Cricket: 2014 India tour of England, 9th July-7th September
Discussion
India's cricket has, in the last three tests, been abysmal. And that's being generous.
Why?
It's very easy to blame the state of the modern game, and by that I mean the preponderance of 'non test cricket'. I am a cricket lover - I'll quantify that - I am a sports lover, and what I have witnessed over the last three test matches was not sport.
Have India fallen on the sword of test cricket? That remains to be seen, however I believe that they are highly unlikely to turn things around any time soon. Don't get me wrong, they'll probably win the limited over series and the one billion plus will be placated. Effigies of M S Dhoni will no longer be burnt, but I am sure he will retire from the test captaincy. Does that mean a retirement from international cricket? - we will see as India do not split their captaincy and I cannot see him as captain of limited overs cricket sides only.
India are in a state of flux. There will be a certain amount of amortisation as that is unavoidable. The pressing question is whether they are willing to rebuild the side for the 'beautiful game'. Do they need to rebuild? Is the core squad they have good enough for international five day cricket? Are they fit enough?
I will reiterate my statement from earlier in that 'it's only India'. England are good. There is some exciting talent emerging. The acid test is always the next series and the pinnacle is always the ashes. Are England ready to retake the ashes? Not now. But come 2015 we will see. I just hope we don't get too carried away by beating a substandard test side. The same May apply against the West Indies next spring.
Why?
It's very easy to blame the state of the modern game, and by that I mean the preponderance of 'non test cricket'. I am a cricket lover - I'll quantify that - I am a sports lover, and what I have witnessed over the last three test matches was not sport.
Have India fallen on the sword of test cricket? That remains to be seen, however I believe that they are highly unlikely to turn things around any time soon. Don't get me wrong, they'll probably win the limited over series and the one billion plus will be placated. Effigies of M S Dhoni will no longer be burnt, but I am sure he will retire from the test captaincy. Does that mean a retirement from international cricket? - we will see as India do not split their captaincy and I cannot see him as captain of limited overs cricket sides only.
India are in a state of flux. There will be a certain amount of amortisation as that is unavoidable. The pressing question is whether they are willing to rebuild the side for the 'beautiful game'. Do they need to rebuild? Is the core squad they have good enough for international five day cricket? Are they fit enough?
I will reiterate my statement from earlier in that 'it's only India'. England are good. There is some exciting talent emerging. The acid test is always the next series and the pinnacle is always the ashes. Are England ready to retake the ashes? Not now. But come 2015 we will see. I just hope we don't get too carried away by beating a substandard test side. The same May apply against the West Indies next spring.
Seventy said:
The same may apply against the West Indies next spring.
Sadly, our WI team has been going through a change also. We've got some good early top 4 batsmen but after that, stuffed.Our bowling has some encouragement with a bit of fast, but no swing or diversity. You whiteies aren't going to be frightened by anything we can offer up.
Bum.
Seventy said:
India's cricket has, in the last three tests, been abysmal. And that's being generous.
Why?
It's very easy to blame the state of the modern game, and by that I mean the preponderance of 'non test cricket'. I am a cricket lover - I'll quantify that - I am a sports lover, and what I have witnessed over the last three test matches was not sport.
Have India fallen on the sword of test cricket? That remains to be seen, however I believe that they are highly unlikely to turn things around any time soon. Don't get me wrong, they'll probably win the limited over series and the one billion plus will be placated. Effigies of M S Dhoni will no longer be burnt, but I am sure he will retire from the test captaincy. Does that mean a retirement from international cricket? - we will see as India do not split their captaincy and I cannot see him as captain of limited overs cricket sides only.
India are in a state of flux. There will be a certain amount of amortisation as that is unavoidable. The pressing question is whether they are willing to rebuild the side for the 'beautiful game'. Do they need to rebuild? Is the core squad they have good enough for international five day cricket? Are they fit enough?
I will reiterate my statement from earlier in that 'it's only India'. England are good. There is some exciting talent emerging. The acid test is always the next series and the pinnacle is always the ashes. Are England ready to retake the ashes? Not now. But come 2015 we will see. I just hope we don't get too carried away by beating a substandard test side. The same May apply against the West Indies next spring.
I agree.Why?
It's very easy to blame the state of the modern game, and by that I mean the preponderance of 'non test cricket'. I am a cricket lover - I'll quantify that - I am a sports lover, and what I have witnessed over the last three test matches was not sport.
Have India fallen on the sword of test cricket? That remains to be seen, however I believe that they are highly unlikely to turn things around any time soon. Don't get me wrong, they'll probably win the limited over series and the one billion plus will be placated. Effigies of M S Dhoni will no longer be burnt, but I am sure he will retire from the test captaincy. Does that mean a retirement from international cricket? - we will see as India do not split their captaincy and I cannot see him as captain of limited overs cricket sides only.
India are in a state of flux. There will be a certain amount of amortisation as that is unavoidable. The pressing question is whether they are willing to rebuild the side for the 'beautiful game'. Do they need to rebuild? Is the core squad they have good enough for international five day cricket? Are they fit enough?
