P-51B Mustang "Old Crow" Academy 1:72

P-51B Mustang "Old Crow" Academy 1:72

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Discussion

Ayahuasca

27,427 posts

278 months

Thursday 22nd May 2014
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Why did they use this model of P-51 (with the non-flush fuselage and non-bubble canopy) this late in the war? I note the first Old Crow had the flush fuselage and bubble canopy.




Red Firecracker

5,276 posts

226 months

Friday 23rd May 2014
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dr_gn said:
Cockpit's done. It's all a bit bright, particularly the harness, but they were pre-painted. I might try toning them down a bit, but otherwise it will do:
They look very new, don't they. Would be nice if they produced them with a bit of wear, but then I guess they feel they'd be just at fault on some models. At least this way they allow the modeller to weather or age them to their requirements and taste.

dr_gn

Original Poster:

16,130 posts

183 months

Friday 23rd May 2014
quotequote all
Ayahuasca said:
Why did they use this model of P-51 (with the non-flush fuselage and non-bubble canopy) this late in the war? I note the first Old Crow had the flush fuselage and bubble canopy.
Bud Anderson had three 'Old Crow' P-51's: Two B models (the first got shot down while being flown by another pilot and was fitted with the birdcage canopy), the second was this one and IIRC he shot down the most aircraft with this. The third was the D model with the bubble canopy.

Before the P-51's there was also a P-39 'Old Crow', and later an F-105D known as "Old Crow II" which he flew in Vietnam.



dr_gn

Original Poster:

16,130 posts

183 months

Friday 23rd May 2014
quotequote all
Red Firecracker said:
dr_gn said:
Cockpit's done. It's all a bit bright, particularly the harness, but they were pre-painted. I might try toning them down a bit, but otherwise it will do:
They look very new, don't they. Would be nice if they produced them with a bit of wear, but then I guess they feel they'd be just at fault on some models. At least this way they allow the modeller to weather or age them to their requirements and taste.
They're not a disaster in reality, but I'll try painting some dark wash over them, or some weathering powder.

RichB

51,383 posts

283 months

Friday 23rd May 2014
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dr_gn said:
...I might be defeated by the tailwheel tyre, unelss I can find some spare circular white decals to put on there.
Would it not be easier to paint the whole wheel white, then pick out the silver strut and paint on the black surface with a fairly hard brush?

dr_gn

Original Poster:

16,130 posts

183 months

Friday 23rd May 2014
quotequote all
RichB said:
dr_gn said:
...I might be defeated by the tailwheel tyre, unelss I can find some spare circular white decals to put on there.
Would it not be easier to paint the whole wheel white, then pick out the silver strut and paint on the black surface with a fairly hard brush?
Whatever sequence you do, the problem is getting a concentric white ring around something that's interrupted by the arm. you always get a slight discontinuity in outline where the arm and wheel meet, whether it's with the silver hub, the white ring or the black tyre. With the main wheels it should be easy to spin them up in the lathe and touch a white loaded brush on the surface. Obviously impossible with the tailwheel. The other issue is that the sidewall of the tyre has some strange dimples around it, which make accurate painting tricky.

72twink

963 posts

241 months

Friday 23rd May 2014
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Can you use another wheel and sacrifice the moulded in one to leave the yoke, then add the wheel after painting it as per the main wheels? Same problem with Trop Bf 109 and their whitewalls.

dr_gn

Original Poster:

16,130 posts

183 months

Friday 23rd May 2014
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72twink said:
Can you use another wheel and sacrifice the moulded in one to leave the yoke, then add the wheel after painting it as per the main wheels? Same problem with Trop Bf 109 and their whitewalls.
Yeah, that's a good option. I'll see if I've got a spare wheel. Ta.

RichB

51,383 posts

283 months

Friday 23rd May 2014
quotequote all
dr_gn said:
RichB said:
dr_gn said:
...I might be defeated by the tailwheel tyre, unelss I can find some spare circular white decals to put on there.
Would it not be easier to paint the whole wheel white, then pick out the silver strut and paint on the black surface with a fairly hard brush?
Whatever sequence you do, the problem is getting a concentric white ring around something that's interrupted by the arm. you always get a slight discontinuity in outline where the arm and wheel meet, whether it's with the silver hub, the white ring or the black tyre. With the main wheels it should be easy to spin them up in the lathe and touch a white loaded brush on the surface. Obviously impossible with the tailwheel. The other issue is that the sidewall of the tyre has some strange dimples around it, which make accurate painting tricky.
I understand what you mean. I always used to do my car wheels like you're doing the main wheel i.e. paint them in dark grey and then run them lightly through some dirt colour to simulate the lighter colour found on the tread of a tyre but as you say, if you can't rotate it that's more difficult. I guess I was thinking that if the tyre was painted white then you could get some black on using something like a small round rubber from the top of a propelling pencil and rotate that around the tread with some black on it. So rotate the medium dispensing the colour on the tyre as opposed to rotating the tyre against the colour. scratchchin

Edited by RichB on Friday 23 May 16:40

perdu

4,884 posts

198 months

Friday 23rd May 2014
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I wouldnt worry too much about the webbing doc, it does at least have the look of unblanco'd white webbing

That kind of unbleached calico thing is rather nice and a bugger to match in real paint

I am beginning to like these Eduard interiors

I saw elsewhere that you were wondering which green and grey (gray) to use, have you decided whether to go RAF or not?

