Rugby Union Autumn Internationals
Discussion
Arrgggh FFS we were clueless in that second half score line closer in the end than I expected.
Status quo continues, pack on average had it and will compete possibly come out on top against anyone. Halves had games to forget, Eastmond was very good I felt minus his charged down kick-really the pressure should have been relieved by someone else, he tackled well, looked to create some chances when it was on.
NZ are bloody good at winning ball off their own restarts, why were we constantly going for the driving maul so deep in out own half???
Onwards to next week different kind of challenge but reckon we'll be much the better from this game.
Status quo continues, pack on average had it and will compete possibly come out on top against anyone. Halves had games to forget, Eastmond was very good I felt minus his charged down kick-really the pressure should have been relieved by someone else, he tackled well, looked to create some chances when it was on.
NZ are bloody good at winning ball off their own restarts, why were we constantly going for the driving maul so deep in out own half???
Onwards to next week different kind of challenge but reckon we'll be much the better from this game.
Sensational stuff from Ireland! Huuuuge win for them, particularly when you think of the experience they were missing. They gave the Boks a hiding.
Unlike England, Ireland were able to execute a game plan and stick to it. Gona watch the Wales game back now. England against a wounded Springboks side will be interesting.....
Well done
Unlike England, Ireland were able to execute a game plan and stick to it. Gona watch the Wales game back now. England against a wounded Springboks side will be interesting.....
Well done
Almost forgot about the jocks...... Have it recorded but seen the score-good result for them with a core of Glasgow players who are playing well domestically look like they're heading in the right direction? Despite the points conceded when's the last time they had such a tally? More so against a top tier nation?
Honours even between the NH and SH sides? (I'm inc France v Fiji)
Honours even between the NH and SH sides? (I'm inc France v Fiji)
I dare say the NZ/England match would have had a bigger margin with a competent/neutral ref, Owens had a shocker! The better team won, but he did his best to spoil an otherwise good game of rugby.
Giving a yellow card directly against the recommendation of the TMO? Awarding a try right in front of him and then deciding to review it a minute later because the crowd were booing? Cynical offside play prevents a certain try and all he gives is a penalty? Whitelock's disallowed try looked sound to me too, the ball was on the line and there was downward pressure before it bounced forward. The TV never showed what that last penalty try was for either, did your coverage show it?
Giving a yellow card directly against the recommendation of the TMO? Awarding a try right in front of him and then deciding to review it a minute later because the crowd were booing? Cynical offside play prevents a certain try and all he gives is a penalty? Whitelock's disallowed try looked sound to me too, the ball was on the line and there was downward pressure before it bounced forward. The TV never showed what that last penalty try was for either, did your coverage show it?
Edited by GravelBen on Sunday 9th November 04:29
The last one try was delib collapsing scrum, third in a row I think?
Owen F had his worst game for England I think I've seen - his lack of game time exposed. Mike Brown likewise his worst game for England.
Up front I think England were v v good, Dave Attwell almost singlehandhly took the Blacks lineout apart, when did anyone last see the ABs lose two of their own lineouts consecutively? We had go forward every time but a lot was in the wrong part of the pitch due to some lousy kicking.
The Blacks won that match with superb game management , kicking England exactly where they wanted them. England lacked the ability to do anything about it for 30mins in the second half.
Owen F had his worst game for England I think I've seen - his lack of game time exposed. Mike Brown likewise his worst game for England.
Up front I think England were v v good, Dave Attwell almost singlehandhly took the Blacks lineout apart, when did anyone last see the ABs lose two of their own lineouts consecutively? We had go forward every time but a lot was in the wrong part of the pitch due to some lousy kicking.
The Blacks won that match with superb game management , kicking England exactly where they wanted them. England lacked the ability to do anything about it for 30mins in the second half.
GravelBen said:
I dare say the NZ/England match would have had a bigger margin with a competent/neutral ref, Owens had a shocker! The better team won, but he did his best to spoil an otherwise good game of rugby.
Yes, he continually missed Richie McCaw laying off side, handling the ball in the ruck off his feet and from the side, standing up in the way of the England scrum half and other numerous New Zealand infringements. 
NZ should have won by a bigger margin the place kicking was shocking at times. The thing that was worrying for me is when Coles went off you'd have never have know NZ were a man down and it did nothing to relieve the pressure England had put on themselves.
DJRC said:
The last one try was delib collapsing scrum, third in a row I think?
Owen F had his worst game for England I think I've seen - his lack of game time exposed. Mike Brown likewise his worst game for England.