I will reiterate my statement from earlier in that 'it's only India'. England are good. There is some exciting talent emerging. The acid test is always the next series and the pinnacle is always the ashes. Are England ready to retake the ashes? Not now. But come 2015 we will see. I just hope we don't get too carried away by beating a substandard test side. The same May apply against the West Indies next spring.
Is the IPL the biggest cricketing event in India these days?
Do the Indian players aspire to play for KKR or RCB instead of the Test side? Styles of play are so different and you cannot play IPL style on an English wicket.
I really hope that is the last test series we play against India without DRS, There we some shocking decisions in the series.
Broad today with his hand off the bat - out caught. Jimmy's dismissal was also a joke, never hit it, was never any where near an LBW decision and just all kinds of wrong.
Ballance was twice not out, and goodness know what India decisions might have been overturned.
Standard of umpiring was poor, and without DRS no way to correct some very basic errors.
Anyway, good series win, Pleased for Cook that he has turned things round to some extent. However he isn't batting quite at his best, but the team obviously put in for him, Broad and Jimmy make us a decent side, Root has delivered on his early promise now they have stopped moving him around the order.
Well played England you can only beat what's in front of you etc.
India they were pathetic, not the fitness nor mental fortitude required for a 5 test series.
I looked online a few days ago to try and find some info on the state of test cricket in India and there wasn't much. The big cities want the glitz and glamour of T20 while out in the countryside test cricket is still king, was all I could find.
Playing T20 alone doesn't produce good cricketers. Test cricket will always be the pinnacle for me and holds my attention-T20 is OK for a bit of light entertainment, T20's negative impact on test cricket has been done before so will leave it at that.
What test cricket needs IMO is decent pitches that offer a fair contest for bat and ball, Trent Bridge was fooking dire.
So Windies next up I hope the pitches are up to scratch after the last tour.
India they were pathetic, not the fitness nor mental fortitude required for a 5 test series.
I looked online a few days ago to try and find some info on the state of test cricket in India and there wasn't much. The big cities want the glitz and glamour of T20 while out in the countryside test cricket is still king, was all I could find.
Playing T20 alone doesn't produce good cricketers. Test cricket will always be the pinnacle for me and holds my attention-T20 is OK for a bit of light entertainment, T20's negative impact on test cricket has been done before so will leave it at that.
What test cricket needs IMO is decent pitches that offer a fair contest for bat and ball, Trent Bridge was fooking dire.
So Windies next up I hope the pitches are up to scratch after the last tour.
Not sure I get this Ashes talk lark of England aren't ready etc. it's irrelevant as it depends entirely and utterly on the Jimmy & Stuey show. The Aus top six haven't looked like they have a clue what to do about them in English conditions in...we'll ever.
Rhino Harris won't hold together for five tests, he won't even manage four. And Johnson back in England? Yes please. In fact I can't wait to see Mitch bowl to Jos the Boss. Four overs, that's how long I give before he is withdrawn from the attack.
The series depends on whether Jimmy and Broad bowl properly and only that. They bowl like Lords and Aus will walk it. They bowl normally and Aus will get blown away.
Rhino Harris won't hold together for five tests, he won't even manage four. And Johnson back in England? Yes please. In fact I can't wait to see Mitch bowl to Jos the Boss. Four overs, that's how long I give before he is withdrawn from the attack.
The series depends on whether Jimmy and Broad bowl properly and only that. They bowl like Lords and Aus will walk it. They bowl normally and Aus will get blown away.
DJRC said:
Not sure I get this Ashes talk lark of England aren't ready etc. it's irrelevant as it depends entirely and utterly on the Jimmy & Stuey show. The Aus top six haven't looked like they have a clue what to do about them in English conditions in...we'll ever.
Rhino Harris won't hold together for five tests, he won't even manage four. And Johnson back in England? Yes please. In fact I can't wait to see Mitch bowl to Jos the Boss. Four overs, that's how long I give before he is withdrawn from the attack.
The series depends on whether Jimmy and Broad bowl properly and only that. They bowl like Lords and Aus will walk it. They bowl normally and Aus will get blown away.
I still remain to be convinced as to how good the Aussies are, however after hammering us they went on to win a series with SA so have more credibility it seems than I gave them. But yes they’re not a team we should be scared of (even now in English conditions). I see that one of the Ashes test is back in Wales again.Rhino Harris won't hold together for five tests, he won't even manage four. And Johnson back in England? Yes please. In fact I can't wait to see Mitch bowl to Jos the Boss. Four overs, that's how long I give before he is withdrawn from the attack.
The series depends on whether Jimmy and Broad bowl properly and only that. They bowl like Lords and Aus will walk it. They bowl normally and Aus will get blown away.
I'm somewhat worried that given the current chaotic state of the sport's administration, we are watching the final chapter of Test cricket. I hope I'm wrong, but there doesn't seem to be any move to create a balanced schedule and encourage growth of participants and spectators around the world.