(I haven't been back lately to look) wink

If you undercut the tailwheel strut at the tyre side maybe you can get the paint in behind and out of casual sight with a fine brush.

dr_gn

Original Poster:

16,130 posts

183 months

Friday 23rd May 2014
quotequote all
perdu said:
I wouldnt worry too much about the webbing doc, it does at least have the look of unblanco'd white webbing

That kind of unbleached calico thing is rather nice and a bugger to match in real paint

I am beginning to like these Eduard interiors

I saw elsewhere that you were wondering which green and grey (gray) to use, have you decided whether to go RAF or not?

(I haven't been back lately to look) wink

If you undercut the tailwheel strut at the tyre side maybe you can get the paint in behind and out of casual sight with a fine brush.
For detailing cockpits etc, Aires resin is the way to go. I'll not be using Eduard again. Fine for other bits and pieces, but etch is a bit 2D for a cockpit I think. The pre-paint thing is more bother than it's worth.

I decided on a decent green, it's in fact the same green I used for the SE.5a. The Neutral Grey undersides are more of an issue: The 'correct' paint is blatantly too dark. I'll just try a few lighter shades until I'm happy, then make sure I label the pot "WW2 USAAF Undersides", so if I build any other aircraft like this they will be consistent.

Ayahuasca

27,427 posts

278 months

Friday 23rd May 2014
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[/quote]

The joystick handle has a bit of girth on it (ooh er!) - is it to scale?

dr_gn

Original Poster:

16,130 posts

183 months

Friday 23rd May 2014
quotequote all
Fitted the cockpit and closed the fuselage, also fitted the wings, tailplanes and supercharger intake. Looks a bit more like a Mustang now:





I also cut the seat out and repositioned it slightly lower. It looked way too high, but after looking at a few references the pilot's shoulders were well above the cockpit sides. I does look better now though. I also thought the cockpit looked too wide, but again, looking at references it's about right:



Perdu - you didn't really think I was going to leave those belts that bright did you hehe Some 'mud' weathering powder applied with a fine brush soon toned them down a bit:


dr_gn

Original Poster:

16,130 posts

183 months

Friday 23rd May 2014
quotequote all
RichB said:
dr_gn said:
RichB said:
dr_gn said:
...I might be defeated by the tailwheel tyre, unelss I can find some spare circular white decals to put on there.
Would it not be easier to paint the whole wheel white, then pick out the silver strut and paint on the black surface with a fairly hard brush?
Whatever sequence you do, the problem is getting a concentric white ring around something that's interrupted by the arm. you always get a slight discontinuity in outline where the arm and wheel meet, whether it's with the silver hub, the white ring or the black tyre. With the main wheels it should be easy to spin them up in the lathe and touch a white loaded brush on the surface. Obviously impossible with the tailwheel. The other issue is that the sidewall of the tyre has some strange dimples around it, which make accurate painting tricky.
I understand what you mean. I always used to do my car wheels like you're doing the main wheel i.e. paint them in dark grey and then run them lightly through some dirt colour to simulate the lighter colour found on the tread of a tyre but as you say, if you can't rotate it that's more difficult. I guess I was thinking that if the tyre was painted white then you could get some black on using something like a small round rubber from the top of a propelling pencil and rotate that around the tread with some black on it. So rotate the medium dispensing the colour on the tyre as opposed to rotating the tyre against the colour. scratchchin

Edited by RichB on Friday 23 May 16:40
Yep, but the radius of the rubber, or whatever would have to be infinitely small to fit in the right angle made between the tyre and the arm. I could hand paint the very last bit, but that defeats the object to a degree. Usually, I cover any paint demarcation mess in the corners of things like that with a dark pin wash and that tends to make my errors disappear in a subtle shadow.

RichB

51,383 posts

283 months

Friday 23rd May 2014
quotequote all
dr_gn said:
OOI what do you chaps use to photograph these details with? Assuming this is 1:72 that's very close-up photography smile

RichB

51,383 posts

283 months

Friday 23rd May 2014
quotequote all
dr_gn said:
Yep, but the radius of the rubber, or whatever would have to be infinitely small...
True, was just thinking "out of the box" frown

dr_gn

Original Poster:

16,130 posts

183 months

Friday 23rd May 2014
quotequote all
Ayahuasca said:


The joystick handle has a bit of girth on it (ooh er!) - is it to scale?
It's got a fair bit of lentgh to it too missus.

If you look from the side, the top is visible above the cockpit edge. If I was going to Duxford tomorrow for the airshow I could check, but the weather is rubbish so I won't be risking the 2 1/2 hour drivefrown




Edited by dr_gn on Friday 23 May 23:00

dr_gn

Original Poster:

16,130 posts

183 months

Friday 23rd May 2014
quotequote all
RichB said:
dr_gn said:
OOI what do you chaps use to photograph these details with? Assuming this is 1:72 that's very close-up photography smile
Nothing special; my trusty Panasonic FZ50 (worth about 50 on EBay on a good day). It's getting on a bit now, but it's still OK.


Edited by dr_gn on Friday 23 May 23:01

dr_gn

Original Poster:

16,130 posts

183 months

Friday 23rd May 2014
quotequote all
RichB said:
dr_gn said:
Yep, but the radius of the rubber, or whatever would have to be infinitely small...
True, was just thinking "out of the box" frown
I appreciate the ideas though. If I think I really can't do it well, I'll not do it at all. Lets just say it got a new tyre?

Mutley

3,178 posts

258 months

Saturday 24th May 2014
quotequote all
dr_gn said:
It's got a fair bit of lentgh to it too missus.

If you look from the side, the top is visible above the cockpit edge. If I was going to Duxford tomorrow for the airshow I could check, but the weather is rubbish so I won't be risking the 2 1/2 hour drivefrown




Edited by dr_gn on Friday 23 May 23:00
Doc, am going to Duxford tomorrow, can't promise, but if you want any reference shots be happy to try for you