The **BOXING** thread Vol 2

[Yiliterate]

FredClogs said:

I thought De Gale looked excellent in his bout last night (just watched it while kids covered the house in Lego). Even though he's been around for seemingly ages he's still not massively experienced in the number of fights and top level guys he's fought, I think he's still got time to improve and definitely give him a good chance against Badou Jack, just watching that one now...

Yeah, watched it yesterday. I agree with you in part mate; there were times when he looked very slick indeed. However, I'm still not completely convinced by DeGale. Now, it might be that he's feeling so comfortable - or at least is trying to cultivate an air of someone who is finding the whole experience a complete walk in the park - but once again he let someone into the fight who was eating his dust as they headed towards the latter rounds. And while many of his shots looked and sounded great, for someone who had taken a fair few flush, Medina didn't exactly look busted up and, though staggered once or twice, didn't look in massive danger of being stopped either.

This, I think, is because quite a lot of what he throws are little more than arm-punches; there's not a huge amount of weight behind them. In fairness to him, he's very adept at doing that - because his arms are exceptionally long he's able to throw shorter punches at longer distance than most fighters are able to (albeit at the expense of getting his bodyweight into them a lot of the time) and because he has very quick reactions coupled with a decent chin, he can drop his hands and throw those sorts of shot from awkward, out-of-eyeline angles. However, a fighter who's well-drilled in judging distance should be able to deal with that - indeed, that was an area Adam Booth worked on extensively with George Groves before their fight...staying out of what he called DeGale's 'mincing machine'.

Also, DeGale still doesn't seem to have shaken his old habit of spending a bit too much time sitting on the ropes. It wasn't really an issue with Medina as he didn't seem to have enough power to punish DeGale in that situation, but it could be a different story against an opponent with a real dig on him. Fortunately, I don't think that fighter is Badou Jack...but Calum Smith would be a different prospect altogether in that regard...

Edited by Yiliterate on Monday 2nd May 21:43

[tuscaneer]

lord trumpton said:

briangriffin said:

tuscaneer said:

khan has seen canelo's footwork as i mentioned earlier fella....canelo isn't any sort of crafty ring cutter ...neither is he fleet footed. his major weakness is his ploddy footwork,. he doesn't "creep" forward like a joe louis setting you up for the right hand before you even know you're in range....nor does he shift across like golovkin to pressure you into moving his way. he just sort of....well...plods forward. his punch arsenal is great...but it's useless if he is hitting thin air....but he's got 36 minutes to catch khan. and he's only got to do it once.

i'd love to think khan can focus for the full fight and pull it off but i just feel he'll get "billy conn'ed" at some point in the latter half of the fight while he's ahead on points

Basically this, This is a major weakness of Canelo's and it doesn't look to have been improved upon much either. Khan has seen the Mayweather fight and thinks he can do what Mayweather did, Khan has the speed of mayweather and more but he doesn't have that technical defensive ability which will likely be his undoing.

I don't think kahn's speed is anything like Mayweather's speed.

Kahn has fast hands, but Mayweather is in, jab and out before most opponents have ever realised what has happened.

for me it's different types of speed. mayweather has great reflexes and by nature is a counterpuncher. he'll let you come forward, make a mistake then punish you with sharp shots.....certainly a pinch faster than amir's counters.

khan as an offensive fighter and when he comes forward putting combos together he's a lot faster (in my opinion) than floyd is.

khan's style is way more exciting than floyd's ....BUT which method will be better suited to a points victory over canelo?? floyd showed us how to do it on the back foot....khan's will be a much riskier affair i think

[FredClogs]

Yiliterate said:

FredClogs said:

I thought De Gale looked excellent in his bout last night (just watched it while kids covered the house in Lego). Even though he's been around for seemingly ages he's still not massively experienced in the number of fights and top level guys he's fought, I think he's still got time to improve and definitely give him a good chance against Badou Jack, just watching that one now...

