So after much pratting about (including dropping it and snapping the windscreen off!) I've now extended the fin ducts and blended them in:



The decals now fit much better than they did, so little or no trimming should be needed.

The plan is to now weather the metallic panels with a dark wash and some light gunmetal, Klear them and then get the decals on this weekend.

[dr_gn]

So to give myself some motivation to get it done, I began applying the decals. I started with the wing walk lines, which I thought would be a silvering nightmare. I used my usual method of dissolving all the adhesive of the decals, then capilliaring Klear under them once tacked in place with water, then applying a mixture of Klear and Microsol on and around them. The dashed lines are just the right contrast - ie barely visible. The carrier film will disappear completely when overcoated with a film of Klear and matt coat:



The port tail decals weren't too bad, but I noticed too late that the text at the top was slightly angled down. I've since removed it, and will correct the paint tomorrow before applying a spare decal. I've noticed a few builds of these aircraft where the text is not aligned properly. Now I see why - it's a critical and deceptive alignment to get right:

[johnS2000]

This build is something else but I have to ask,being not quite up to date with brass etch/rod /Hannents /masks/ Tamiya tape seatbelts Etc Etc .

I see references to"Klear !! I assume this is old Johnsons Future as opposed to "new formula klear" ?

Is it as good ?

I've got Humbrol Clear but am in 2 minds about it and also have something called Lakeland Floor Polish which does the same thing .

I would be interested in your technique for decal application as I currently am in the process of building the 3rd of 10 1/72 Red Arrow Hawks and ,although pleased enough so far with the first 2 , your Tornado is inspiring especially the roundal in your pic that does look painted on .
Regards John.

[dr_gn]

johnS2000 said:

This build is something else but I have to ask,being not quite up to date with brass etch/rod /Hannents /masks/ Tamiya tape seatbelts Etc Etc .

I see references to"Klear !! I assume this is old Johnsons Future as opposed to "new formula klear" ?

Is it as good ?

I've got Humbrol Clear but am in 2 minds about it and also have something called Lakeland Floor Polish which does the same thing .

I would be interested in your technique for decal application as I currently am in the process of building the 3rd of 10 1/72 Red Arrow Hawks and ,although pleased enough so far with the first 2 , your Tornado is inspiring especially the roundal in your pic that does look painted on .
Regards John.

Ta very much. The Klear I'm using is the old formula - I've got a few bottles in stock. I've heard conflicting stories about the new formula, and have never used Revell Clear, so I can't comment from experience. I'd assume that Revell Clear is intended to be a direct replacement for Johnsons Klear.

With decals with a large carrier film e.g. small stencils or linear graphics like the walkway lines, the problem is if you get dry patches under the film. The only guaranteed way of ensuring no air gets trapped in these pockets is to flood them with a thin clear varnish (ie Klear). It also acts as a glue. What I do is place the decal with plently of water, and keep the area moist so I can position it accurately. Then once in place, gently lift an edge with a scalpel blade and wick klear under the deal with fine brush. You can see capillary action flooding underneath. When this is done, paint over with a layer of Klear (including along edges) and then Microsol, and leave well alone until completely dry. The roundel in the picture was dipped in Klear, the excess wicked off with a brush then placed directly in place. Add Microsol (may need a couple of coats over the course of 5 miuntes or so), then leave to fully dry. That's it.

There's a load of guff written about applying decals to avoid silvering, with all kinds of potions like microset, but fundamentally, if you get air underneath transparent carrier film, it will look terrible. Get rid of the air and it will look fine. some people say never let a decal float of it's backing before applying becasue it gets rid of the glue. With my method I find it easier if they do float off; the decal is easier to position with no adhesive on it (doesn't drag), and if you use the Klear method it acts as a glue and ensures you will never get silvering. You don't even need to have a particularly glossy surface to apply the decals to either with this method, although it does make it easier to fine position the decals.

Im not suggesting it's an easy way of doing it, but it works for me!

Edited by dr_gn on Saturday 7th February 10:33

[johnS2000]

Thanks Dr ,I'll try that on the next Hawk (started this am ).

Another question if I may ?

Brass tube . I cannot picture how big (or small ) 2mm 3mm Brass tube is as I can only find it mail order . What size would you suggest for 1/72 work . I ask as I've Just finished a Tiger tank and was looking with envious eyes at the brass tube on your Tornado t ailerons when it became apparent that the drive wheels would stay straight (track tension )with some brass tube as an axle !

If I'm a nuisance please say so but I have picked up so much from your builds including putting your new airbrush into my ever growing wish list .

[dr_gn]

johnS2000 said:

Thanks Dr ,I'll try that on the next Hawk (started this am ).

Another question if I may ?

Brass tube . I cannot picture how big (or small ) 2mm 3mm Brass tube is as I can only find it mail order . What size would you suggest for 1/72 work . I ask as I've Just finished a Tiger tank and was looking with envious eyes at the brass tube on your Tornado t ailerons when it became apparent that the drive wheels would stay straight (track tension )with some brass tube as an axle !

If I'm a nuisance please say so but I have picked up so much from your builds including putting your new airbrush into my ever growing wish list .

I'm going to state the obvious here...2mm brass tube is 2mm in diameter, 3mm is 3mm in diameter etc. The size depends what you're modelling.

If you buy a micro drill set (Maplins etc) then you can easily get a visual indication of diameters from them.

A lot of the pitot tubes/guns/antennae are fractions (e.g. 0.3mm, 0.5 mm) in diameter at 1:72. If it's to stiffen or replace a structural part, use the largest diameter you can while leaving a decent wall thickness in whatever you're drilling out to take the tube. You can get a bit of extra strength if you use solid rod.

Albion alloys do a range of tubes that telescope into adjacent sizes if required. Many model suppliers stock this stuff:

http://www.albionalloys.co.uk/wp-content/uploads/W...

Little cars do a wide range of metal wire, rod and tube:

http://www.little-cars.co.uk/list2.html

My advice would be to estimate what you want, get some and have a play about with it to get an idea of sizes. If you're building a few models it always comes in handy. Oh yes, and be careful when cutting - offcuts in the eye do hurt I can tell you.

[johnS2000]

I know it sounds stupid but I get confused over inside diameter and outside diameter

Ordered some 2mm and 3mm so will go from there .

[dr_gn]

Someone pointed out the pod at the rear of the fin was too long for a GR4, so I cut a section out:



and glued the cover back in a more realistic position: