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taaffy

907 posts

108 months

[news] 
Tuesday 21st August 2012 quote quote all
brissleboy said:
taaffy said:
you'll be fine, just dont try to run before you can walk.

u probably wont do this but I'd have half a dozen lessons with a couple of good range practice sessions between each lesson before going anywhere near the golf course.
Get used to hitting the ball before adding the complications that the course will throw at you.
You'll be more confident when u do then venture onto the course.
Taaffy, that is exactly what I am going to do, I have no inclination to get on a course before I can hit the ball pretty confidently! I thought about 6 lessons should do it though have no idea what the lessons will involve as yet (I think they are 30 mins long). A lot of my friends are confident and/or competent so want to be at a level, yet to be decided by me.

Generally speaking, if I am remotely okay, how long does it take to be able to hack your way around a golf course without looking like an idiot?

Thanks for the advice, much appreciated!
How long is a piece of string?

If you have good hand eye coordination and pick it up fairly easily then with some dedicated practice then there is no reason why you cant be hitting decent shots after about a month. Then learning to play golf is a lot easier.
Putting is all about choosing a line and judging pace.
short game more about shot choices and lots of practice.

Having lessons to get the basics right is first and foremost.
Practicing those lesson skills properly will pay dividends.(lots of people have lessons with no practice and expect it to be a magic formula)
Do not listen to well meaning advice from anyone else on the range other than the pro who you are having lessons with...it will only confuse you and fill your head with cliche advice.

Learning to hit a golf ball half decent is not difficult but learning to play golf to a good standard is time consuming and rewarding when you get there.

Main things the pro will go through are

1) grip
2) posture
3) alignment
3) ball position

If you can master those 4 things and repeat them consistently then you are more than halfway there.
Keeping the posture throughout the swing is the next challenge but if you can do that then you will find that hitting the ball will be a lot easier.

Work a bit on upper back flexibility and the posterior deltoid flexibility of the left shoulder.

A good repeating golf swing is easier to perform when you have good upper back and rear shoulder flexibility and when you can maintain a consistent address position posture.

The golf swing is a simple motion which is overcomplicated with so many varying ideas on the correct way to do it.

Enjoy your lessons with some smart practice and you will learn quickly.


And remember one thing....it is a golf swing not a golf "hit" ...you swing the club and the ball gets in the way ...you do not it at the ball.



mattnunn

4,087 posts

30 months

[news] 
Tuesday 21st August 2012 quote quote all
I'm playing #2 course at Gullane on Thurs, forecast is possible showers but definate 15mph winds, any tips on playing an unknown course in the wind? Can't wait...

taaffy

907 posts

108 months

[news] 
Tuesday 21st August 2012 quote quote all
mattnunn said:
I'm playing #2 course at Gullane on Thurs, forecast is possible showers but definate 15mph winds, any tips on playing an unknown course in the wind? Can't wait...
Get a course planner so you know where the bunkers are as links bunkers at Gullane can be lethal.

Keep the ball low...that way it won't get blown off course and will be less likely to take any big bounces at right angles into the crap, even if that means playing knock down 3 irons off every tee( you'll get some run on the fairways by keeping it lower)..... better on the fairway shorter than long and in rough or pot bunkers.

Be creative with chip and runs around the greens ....

Enjoy Golf as it was mean't to be played.. along the ground.

Hope the rain stays away for you, but a wee breeze will make it interesting....



mattnunn

4,087 posts

30 months

[news] 
Tuesday 21st August 2012 quote quote all
taaffy said:
mattnunn said:
I'm playing #2 course at Gullane on Thurs, forecast is possible showers but definate 15mph winds, any tips on playing an unknown course in the wind? Can't wait...
Get a course planner so you know where the bunkers are as links bunkers at Gullane can be lethal.

Keep the ball low...that way it won't get blown off course and will be less likely to take any big bounces at right angles into the crap, even if that means playing knock down 3 irons off every tee( you'll get some run on the fairways by keeping it lower)..... better on the fairway shorter than long and in rough or pot bunkers.

Be creative with chip and runs around the greens ....

Enjoy Golf as it was mean't to be played.. along the ground.

Hope the rain stays away for you, but a wee breeze will make it interesting....
Yeah cheers, keeping it low is certainly a skill that I find difficult to turn on it's not a shot I generally practice (obviously I top them as much as the next poor golfer), I think hitting a 3 wood of the deck at 70% will give me a better chance of a repeatable low raking shot than using my 3/4/5 iron which I generally only have one shot with.