Yeah, watched it yesterday. I agree with you in part mate; there were times when he looked very slick indeed. However, I'm still not completely convinced by DeGale. Now, it might be that he's feeling so comfortable - or at least is trying to cultivate an air of someone who is finding the whole experience a complete walk in the park - but once again he let someone into the fight who was eating his dust as they headed towards the latter rounds. And while many of his shots looked and sounded great, for someone who had taken a fair few flush, Medina didn't exactly look busted up and, though staggered once or twice, didn't look in massive danger of being stopped either.

This, I think, is because quite a lot of what he throws are little more than arm-punches; there's not a huge amount of weight behind them. In fairness to him, he's very adept at doing that - because his arms are exceptionally long he's able to throw shorter punches at longer distance than most fighters are able to (albeit at the expense of getting his bodyweight into them a lot of the time) and because he has very quick reactions coupled with a decent chin, he can drop his hands and throw those sorts of shot from awkward, out-of-eyeline angles. However, a fighter who's well-drilled in judging distance should be able to deal with that - indeed, that was an area Adam Booth worked on extensively with George Groves before their fight...staying out of what he called DeGale's 'mincing machine'.

Also, DeGale still doesn't seem to have shaken his old habit of spending a bit too much time sitting on the ropes. It wasn't really an issue with Medina as he didn't seem to have enough power to punish DeGale in that situation, but it could be a different story against an opponent with a real dig on him. Fortunately, I don't think that fighter is Badou Jack...but Calum Smith would be a different prospect altogether in that regard...

Edited by Yiliterate on Monday 2nd May 21:43

I agree, I'm not sure whether De Gale is struggling physically to go the 12 rounds or it's a mental thing, I suspect the latter as he's been a top boy surrounded by the right team for a long time, although he's had his injuries I doubt his physical preparation is anything other than tip top. His movement and the way he parries combinations in and then steps back is obviously a trained thing, I think he'd love to get involved in a Froch like tear up every time he's in the ring, it's like he's got this reset glitch after every combo where he forces himself to step off the gas and go for a little dance around the ring, probably extremely sensible but I imagine it takes a fair bit of self discipline and breaks up any flow or rhythm to his work, and like you say without single punch knock out power he's going to have to force stoppages by just dominating for minutes at a time.

Like I said I watched it in a house full of busy kids with only the odd word of Jim Watteristic negativity and darkness breaking through and was quite surprised to read some comments later from De Gale and others saying it was a disappointing performance, as a casual boxing observer I never expect anyone to knock over anyone from Mexico, they're just built different from normal humans I think and after watching the Bute/Jack draw (again I only had half an eye on it) it puts De Gales job against Bute in a much better light (and Frochs destruction of the prime Bute on a real pedestal).

Calum Smith must be chomping at the bit now to get his shot, hope he can get a bit more experience first with some tougher more durable guys just for the experience, he's obviously the future of the division (although he looks pretty bit for the weight and I think he might move up - the names and possible fights over the next few years at light heavy are huge).

[Yiliterate]

To be honest, DeGale's disappointment probably stems from the fact that Badou Jack stopped that fella in six - if DeGale had blown him away inside three or four, that would have sent out a real statement...though in fairness to DeGale, it didn't really look like he was going all-out to end it early.

Truthfully, I'd quite heavily favour DeGale in a unification with Jack, but the mandatory against Calum Smith will be a properly intriguing fight. To his credit, DeGale says he'd have no qualms about fighting Smith, though I suspect his preferred situation would be for Groves to beat Murray and then quickly afterwards pick up the WBA belt, so he could look to defer the Smith fight in favour of another unification; this one huge! From Smith's perspective, I think he wouldn't be averse to waiting a little longer. Like Hearn says, he's only going to get better in the meantime...!

[tuscaneer]

i think watt and rawling were watching a different fight to me. degale was absolutely in charge throughout. how anyone had that close......HOWEVER degale's problem is definately himself. he's going to go at it at his pace and nobody elses.and that's a problem when someone in the opposite corner has got a high work rate and pressure coupled with great shot selection. that guy on saturday was so straightforward that james could get away with. against callum smith i think he'd suffocate under the pressure.

hughie fury was a damp squib......but oh my god!!!! jamie conlan versus anthony nelson was a war!!!

