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Really good piece by Shane Stokes here with Joerg Jaksche giving his opinion on this whole fiasco. We should hear more from the likes of Jaksche and people of his ilk, rather than the PR spin and vested interests crap dished out by the likes of Brailsford and Walsh.
http://cyclingtips.com/2016/09/jaksche-on-skys-tue...
http://cyclingtips.com/2016/09/jaksche-on-skys-tue...
When Wiggins transformed into a tour contender the old Lance Armstrong explanation was trotted out: "lost weight".
It's quite simple in my eyes, you cant beat dopers in grand tours unless youre on something too, even if its only via TUE.
Wiggins memory is also quite poor- I once watch him state he never raced against Armstrong. HMMM. Theres a northern irish paralympic gold medal record breaking swimmer, her disability is "learning difficulties" due to her crap shirt term memory. Wiggins should go to the next paralympics on the same grounds
It's quite simple in my eyes, you cant beat dopers in grand tours unless youre on something too, even if its only via TUE.
Wiggins memory is also quite poor- I once watch him state he never raced against Armstrong. HMMM. Theres a northern irish paralympic gold medal record breaking swimmer, her disability is "learning difficulties" due to her crap shirt term memory. Wiggins should go to the next paralympics on the same grounds
I have said all along that how many pro cyclist had athsma seemed dodgy but a few on here defended the fact by saying cycling brought on resperatory problems.
It now turns out they are injecting themselves with a powerful PED with the blessing of the UCI and WADA.
TUE's is not cheating unless you don't actually have the ailment in the first place!
It now turns out they are injecting themselves with a powerful PED with the blessing of the UCI and WADA.
TUE's is not cheating unless you don't actually have the ailment in the first place!
I hugely dislike the way that the information has come out. Medical records should be confidential, and the current absence of information about Russian athletes or teams is quite suspect too.
However...
For Wiggo and Team Sky, I'm going to reserve judgement, but it really doesn't look good. There's going to be a few very busy PR bods the next couple of days.
I'm pretty sure the injection he used is the same as the wife had for hay-fever the year that we got married. (She really does struggle.) On our honeymoon we hired a tandem, and she was crap. So perhaps Kenalog doesn't have the sort of effects people are talking about.
I'm aware of the irony of stating medical records should be confidential, then discussing my wife's medical case history.
However...
For Wiggo and Team Sky, I'm going to reserve judgement, but it really doesn't look good. There's going to be a few very busy PR bods the next couple of days.
I'm pretty sure the injection he used is the same as the wife had for hay-fever the year that we got married. (She really does struggle.) On our honeymoon we hired a tandem, and she was crap. So perhaps Kenalog doesn't have the sort of effects people are talking about.
I'm aware of the irony of stating medical records should be confidential, then discussing my wife's medical case history.
Granfondo said:
I have said all along that how many pro cyclist had athsma seemed dodgy but a few on here defended the fact by saying cycling brought on resperatory problems.
It now turns out they are injecting themselves with a powerful PED with the blessing of the UCI and WADA.
TUE's is not cheating unless you don't actually have the ailment in the first place!
I had exercised induced Asthma and was prescribed a salbutamol inhaler however I didn't like using it and I found if I extended my warm up and rode gently for 15 mins or so I was fine.It now turns out they are injecting themselves with a powerful PED with the blessing of the UCI and WADA.
TUE's is not cheating unless you don't actually have the ailment in the first place!
Athletes do get ill and have problems so this is a matter for the medial profession to deal with.
Granfondo said:
I have said all along that how many pro cyclist had athsma seemed dodgy but a few on here defended the fact by saying cycling brought on resperatory problems.
It now turns out they are injecting themselves with a powerful PED with the blessing of the UCI and WADA.
TUE's is not cheating unless you don't actually have the ailment in the first place!
I don't disagree with any of that but you or I could be asthmatic, we just don't put our bodies under enough stress to develop a preexisting condition that is dormant in the body to a full blown ailment. These guys cycle 20,000kms+ a year at high intensity placing huge loads on their lungs. If you did the same I'm sure you too would develop respiratory problems. But yes, in some cases the timing of the TUEs is suspect. What I find interesting is it sends to be older riders, of course we don't know if the likes of Pinot or Alaphilippe have the same TUEs but it would be interesting to see if it's something that is affecting people in the latter stages of their career.It now turns out they are injecting themselves with a powerful PED with the blessing of the UCI and WADA.
TUE's is not cheating unless you don't actually have the ailment in the first place!
As I said, fancy bears are very selective of the data they have released given TUEs are rife throughout the peloton. You'd have to be very naive to think that no one else is taking the same prescription
The best way for Russia to defend themselves is to go on the attack, that's all they have done. There are a lot more sinister things going on in Russia than at Sky, movistar or orica but once again the spotlight has been shifted.
This is worth a read dependent upon how cynical you are! now I'm not stupid enough to think that coaches reading this are not suddenly thinking hey, go to the doctors, claim you're always out of breath and you get the TUE and you're free to compete with the drugs but if one nation is doing it, they all are.
