Taking up Golf

[Fats25]

Aizle said:

Bing o said:

And be grateful you don't have a USGA handicap and have to fk about with slope and course ratings like I do.

I'll bite, I'm intrigued!

I will let Bing o explain that - I do know how it works, but gets too confusing for me to explain! Suffice to say, it is to allow you to be able to take your handicap to any course, and adjust it accordingly, before you play, based upon the difficulty of the course. As far as I know same rules apply once handicap is adjusted.

The American Stableford I was referring to - is described in this article, under "Modified Stableford on Tour". I called it American Stableford, as whenever I am playing in US with colleagues, and suggest Stableford, they always play this convuluted game.

It also gives a better description of Stableford in the article linked, and explains why the Americans persist in playing the wrong rules! Appears it is not as popular in US, as it is in Europe.

I will be honest I only play strokeplay once a month in the Club Medal - the rest of the time is always Stableford, or matchplay, or usually both as SmartyPants refers to above.

[Yoof Full Chav]

Feck, this golf sounds more and more bloody complicated the more i hear about it. So, if you play in a club comp to lower your handicap, is that stroke index play, or stableford, or even medal golf?? My head hurts from trying to understand it all

[Bing o]

[redacted]

[Jimbo NW]

I'm at my wits end here!!

I used to play from 13-16 and managed to get my handicap down to a modest 12. When the evils of girls and booze came about I stopped playing sold my clubs and forgot about golf apart from watching the major tournaments.

This summer I decided to take it up again and managed to bag a set of preowned taylormade burner 2.0 irons for £150 (still had my woods, wedge and putter). For the life of me I can not get better, i've played maybe once a week over summer usually at a different course every week with 2 fore 1 vouchers.

I can drive reasonably well (say 12 out of 15 fairways and usually 300 + yards) my iron shots are ok, getting on or around the green from 190 ish in. Get me to 120 and below in to the green i'm fked! I have one bad chip and then they all go to pot, thin, fat, fluffed.. You name it i'll do it.

I worked out yesterday i'm losing around 18-22 shots per round from 100 yards and in, take that away i'm back down to 15-18 handicap. I'm going back to university tomorrow and taking my clubs but the problem is there's no where to practise these shots, the only course local to my flat (Liverpool) that I can afford to join is Allerton municipal which has a tiny chipping area that you can use if you're playing...

ARGHHHHH I hate golf, I know the majority of it is in my head, I get "The fear" but it's so annoying... Any ideas??

[Fats25]

[redacted]

[Fats25]

Bing o said:

Kind of. In the UK, you put in 3 cards off the competition tees, marked by a member. They knock off certain high scores and average it off to give you a starting handicap. Then any cards you put in competition take it up or down by a factor related to your handicap base on how you play.

What you are thinking of is SSS (standard scratch) and the CSS (competition standard scratch). the former expresses the true par of the course for amateurs, and the latter a 'day' par based on prevailing conditions (ie a windy or soggy day).

USGA handicaps. That's a whole different beast. Every round I play I am supposed to put a card in (friendly or competition). Depending on the number of rounds put in, they take your best scores, take out the bad holes you had, average them off, multiply by .96, and then witchcraft happens with the slope rating to give you your handicap.

Then, when I play at my home course off the back tees, they take the slope and course rating to give me my competition handicap for the day. Or something. There is a wikipedia article that explains it better, but I just let my club sort it out!

Same Same - but different (to my post above that you beat me to!). They also do this USGA way (or were doing this) in Ireland a few years ago at amatuer level.

[E55 Max]

Jimbo NW said:

I can drive reasonably well (say 12 out of 15 fairways and usually 300 + yards) my iron shots are ok, getting on or around the green from 190 ish in. Get me to 120 and below in to the green i'm fked! I have one bad chip and then they all go to pot, thin, fat, fluffed.. You name it i'll do it.

You sound like me! Try a better wedge, full on Blade, they are much more consistant I find. I did this this year and am amazed at the difference!

[Yoof Full Chav]

E55 Max said:

Jimbo NW said:

I can drive reasonably well (say 12 out of 15 fairways and usually 300 + yards) my iron shots are ok, getting on or around the green from 190 ish in. Get me to 120 and below in to the green i'm fked! I have one bad chip and then they all go to pot, thin, fat, fluffed.. You name it i'll do it.

You sound like me! Try a better wedge, full on Blade, they are much more consistant I find. I did this this year and am amazed at the difference!