This summer's schedule has been nuts, the Ashes are being milked to within an inch of the poor cow's life and England won't play a Test again for another eight months....
Not looking good.
This summer's schedule has been nuts, the Ashes are being milked to within an inch of the poor cow's life and England won't play a Test again for another eight months....
Not looking good.
a311 said:
DJRC said:
Not sure I get this Ashes talk lark of England aren't ready etc. it's irrelevant as it depends entirely and utterly on the Jimmy & Stuey show. The Aus top six haven't looked like they have a clue what to do about them in English conditions in...we'll ever.
Rhino Harris won't hold together for five tests, he won't even manage four. And Johnson back in England? Yes please. In fact I can't wait to see Mitch bowl to Jos the Boss. Four overs, that's how long I give before he is withdrawn from the attack.
The series depends on whether Jimmy and Broad bowl properly and only that. They bowl like Lords and Aus will walk it. They bowl normally and Aus will get blown away.
I still remain to be convinced as to how good the Aussies are, however after hammering us they went on to win a series with SA so have more credibility it seems than I gave them. But yes they’re not a team we should be scared of (even now in English conditions). I see that one of the Ashes test is back in Wales again.Rhino Harris won't hold together for five tests, he won't even manage four. And Johnson back in England? Yes please. In fact I can't wait to see Mitch bowl to Jos the Boss. Four overs, that's how long I give before he is withdrawn from the attack.
The series depends on whether Jimmy and Broad bowl properly and only that. They bowl like Lords and Aus will walk it. They bowl normally and Aus will get blown away.
t together. England should also have been sufficiently self aware to examine what their own weaknesses are, especially in the batting unit, and try to deal with those as the Crims will definitely play to try and capitalise on those, e.g. deliberately playing to induce KP holing out at midwicket. Edited by FiF on Monday 18th August 09:50
Leithen said:
I'm somewhat worried that given the current chaotic state of the sport's administration, we are watching the final chapter of Test cricket. I hope I'm wrong, but there doesn't seem to be any move to create a balanced schedule and encourage growth of participants and spectators around the world.
This summer's schedule has been nuts, the Ashes are being milked to within an inch of the poor cow's life and England won't play a Test again for another eight months....
Not looking good.
I entirely agree, I have rather grown bored with the Ashes and even had to check on Google to see when & where it's next occurring. So, we play Australia, again, in England next summer. I know it's been done to death but the schedule is crazy and no longer provides the degree of anticipation one used to get when looking forward to playing the Australians. This summer's schedule has been nuts, the Ashes are being milked to within an inch of the poor cow's life and England won't play a Test again for another eight months....
Not looking good.
We'll the biggish break between last winter and next summer for the Ashes is correct for me and works. It's the equivalent of 2 seasons and is correct. Last year/this winter pissed me off. I was Ashes'd-out and had no interest and didn't from the first test. And all because of the World Cup this winter hmmmm sorry but no. The 50over game dictating the schedules esp when it has little overall interest and drags on too long is just wrong to me.
DJRC said:
The 50over game dictating the schedules esp when it has little overall interest and drags on too long is just wrong to me.
I heard on TMS yesterday that India hadn't played a 5 test series since 2002! A quick look seems to confirm that. They are the economic powerhouse now - in professional sport money talks so unless there are some major changes it is inevitable. They really did not look interested after Lords.
Dhoni is a fine player but his comment yesterday "Don't be jealous of the IPL" shows the mindset of the leading players.
And, with the cash involved, who can really blame them?
I think it is dangerous to dismiss Australia so easily. They are a much improved side compared to last summer where issues off the field were undermining their performance on it.
DJRC said:
The Aus top six haven't looked like they have a clue what to do about them in English conditions in...we'll ever.
4 of the AUS top 6 will have toured England before and will be better equipped to handle the moving ball. In addition Haddin at 7 has (I'm sure as I don't have the figures to hand) a very good average in England.DJRC said:
Rhino Harris won't hold together for five tests, he won't even manage four.
Harris's injury problems are well known but I wouldn't assume he will be crocked. He missed the 1st test last summer but played in the remaining 4 and was the AUS top bowler. He then played all 5 tests down under.DJRC said:
And Johnson back in England? Yes please. In fact I can't wait to see Mitch bowl to Jos the Boss. Four overs, that's how long I give before he is withdrawn from the attack.
Johnson wasn't included in the 2013 tour but did play in ODIs and I thought then that he looked a different bowler. I know there are differences between the white and red balls but I think writing him off altogether is dangerous. On song, he has the potential to demolish ENG.Anyone see the home/away test stats in the Telegraph today? Amazeballs.
http://www.telegraph.co.uk/sport/cricket/internati...
http://www.telegraph.co.uk/sport/cricket/internati...
hornetrider said:
Anyone see the home/away test stats in the Telegraph today? Amazeballs.
http://www.telegraph.co.uk/sport/cricket/internati...
Amazeballs and gobsmackery united.http://www.telegraph.co.uk/sport/cricket/internati...
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