Asthma rife among elite athletes, finds study
http://www.theguardian.com/society/2014/dec/28/ast...
now I'm not stupid enough to think that coaches reading this are not suddenly thinking hey, go to the doctors, claim you're always out of breath and you get the TUE and you're free to compete with the drugs but if one nation is doing it, they all are.Asthma rife among elite athletes, finds study
http://www.theguardian.com/society/2014/dec/28/ast...
Edited by anonymous-user on Monday 19th September 10:14
Edited by anonymous-user on Monday 19th September 10:16
I had asthma as a child but it passed, and I would say I was super fit up until my mid 20s. In my early 30s when I came back to competitive amateur cycling the asthma returned as exercised and cold induced asthma. For a good few years I never knew what it was like to have a proper lung full of air and simply didn’t have the extra capacity to bring me back up to the competitive level against my racing peers that I previously was at. Then on once, before a crappy, short, local club league time trail, I felt like I was dying - my chest was feeling really tight and wheezy. I found an inhaler in the garage which I pretty much emptied into me. My lungs were working like they should - I felt “normal” again. I rode a great time and it felt good not to be choking up after two minutes. That was my last time racing as it was quite clear that unless I was consuming a lot of inhalers beforehand I wouldn’t be competitive, and what was the point of that, particularly if my therapeutic use meant beating guys in races who didn’t have asthma but trained harder and were therefore naturally better on the day.
So personally I think if you have a congenital or acquired medical condition which hampers your ability to do a sport competitively then that’s bad luck, you lack the necessary ability. Professional sports, especially those which depend almost entirely on human physical performance, should not be treated as handicapped events, where one man’s natural deficit to another should be compensated in some way. Therefor I’m totally against these TUEs.
So personally I think if you have a congenital or acquired medical condition which hampers your ability to do a sport competitively then that’s bad luck, you lack the necessary ability. Professional sports, especially those which depend almost entirely on human physical performance, should not be treated as handicapped events, where one man’s natural deficit to another should be compensated in some way. Therefor I’m totally against these TUEs.
pablo said:
As I said, fancy bears are very selective of the data they have released given TUEs are rife throughout the peloton. You'd have to be very naive to think that no one else is taking the same prescription
The best way for Russia to defend themselves is to go on the attack, that's all they have done. There are a lot more sinister things going on in Russia than at Sky, movistar or orica but once again the spotlight has been shifted.
Bingo:The best way for Russia to defend themselves is to go on the attack, that's all they have done. There are a lot more sinister things going on in Russia than at Sky, movistar or orica but once again the spotlight has been shifted.
Firstly plenty of people will have been on TUE, secondly these TUE's clearly didn't have major impacts give that all the athletes had won major races well away from the TUE's.
Secondly the autobiography smoking gun is a smoking gun for Wiggins not writing it......
mcelliott said:
Talksteer said:
TUE's clearly didn't have major impacts
Sorry I'm not sure what you mean by that, can you clarify. Also, can you name some of the races that Wiggins won, or did well in, without the need for his TUEs.pablo said:
mcelliott said:
Talksteer said:
TUE's clearly didn't have major impacts
Sorry I'm not sure what you mean by that, can you clarify. Also, can you name some of the races that Wiggins won, or did well in, without the need for his TUEs.
pablo said:
mcelliott said:
Talksteer said:
TUE's clearly didn't have major impacts
Sorry I'm not sure what you mean by that, can you clarify. Also, can you name some of the races that Wiggins won, or did well in, without the need for his TUEs.mcelliott said:
Talksteer said:
TUE's clearly didn't have major impacts
Sorry I'm not sure what you mean by that, can you clarify. Also, can you name some of the races that Wiggins won, or did well in, without the need for his TUEs.In 2012 Wiggins won, before the TUE.
Paris-Nice
Tour of Romandie
Criterium De Dauphine
Those the races are on the world tour and are the most prestigious one week stage races.
He did the same in the 2011 edition of the CdD, knocking a minute out of Cadel Evans on the same time trial course Evans won the 2011 tour on. Oh and in 2011 he also won the British road race championships.
Wiggins pre Tour form indicated he would win it, none of these victories were won under TUE.
mcelliott said:
I doubt very much of either of those two riders won their respective Grand Tours clean. Maybe you could tell me how Wiggins has managed the yo-yoing of his weight over the years; corpse like for his Grand Tours, without any loss of power, and then manages to pack on 10-15kg of muscle without getting fat, for his velodrome exploits.
Because he's got good coaches and nutritionists? Because it's his job to do that and he is paid handsomely to achieve it?Ultimately cycling will always be about trying to prove a negative. You think a performance is suspicious but have no evidence of cheating.
Don't get me wrong, I've got a lot of time for the doubters but you need to treat everyone with equal contempt.
Ultimately you will keep asking questions that can not be answered our you won't accept the answers. Start by asking Lampre, TinkOff and Astana about their TUEs and you won't come across quite so "anti-Sky"
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