[130R]

I think Khan is going to get stopped and pretty easily too. He's not in the same league as Alvarez.

[tuscaneer]

I see chisora has been at it again....can't link the video as I'm writing this on my phone.....but he's gone nuts again and at the face of with pulev caused a big scuffle. I can see pulev putting it on him big time this weekend.he looked like he wanted to kill him there and then!

[Challo]

Just reading an article on Sky Sports and apparently Kahn is calling out Mayweather saying the fight has to happen? Does Kahn really think a) he is in the same class as Mayweather? B) mayweather wants to fight again? C) big enough pull in terms ticket sales and that he deserves a shot?

Surely Kahn is after a payday.

[Leroy902]

Challo said:

Just reading an article on Sky Sports and apparently Kahn is calling out Mayweather saying the fight has to happen? Does Kahn really think a) he is in the same class as Mayweather? B) mayweather wants to fight again? C) big enough pull in terms ticket sales and that he deserves a shot?

Surely Kahn is after a payday.

It's KHAN mate KHAN.

[Yiliterate]

Challo said:

Just reading an article on Sky Sports and apparently Kahn is calling out Mayweather saying the fight has to happen? Does Kahn really think a) he is in the same class as Mayweather? B) mayweather wants to fight again? C) big enough pull in terms ticket sales and that he deserves a shot?

Surely Kahn is after a payday.

Horrible feeling of deja vu, but here goes:

a) Being 49-0 and with his CV means nobody is in Mayweather's class. And of the other leading p4p fighters, none are plying their trade at or around 147lbs (Chocolatito, Rigo, Lomachencko, GGG, Ward, Kovalev...probably a year or two early to be putting Crawford or Spence Jr. in the frame). That doesn't mean though that Khan doesn't have the tools to pose some serious problems for Mayweather. So yes, Khan will have belief that he can upset the odds...and I daresay Mayweather takes that threat seriously as well.
b) Maybe he does and maybe he doesn't - but while there's a possibility, what harm is there in Khan putting his name in the frame? Just as long as he doesn't ps away more of his career being strung along by Mayweather...
c) Khan is already a very good ticket seller - beat Canelo and he'd be massive. The only other fighters likely to be an equal or greater draw in and around Welterweight/Light-Middleweight would be Canelo, Pacquiao and maybe Cotto (all three of them having already lost to Mayweather incidentally). Also, beat Canelo and he would have 'earned' his shot as much as anyone else out there, other than maybe Pacquiao with his win over Bradley.

And yes, I'm sure a pay-day would also be very welcome...

[tuscaneer]

Yiliterate said:

Challo said:

Just reading an article on Sky Sports and apparently Kahn is calling out Mayweather saying the fight has to happen? Does Kahn really think a) he is in the same class as Mayweather? B) mayweather wants to fight again? C) big enough pull in terms ticket sales and that he deserves a shot?

Surely Kahn is after a payday.

Horrible feeling of deja vu, but here goes:

a) Being 49-0 and with his CV means nobody is in Mayweather's class. And of the other leading p4p fighters, none are plying their trade at or around 147lbs (Chocolatito, Rigo, Lomachencko, GGG, Ward, Kovalev...probably a year or two early to be putting Crawford or Spence Jr. in the frame). That doesn't mean though that Khan doesn't have the tools to pose some serious problems for Mayweather. So yes, Khan will have belief that he can upset the odds...and I daresay Mayweather takes that threat seriously as well.
b) Maybe he does and maybe he doesn't - but while there's a possibility, what harm is there in Khan putting his name in the frame? Just as long as he doesn't ps away more of his career being strung along by Mayweather...
c) Khan is already a very good ticket seller - beat Canelo and he'd be massive. The only other fighters likely to be an equal or greater draw in and around Welterweight/Light-Middleweight would be Canelo, Pacquiao and maybe Cotto (all three of them having already lost to Mayweather incidentally). Also, beat Canelo and he would have 'earned' his shot as much as anyone else out there, other than maybe Pacquiao with his win over Bradley.