Or maybe, take some practice balls/lake balls and your wedge to the nearest open green space, and just practice. Set a target up at say 120, then at 100, then say 80 and so on, and just practice your lob, pitch and chip until you have them to the point where you can do them without 'freezing' up so to speak. That's how i got around my slice problem. Found a suggestion on line, relaised i had been shown it before during a lesson, went and practiced it, and hey presto, it's more or less non existent now

[Bing o]

Jimbo NW said:

I can drive reasonably well (say 12 out of 15 fairways and usually 300 + yards) my iron shots are ok, getting on or around the green from 190 ish in. Get me to 120 and below in to the green i'm fked! I have one bad chip and then they all go to pot, thin, fat, fluffed.. You name it i'll do it.
<snip>
ARGHHHHH I hate golf, I know the majority of it is in my head, I get "The fear" but it's so annoying... Any ideas??

you mention chipping, but then say it's from 120 in (I'm assume PW down).

At that distance you want to be looking at getting within 20 feet pretty regularly. Try setting up slightly open with your hips and feet. Put the ball in the middle of your stance, and make sure your hands are ahead of the ball. Feel like your weight is 90% on your left foot and keep it there throughout the swing (which should feel like 3/4s). Concentrate on the strike, don't try and help the ball or look for it - just hit down and through, feeling like you are holding the club down the target line for as long as possible.

If it's just your chipping, then try a putting stroke and grip down to the metal. Vary the loft of the club to carry the ball just over the fringe and run out to the flag. Depending on your green speed a PW should be 50/50 carry to roll, 70/30 for a 60 degree and vice versa for a 7-8 iron.

[n_const]

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[BarnatosGhost]

condor said:

Been watching the Walkers cup golf on TV and there's a query I have. Why do they not putt out the ball when it's close to the hole ( presumably it's because it's assumed they'd get it in...but nothing is 100% sure in a sport).

Sometimes (only in a fourball match) it is because they can't improve upon their partner's score, nor (in 2-ball matchplay) beat or equal their opponent's score, so there's nothing to be gained by popping it in. Some players like to pick up, because they don't want the morale-knock of missing it, others like to play an unecessary shot for the practice and the morale boost of seeing it drop in.

More usually their opponent will have 'given' them the shot (matchplay only, not allowed in strokeplay). This is usually called a 'gimme', as a cheeky player might ask their opponent as they approach a short putt 'will you gimme that?'.

It is a common courtesy between opponents that very short putts will be given, but depending on the circumstances isn't at all mandatory, and (sin of sins) should NEVER be assumed.

If your opponent gives themselves a short putt (VERY poor form) you can gently make the point that they shouldn't have by pointedly stating 'I'll give you that' once they've actually picked it up, or if you're being more aggressive, make them put it back, and call a penalty. They won't do it again.

You can also use the gimme as a tool in the gamesmanship of a match by changing the 'rules' or withdrawing it altogether in later stages to unsettle the opponent and move the game into a more aggressive of confrontational atmosphere.

Lots of fun to be had on the 15th/16th/17th when your opponent goes to pick up a 12 inch putt you've been giving him all afternoon. Bent over, hand hovering over his ball, he looks up at you, expecting a nod of concession, only to find you idly picking your nose, cleaning your grooves, or anything that basically says-without-saying 'there's no way I'm letting you off this green without seeing you put that ball in the hole'.

This can upset them, which either works in your favour as they lose their concentration and either miss their easy putt or make a hash of the next drive, or puts them into a world of focussed dedication that wins them the match...

By-the-by, you can also surprise them early in the round by giving a very generous gimme, which is a nice, gentle way of implying 'ok, I've seen enough, I'm now confident that I'm going to beat you anyway, so lets just have a pleasant afternoon'. Their grateful acceptance of the big gimme gives you a seniority in the emotional see-saw of the match, and they might just feel honour-bound to be a little more generous with their own gimmes from then-on.

This is quite a good seed to plant if, like me, your own short-range putting is lousy.

Make sure you're the one to set the tone for the day's gimmes - if you reckon you're a better putter than they are then be stingy, if the reverse, be more generous.

Most players won't want to get off on the wrong foot with your 'relationship', even though it's a competition, so will follow your lead. All part of the magic of matchplay, and how golf works on so many levels that other sports miss.

[Fats25]

BarnatosGhost said:

More usually their opponent will have 'given' them the shot (matchplay only, not allowed in strokeplay). This is usually called a 'gimme', as a cheeky player might ask their opponent as they approach a short putt 'will you gimme that?'.

It is a common courtesy between opponents that very short putts will be given, but depending on the circumstances isn't at all mandatory, and (sin of sins) should NEVER be assumed.

Hence - the best quote of all time? (1969 Ryder Cup at Royal Birkdale)

Jack Nicklaus to Tony Jacklin

'I don't think you would have missed that putt, but in these circumstances, I would never give you the opportunity"

[BarnatosGhost]

Fats25 said:

BarnatosGhost said:

More usually their opponent will have 'given' them the shot (matchplay only, not allowed in strokeplay). This is usually called a 'gimme', as a cheeky player might ask their opponent as they approach a short putt 'will you gimme that?'.