Just looked on google streetview, I'm very worried how close to the road the course is!

taaffy

907 posts

108 months

[news] 
Tuesday 21st August 2012 quote quote all
mattnunn said:
taaffy said:
mattnunn said:
I'm playing #2 course at Gullane on Thurs, forecast is possible showers but definate 15mph winds, any tips on playing an unknown course in the wind? Can't wait...
Get a course planner so you know where the bunkers are as links bunkers at Gullane can be lethal.

Keep the ball low...that way it won't get blown off course and will be less likely to take any big bounces at right angles into the crap, even if that means playing knock down 3 irons off every tee( you'll get some run on the fairways by keeping it lower)..... better on the fairway shorter than long and in rough or pot bunkers.

Be creative with chip and runs around the greens ....

Enjoy Golf as it was mean't to be played.. along the ground.

Hope the rain stays away for you, but a wee breeze will make it interesting....
Yeah cheers, keeping it low is certainly a skill that I find difficult to turn on it's not a shot I generally practice (obviously I top them as much as the next poor golfer), I think hitting a 3 wood of the deck at 70% will give me a better chance of a repeatable low raking shot than using my 3/4/5 iron which I generally only have one shot with.

Just looked on google streetview, I'm very worried how close to the road the course is!
Knockdown shots are pretty straightforward... try this on the practice range before your round...

Play the ball back in the stance, midway between centre of your stance and your rear foot.
Close face of club to square it to target line.
Hands forwards, just left of trouser zipper line.

All you then do is put your normal 3/4 swing on it, keeping hands ahead will keep the flight ball lower, you do not have to do anything else, it is a very simple change.

Experiment on the range with the ball position to get your desired flight.



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mattnunn

4,087 posts

30 months

[news] 
Tuesday 21st August 2012 quote quote all
taaffy said:
mattnunn said:
taaffy said:
mattnunn said:
I'm playing #2 course at Gullane on Thurs, forecast is possible showers but definate 15mph winds, any tips on playing an unknown course in the wind? Can't wait...
Get a course planner so you know where the bunkers are as links bunkers at Gullane can be lethal.

Keep the ball low...that way it won't get blown off course and will be less likely to take any big bounces at right angles into the crap, even if that means playing knock down 3 irons off every tee( you'll get some run on the fairways by keeping it lower)..... better on the fairway shorter than long and in rough or pot bunkers.

Be creative with chip and runs around the greens ....

Enjoy Golf as it was mean't to be played.. along the ground.

Hope the rain stays away for you, but a wee breeze will make it interesting....
Yeah cheers, keeping it low is certainly a skill that I find difficult to turn on it's not a shot I generally practice (obviously I top them as much as the next poor golfer), I think hitting a 3 wood of the deck at 70% will give me a better chance of a repeatable low raking shot than using my 3/4/5 iron which I generally only have one shot with.

Just looked on google streetview, I'm very worried how close to the road the course is!
Knockdown shots are pretty straightforward... try this on the practice range before your round...

Play the ball back in the stance, midway between centre of your stance and your rear foot.
Close face of club to square it to target line.
Hands forwards, just left of trouser zipper line.

All you then do is put your normal 3/4 swing on it, keeping hands ahead will keep the flight ball lower, you do not have to do anything else, it is a very simple change.

Experiment on the range with the ball position to get your desired flight.
Cheers, I'll try that

djstevec

2,037 posts

43 months

[news] 
Tuesday 21st August 2012 quote quote all
taaffy said:
mattnunn said:
taaffy said:
mattnunn said:
I'm playing #2 course at Gullane on Thurs, forecast is possible showers but definate 15mph winds, any tips on playing an unknown course in the wind? Can't wait...
Get a course planner so you know where the bunkers are as links bunkers at Gullane can be lethal.

Keep the ball low...that way it won't get blown off course and will be less likely to take any big bounces at right angles into the crap, even if that means playing knock down 3 irons off every tee( you'll get some run on the fairways by keeping it lower)..... better on the fairway shorter than long and in rough or pot bunkers.

Be creative with chip and runs around the greens ....

Enjoy Golf as it was mean't to be played.. along the ground.

Hope the rain stays away for you, but a wee breeze will make it interesting....
Yeah cheers, keeping it low is certainly a skill that I find difficult to turn on it's not a shot I generally practice (obviously I top them as much as the next poor golfer), I think hitting a 3 wood of the deck at 70% will give me a better chance of a repeatable low raking shot than using my 3/4/5 iron which I generally only have one shot with.

Just looked on google streetview, I'm very worried how close to the road the course is!
Knockdown shots are pretty straightforward... try this on the practice range before your round...