Up front I think England were v v good, Dave Attwell almost singlehandhly took the Blacks lineout apart, when did anyone last see the ABs lose two of their own lineouts consecutively? We had go forward every time but a lot was in the wrong part of the pitch due to some lousy kicking.
The Blacks won that match with superb game management , kicking England exactly where they wanted them. England lacked the ability to do anything about it for 30mins in the second half.
Agree. May be slightly controversial but I'd think we need to see someone else at 6. Tom Wood got pinged a few times yesterday and I think we need someone capable of doing more carrying. The thing is Wood plays 7 for his club and Robshaw 6 and once upon a time both looked very promising in their positions. The Robshaw debate has been done to death he had his usually consistent performance yesterday and outplayed McCaw in the first half. With two decent lineout locks in Woods lineout option isn't as necessary. We don't seem to be able to capitalise when the forwards are on the front as one is taking decent running lines. I think JL is worth a look at 6 when he's back from injury, does what Wood does only better. When you look at what Jerome Kaino does for NZ we need something along those lines. BV didn't have his best game yesterday.Owen F had his worst game for England I think I've seen - his lack of game time exposed. Mike Brown likewise his worst game for England.
Up front I think England were v v good, Dave Attwell almost singlehandhly took the Blacks lineout apart, when did anyone last see the ABs lose two of their own lineouts consecutively? We had go forward every time but a lot was in the wrong part of the pitch due to some lousy kicking.
The Blacks won that match with superb game management , kicking England exactly where they wanted them. England lacked the ability to do anything about it for 30mins in the second half.
We're past the point of no return with OF at 10. Lancaster has virtually built his team around him so no one else has had a bloody look in. It's a if they've wanted a Wilkinson clone, place kicking strong on defence, OK distributing skills. However he doesn't have the rugby brain/nonce of JW. Ford seems fragile defensively, which is one thing OF isn't. Cipriani is used to playing behind a pack that comes under pressure and so his tactical kicking needs to be good and is far better than Farrell's. We need to bring our wings in more, but I wonder if we have the skillset to play such a game, evident in not being able to score when it's on.
Speaking of JW, we were watching half time yesterday and my wife suddenly said "Since when was Jonny built like a bouncer?"
Also watched Eng v NZ from 2003 on TV a cpl of days ago and a crunching tackle on Jerry Collins by Wilko, put Collins on his back five yards behind where Wilko tackled him. Made me smile for the old days
Also watched Eng v NZ from 2003 on TV a cpl of days ago and a crunching tackle on Jerry Collins by Wilko, put Collins on his back five yards behind where Wilko tackled him. Made me smile for the old days
GravelBen said:
Whitelock's disallowed try looked sound to me too, the ball was on the line and there was downward pressure before it bounced forward. The TV never showed what that last penalty try was for either, did your coverage show it?
Didn't look a try from the replays I saw - looked to me as if he knocked it over the line and didn't have downward pressure.Edited by GravelBen on Sunday 9th November 04:29
epom said:
V8 Fettler said:
The Irish 2nd team must have played quite well to defeat the Springboks.
They did, they did managed to have a few pints on the back of it tleefox said:
Didn't look a try from the replays I saw - looked to me as if he knocked it over the line and didn't have downward pressure.
It was already on the line, his hand landed on top of it as he dived - I can't find a clip on youtube but from memory you could see the ball rotate backwards as it bounces forwards, which it wouldn't do without some downward pressure on the rear half of it.I don't see how you can dive onto a ball already on the ground and knock it forward without applying any downward pressure as you hit it?
As I understand the rules (I may be wrong) the ball doesn't have to be controlled after the grounding, which to me occurred as soon as his hand landed on it. His hand would have had to hit the ground in front of the ball and then bounce upwards into the front of it to knock it forward without downward pressure, which isn't how I saw the movement.
I was less annoyed by calls that I disagreed with (you get a few of those in any game) than how obviously he was letting himself be swayed by the crowd and the repeated big-screen replays of anything the tv producer perceived as an AB infringement and wanted him to see.
Vocal Minority said:
Can someone explain to me how that disallowed try was not coming in at the side (genuine question). I know Danny Car had prodded the ball with his finger - but when I have played (not at this level, clearly) refs have always told me 2 hands on = ball played
I'm no expert either, I had to look it up...Rule 16.6 "A ruck ends successfully when the ball leaves the ruck, or when the ball is on or over the goal line."
The ball was on the goal line, therefore the ruck was over and it was fair game.
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