And yes, I'm sure a pay-day would also be very welcome...

i think khan has been one of floyd's leading contenders in terms of being one of the most dangerous opponents for some time.take the pacquiao fight out of the equation and look at floyd's last few fights.....

berto, maidana(x2) , canelo , guerrero , cotto , ortiz and mosley.

khan wipes the floor with berto, did wipe the floor with maidana , canelo we'll see , he'd beat guerrero handily as would he have beaten an ancient mosley and mediocre ortiz.

i don't see size as being an issue in any of those fights, so out of mayweather's last 8 fights spanning 6 or 7 years you can make a case that khan could have beaten every one of the guys in the other corner.

it was around 2009 that i feel khan was coming into his prime....i think recently he's looking better than ever....


now you could argue that i'm talking ste and you don't agree but if maidana is good enough to give mayweather hell 3 or 4 years after khan had had his way with him.......well i think that's enough justification for floyd to have given khan a fight

[FredClogs]

Challo said:

Just reading an article on Sky Sports and apparently Kahn is calling out Mayweather saying the fight has to happen? Does Kahn really think a) he is in the same class as Mayweather? B) mayweather wants to fight again? C) big enough pull in terms ticket sales and that he deserves a shot?

Surely Kahn is after a payday.

The BBC are reporting Khan saying he has decided that after all the arsing around he did trying to get Mayweather in the ring he would NOT entertain it now.

Mayweather ducked Khan, it's a simple as that for me. Whether Khan would have beaten him is a open sporting question, he would have certainly tried.

BBC also reporting Khan is saying he'd be interested in doing some MMA bouts, he owns a big share in an Indian MMA promotion, does some cross training and reckons he'd be good at it...

I don't believe anything I read or that boxers say in the run up to fights.

[lionelf]

tuscaneer said:

it was around 2009 that i feel khan was coming into his prime....i think recently he's looking better than ever

I completely agree, so much so that I think the Alvarez fight is 50/50.

[Challo]

Cheers for the information, and apologies for the misspelling of Khan, been a long day. Interesting to read that about Khan, as i like to watch boxing but only really watched the UK based fighters on Sky Sports so not kept up with how Khan has been doing.

I just remember him showing promise, but then got knocked out and showed he didn't have a good chin. I will certainly keep an out for the result of his next match and see how he gets on.

[tuscaneer]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1CarUot7BJM


ructions!


so, the winner gets a shot at joshua's ibf belt......

[tuscaneer]

.....and that winner will be kubrat pulev!!

[lord trumpton]

Challo said:

Just reading an article on Sky Sports and apparently Kahn is calling out Mayweather saying the fight has to happen? Does Kahn really think a) he is in the same class as Mayweather? B) mayweather wants to fight again? C) big enough pull in terms ticket sales and that he deserves a shot?

Surely Kahn is after a payday.

It will never happen.... the long planned and agreed upfront (imho) rematch hype is starting to wake up. It's always been on the cards.

https://uk.sports.yahoo.com/news/floyd-mayweather-...

[Yiliterate]

tuscaneer said:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1CarUot7BJM


ructions!


so, the winner gets a shot at joshua's ibf belt......

I think there must be something about being in Germany that angries up the blood in young Dereck!

Think Pulev would be a great fight for Joshua, but I suspect in an ideal world they'd prefer that to be an early 2017 fight (I.e. allowing for one more fight after Breazeale before mixing it with the real top tier in the division).

[FredClogs]

Dereck really shot his load too early in his career with the spitting water in Vlads face incident and threatening to bottle Haye, any pre fight scuffles and presser daftness from there is always going to fall short.

[soad]

FredClogs said:

Dereck really shot his load too early in his career with the spitting water in Vlads face incident and threatening to bottle shoot Haye, any pre fight scuffles and presser daftness from there is always going to fall short.

EFA. Chisora accused Haye of "glassing him", not the other way round.