Play the ball back in the stance, midway between centre of your stance and your rear foot.
Close face of club to square it to target line.
Hands forwards, just left of trouser zipper line.

All you then do is put your normal 3/4 swing on it, keeping hands ahead will keep the flight ball lower, you do not have to do anything else, it is a very simple change.

Experiment on the range with the ball position to get your desired flight.
You're also likely to get a draw ball flight from this ball position, so allow a little for the right to left movement through the air, and more so you come to the long irons.

taaffy

907 posts

108 months

[news] 
Tuesday 21st August 2012 quote quote all
mattnunn said:
taaffy said:
mattnunn said:
taaffy said:
mattnunn said:
I'm playing #2 course at Gullane on Thurs, forecast is possible showers but definate 15mph winds, any tips on playing an unknown course in the wind? Can't wait...
Get a course planner so you know where the bunkers are as links bunkers at Gullane can be lethal.

Keep the ball low...that way it won't get blown off course and will be less likely to take any big bounces at right angles into the crap, even if that means playing knock down 3 irons off every tee( you'll get some run on the fairways by keeping it lower)..... better on the fairway shorter than long and in rough or pot bunkers.

Be creative with chip and runs around the greens ....

Enjoy Golf as it was mean't to be played.. along the ground.

Hope the rain stays away for you, but a wee breeze will make it interesting....
Yeah cheers, keeping it low is certainly a skill that I find difficult to turn on it's not a shot I generally practice (obviously I top them as much as the next poor golfer), I think hitting a 3 wood of the deck at 70% will give me a better chance of a repeatable low raking shot than using my 3/4/5 iron which I generally only have one shot with.

Just looked on google streetview, I'm very worried how close to the road the course is!
Knockdown shots are pretty straightforward... try this on the practice range before your round...

Play the ball back in the stance, midway between centre of your stance and your rear foot.
Close face of club to square it to target line.
Hands forwards, just left of trouser zipper line.

All you then do is put your normal 3/4 swing on it, keeping hands ahead will keep the flight ball lower, you do not have to do anything else, it is a very simple change.

Experiment on the range with the ball position to get your desired flight.
Cheers, I'll try that
Have a look at this , it's a pretty good explanation. He does not mention closing club face but you'll know if you need to do it as the ball will be heading off to the right. He also mentions having more weight on his left side, this can mean you get a bit steep putting a bit more spin on the ball. Try and experiment for yourself and see which method you prefer.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kdcJe67dVmQ

marksx

1,468 posts

59 months

[news] 
Tuesday 21st August 2012 quote quote all
taaffy said:
Work a bit on upper back flexibility and the posterior deltoid flexibility of the left shoulder.
Hi taaffy, can you reccommend some good exercises for this please?

Oh, and your last sentence about it being a swing, not a hit; when I first heard that it was a revelation!

I always wondered why my practice swings felt really good, and looked good so I'm told. Until there was a ball in front of me. Once I figured out that it was just in the way and not a target, bingo!

I'm still crap mind!

taaffy

907 posts

108 months

[news] 
Tuesday 21st August 2012 quote quote all
marksx said:
taaffy said:
Work a bit on upper back flexibility and the posterior deltoid flexibility of the left shoulder.
Hi taaffy, can you reccommend some good exercises for this please?

Oh, and your last sentence about it being a swing, not a hit; when I first heard that it was a revelation!

I always wondered why my practice swings felt really good, and looked good so I'm told. Until there was a ball in front of me. Once I figured out that it was just in the way and not a target, bingo!

I'm still crap mind!
Posterior deltoid stretch: There are a couple of usual suspects such as holding your arm straight across your chest but the one that I have been recommended by a physio is this-
Stand side on to something like a door frame or stair bannister post with your left arm outstretched and with fingertips or hand holding on. Then roll yourself up like a swiss roll towards your hand curling up nice and tight until your left hand is as far round your neck as you can reach, you should feel a good stretch in the rear of your shoulder.

As for lat stretch try this-
From B&Q buy a length of brush pole about 6ft long. put some sort of cushioning on it to act as a grip. use it the way you see a stretch pole being used in the video below.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PR9vSCAWJCI

Quite a number of PGA Tour pro's use this pole.



Edited by taaffy on Tuesday 21st August 20:04

brissleboy

200 posts

39 months

[news] 
Wednesday 22nd August 2012 quote quote all
taaffy said:
How long is a piece of string?

If you have good hand eye coordination and pick it up fairly easily then with some dedicated practice then there is no reason why you cant be hitting decent shots after about a month. Then learning to play golf is a lot easier.
Putting is all about choosing a line and judging pace.
short game more about shot choices and lots of practice.