It is a common courtesy between opponents that very short putts will be given, but depending on the circumstances isn't at all mandatory, and (sin of sins) should NEVER be assumed.

Hence - the best quote of all time? (1969 Ryder Cup at Royal Birkdale)

Jack Nicklaus to Tony Jacklin

'I don't think you would have missed that putt, but in these circumstances, I would never give you the opportunity"

I'm always in two minds about this sort of thing.

I can see the romance, friendship, magnanimous gesture, fuzzy feelings angle, etc.

I can also see the point of view of his captain, team-mates and fans who might be upset that they bust a gut to get him into a winning position only for one guy to 'abdicate responsibility' for winning his own match, and in doing so undo everyone else's contribution.

Didn't Darren Clark do it as well, in last year's Ryder Cup? Though with less consequence.

It's one thing to prejudice your own victory, another thing to give your team-mates' victory away too.

As I say, I'm very much in two minds about it.

[Fats25]

I have no doubt if UK had been the holders the offer would never have been made to tie!

[Yoof Full Chav]

[redacted]

[BarnatosGhost]

Fats25 said:

I have no doubt if UK had been the holders the offer would never have been made to tie!

I agree, but the emotional difference between win, tie and lose is huge. The concept of having to actually lose in order to lose possession of the Cup is comparitively neither here nor there.

Everyone wanted to win, except Nicklaus who wanted to look like the good guy. Apparently his captain Sam Snead was livid with him. After all the hooha of a Ryder Cup, I'm not surprised.

[Yoof Full Chav]

[redacted]

[BarnatosGhost]

Yoof Full Chav said:

I hadnt thought of it like that, thanks. I managed to cure my slice, and the time we played i only lost one ball, due to the breeze carrying it into a water hazard, so as long as i remember to do things properly i should get back to where i was, but thanks for that advice anyway

sorry, i had a quoting disaster so deleted it - it wasn't aimed at you, but now you've responded positively...here it is (was)




Just guessing here, but from reading your posts the biggest difference you could make to your scores, and you could do it overnight, is make different decisions regarding your shot choices.

play conservatively for wide open spaces, use your woods very sparingly and your driver not at all, and go from losing 4,5,6(?) balls a round to losing 1 or 2, and instantly you've chopped 10 shots out.

If you can hit a 7 iron 150 yards (ish) into an area the size of a 2 tennis courts with 8/10 consistency, then the only reason you aren't playing off 12 is that you're biting off more than you can chew with shot selection.

Using that trusty 7 iron every par 5 on the course is reachable in 3 or 4 with ease - 2 putts and you're walking off the longest hole on the course with a bogey. Almost every single time.

Most par 4s become 2 simple straight shots, a little chip, and 1 or 2 putts.

And playing this way you become very hard to beat at matchplay, because you're involved on every hole, and most opponents will write themselves out of 4 or more holes with unforced errors and silly risks.

That, in effect, puts you on the first tee of a 14 hole course, already 4 holes up.

I'm not suggesting you actually should only ever use a 7 iron, but your scores would probably drop (initially) if you did.

[Yoof Full Chav]

BarnatosGhost said:

sorry, i had a quoting disaster so deleted it - it wasn't aimed at you, but now you've responded positively...here it is (was)




Just guessing here, but from reading your posts the biggest difference you could make to your scores, and you could do it overnight, is make different decisions regarding your shot choices.

play conservatively for wide open spaces, use your woods very sparingly and your driver not at all, and go from losing 4,5,6(?) balls a round to losing 1 or 2, and instantly you've chopped 10 shots out.

If you can hit a 7 iron 150 yards (ish) into an area the size of a 2 tennis courts with 8/10 consistency, then the only reason you aren't playing off 12 is that you're biting off more than you can chew with shot selection.

Using that trusty 7 iron every par 5 on the course is reachable in 3 or 4 with ease - 2 putts and you're walking off the longest hole on the course with a bogey. Almost every single time.

Most par 4s become 2 simple straight shots, a little chip, and 1 or 2 putts.

And playing this way you become very hard to beat at matchplay, because you're involved on every hole, and most opponents will write themselves out of 4 or more holes with unforced errors and silly risks.

That, in effect, puts you on the first tee of a 14 hole course, already 4 holes up.

I'm not suggesting you actually should only ever use a 7 iron, but your scores would probably drop (initially) if you did.

Sorry, i deleted my reply, as i thought i was seeing things. I'm always open to new ideas of how to reduce my score, and lower the golf ball loss, so thanks for that

[BarnatosGhost]

No, it was my fault, sorry.