Having lessons to get the basics right is first and foremost.
Practicing those lesson skills properly will pay dividends.(lots of people have lessons with no practice and expect it to be a magic formula)
Do not listen to well meaning advice from anyone else on the range other than the pro who you are having lessons with...it will only confuse you and fill your head with cliche advice.

Learning to hit a golf ball half decent is not difficult but learning to play golf to a good standard is time consuming and rewarding when you get there.

Main things the pro will go through are

1) grip
2) posture
3) alignment
3) ball position

If you can master those 4 things and repeat them consistently then you are more than halfway there.
Keeping the posture throughout the swing is the next challenge but if you can do that then you will find that hitting the ball will be a lot easier.

Work a bit on upper back flexibility and the posterior deltoid flexibility of the left shoulder.

A good repeating golf swing is easier to perform when you have good upper back and rear shoulder flexibility and when you can maintain a consistent address position posture.

The golf swing is a simple motion which is overcomplicated with so many varying ideas on the correct way to do it.

Enjoy your lessons with some smart practice and you will learn quickly.


And remember one thing....it is a golf swing not a golf "hit" ...you swing the club and the ball gets in the way ...you do not it at the ball.
Thank you so much for all this advice, I'm sure it will prove invaluable. So, I had my first lesson in the driving rain last night under the protection of the driving range cover and I thoroughly enjoyed it! After a brief chit chat we got down to the serious business of grip, posture, alignment and where I should be positioned in relation to the ball... then after a few practice swings/demonstrations, I started hitting a few balls; not too well at first I hasten to add but by the end of the lesson I was hitting the majority pretty cleanly, first with a 6 iron, then a wedge, and finally a wood. All in all a positive start I think! I have another lesson booked for next Wednesday evening and in the meantime I plan to go to the driving range to hit some balls, I can't wait!

Sexual Chocolate

837 posts

13 months

[news] 
Wednesday 22nd August 2012 quote quote all
Any tips for getting back spin with 5 - 7 irons? Back spin ahoy with 8 onwards just can't seem to get the ball to stop quickly or spin back with the lower irons.

djstevec

2,037 posts

43 months

[news] 
Wednesday 22nd August 2012 quote quote all
Sexual Chocolate said:
Any tips for getting back spin with 5 - 7 irons? Back spin ahoy with 8 onwards just can't seem to get the ball to stop quickly or spin back with the lower irons.
Personally I wouldn't expect significant backspin from the 7 down, and TBH its probably better for distance control to just apply just enough spin to stop the ball on the green in a bounce or two, giving you more control and consistency. I couldn't count the number of times I've landed a 9 or wedge bang on the stick for length, then watch the ball screw back 15ft off the green!!

But basically every shot you hit will have backspin, even the driver, but creating backspin that gives you that "screw back" is primarily down to the ball, the angle of the club face and the ball trajectory. The flatter the trajectory of the ball flight, the more backspin you would need to overcome the forward momentum and then have "excess" backspin to reverse the ball after the forward momentum has been negated. But as longer irons produce less backspin, (unless the greens are like a sponge) I doubt you'd be able to produce significant excess backspin from 7 down.

The characteristics of the ball you play with will also greatly affect how much spin is put on the ball at impact, softer the ball, the longer it stays on the clubface and the more spin (back spin and side spin) is generated. Most "distance" balls are designed to spin less and/or are harder so "ping" off the club face, as higher backspin rates generally sacrifice distance.

And then course conditions make a big difference to backspin. Hard greens can make backspin very difficult with any club, whereas soft ones will even stop a 3 iron in a few feet. Hitting into a breeze will stop a ball quicker than downwind etc etc.

taaffy

907 posts

108 months

[news] 
Wednesday 22nd August 2012 quote quote all
djstevec said:
Sexual Chocolate said:
Any tips for getting back spin with 5 - 7 irons? Back spin ahoy with 8 onwards just can't seem to get the ball to stop quickly or spin back with the lower irons.
Personally I wouldn't expect significant backspin from the 7 down, and TBH its probably better for distance control to just apply just enough spin to stop the ball on the green in a bounce or two, giving you more control and consistency. I couldn't count the number of times I've landed a 9 or wedge bang on the stick for length, then watch the ball screw back 15ft off the green!!

But basically every shot you hit will have backspin, even the driver, but creating backspin that gives you that "screw back" is primarily down to the ball, the angle of the club face and the ball trajectory. The flatter the trajectory of the ball flight, the more backspin you would need to overcome the forward momentum and then have "excess" backspin to reverse the ball after the forward momentum has been negated. But as longer irons produce less backspin, (unless the greens are like a sponge) I doubt you'd be able to produce significant excess backspin from 7 down.

The characteristics of the ball you play with will also greatly affect how much spin is put on the ball at impact, softer the ball, the longer it stays on the clubface and the more spin (back spin and side spin) is generated. Most "distance" balls are designed to spin less and/or are harder so "ping" off the club face, as higher backspin rates generally sacrifice distance.

And then course conditions make a big difference to backspin. Hard greens can make backspin very difficult with any club, whereas soft ones will even stop a 3 iron in a few feet. Hitting into a breeze will stop a ball quicker than downwind etc etc.
Steve has covered it fairly well.
If the greens are receptive then you may get the ball to stop purely because the greens are soft.
If they are firmer then the only real way to get the ball to stop is by hitting it with a higher flight so that it is landing with a steeper descent (you'd be surprised at how high tour players hit their longer irons).
Basically a crisp strike is what you are looking to achieve to assure the best chance of maximum spin.

Sexual Chocolate

837 posts

13 months

[news] 
Wednesday 22nd August 2012 quote quote all
Play with Pro-vs so they are pretty soft and therefore spin quite well but they really don't last long. Greens on our course have a stip count of 9.2 or something near to that so not that bad a surface.

Watched some golf over the weekend and saw several players stop the ball pretty much dead with a 5 iron and even though I am a low H/C (CAT 1) I have never been able to do that with a 5. Guess thats why I am stuck in an office thinking/wishing of playing golf rather than on tour.

Knew I should have tried harder when I was a kid. mad

roboxm3

1,336 posts

64 months

[news] 
Wednesday 22nd August 2012 quote quote all
No range for me last night frown
I was supposed to be having a lesson but 4hrs on the bike on Sunday, with the other half riding pillion, nodding off and leaning on me put an end to that - my back was fooked irked

On the upside; I have now received my new grips, grip tape and rubber shaft gripper thing, my putter grip was dispatched yesterday and I collect my new vice on Thursday! So this weekend a few hours will be dedicated to re-gripping my clubs and shortening and re-gripping my putter! thumbup

timlongs

1,169 posts

48 months

[news] 
Wednesday 22nd August 2012 quote quote all
So after getting back into it this summer, and having an average round of 18 over. I played to 15 over! Could have been even better but conditions were difficult with a very strong wind. Also gutted to have pitched a 6 iron 2 foot infront of the pin on a par 3 only for it to miss the pin by an inch and roll on 15 foot past!

djstevec

2,037 posts

43 months

[news] 
Wednesday 22nd August 2012 quote quote all
Sexual Chocolate said:
Play with Pro-vs so they are pretty soft and therefore spin quite well but they really don't last long. Greens on our course have a stip count of 9.2 or something near to that so not that bad a surface.

Watched some golf over the weekend and saw several players stop the ball pretty much dead with a 5 iron and even though I am a low H/C (CAT 1) I have never been able to do that with a 5. Guess thats why I am stuck in an office thinking/wishing of playing golf rather than on tour.

Knew I should have tried harder when I was a kid. mad
Yeah Pro's do play a very different game to us mortals! A lot of the greens (esp US PGA) are very receptive, ie soft, but Pro's generally get a higher trajectory to long iron ball flight as they hit it harder/cleaner. There's also consideration if the shot is upwind/down, elevation of the green in relation to the where the shot is hit from etc.

Not saying you cant, but there's a lot of factors involved!

taaffy

907 posts

108 months

[news] 
Wednesday 22nd August 2012 quote quote all
Sexual Chocolate said:


Watched some golf over the weekend and saw several players stop the ball pretty much dead with a 5 iron and even though I am a low H/C (CAT 1) I have never been able to do that with a 5.
Don't fret, neither can I and not many guys I've played with can either...just play smarter.

FellowPazzini

2,587 posts

40 months

[news] 
Thursday 23rd August 2012 quote quote all
Had such a good session at the range last night, shame I can't bring that to the course confused

How do you find a putter that's right for you? Currently still on the look out for a decent one, preferably TaylorMade but after testing a few out at American Golf I just don't know/feel which one would be best for me. When looking for a set of Iron's it was more a case of which one's can I actually hit the ball with but now I'm stuck on the putter. Currently I'm using a old cheap putter (standard head I think) which seems OK but it's 36", (I think) so when I'm testing newer one's they all seem to be 33" (again, I think). This makes me feel like I'm bending right over into a bit of a uncomfortable position but apparently that's normal (I'm 6ft). Any idea's??
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