The Running Thread Vol 2
Discussion
Smitters said:
So I won an entry into the Edinburgh Marathon Festival from Running Heroes. It's pretty vague, but I think this means I've won an entry into the marathon. I was planning a trail marathon in early May. Do I up the ante and go for a pb on the road? I'd have to cannonball it Saturday night and Sunday afternoon as it's May BH, as I'm not paying £1000 to fly and house the OH and MicroSmitters while I jog about in Scotland.
Hmmm. Decisions.
It may not be possible as it's a prize but i'll easily take the entry! I'm on the reserve list on running heroes for this prize but still doesn't mean i'll get it...! Im up in Aberdeen so handy for me!Hmmm. Decisions.
Edited by Smitters on Tuesday 21st February 11:56
tenohfive said:
Ultra runners - race day food question:
What do you take that isn't sugary to break up the endless, sickly sweet monotony of gels and powerbars but which still pack a good calorie/carb to weight punch?
During my last one it was a real chore at the end to force another gel down my throat (despite having bars, shots, gels and sweets) so I'm thinking about taking a couple of savoury options along as a treat for longer events. Caveat being that they need to be a) moist enough to neck on the go, b) high carb, c) lightweight-ish and d) easily packaged/non-messy to consume. Any pre-made products or home-made recipes that you use?
A friend who has done ultras, triple ironmans, etc. pretty much eats whatever stays down. I think at one event his support team went off to McDonalds for breakfast and he was snacking on a few hash browns each lap. It really doesnt matter as long as something is going in.What do you take that isn't sugary to break up the endless, sickly sweet monotony of gels and powerbars but which still pack a good calorie/carb to weight punch?
During my last one it was a real chore at the end to force another gel down my throat (despite having bars, shots, gels and sweets) so I'm thinking about taking a couple of savoury options along as a treat for longer events. Caveat being that they need to be a) moist enough to neck on the go, b) high carb, c) lightweight-ish and d) easily packaged/non-messy to consume. Any pre-made products or home-made recipes that you use?
Edited by tenohfive on Tuesday 21st February 20:52
KTF said:
tenohfive said:
Ultra runners - race day food question:
What do you take that isn't sugary to break up the endless, sickly sweet monotony of gels and powerbars but which still pack a good calorie/carb to weight punch?
During my last one it was a real chore at the end to force another gel down my throat (despite having bars, shots, gels and sweets) so I'm thinking about taking a couple of savoury options along as a treat for longer events. Caveat being that they need to be a) moist enough to neck on the go, b) high carb, c) lightweight-ish and d) easily packaged/non-messy to consume. Any pre-made products or home-made recipes that you use?
A friend who has done ultras, triple ironmans, etc. pretty much eats whatever stays down. I think at one event his support team went off to McDonalds for breakfast and he was snacking on a few hash browns each lap. It really doesnt matter as long as something is going in.What do you take that isn't sugary to break up the endless, sickly sweet monotony of gels and powerbars but which still pack a good calorie/carb to weight punch?
During my last one it was a real chore at the end to force another gel down my throat (despite having bars, shots, gels and sweets) so I'm thinking about taking a couple of savoury options along as a treat for longer events. Caveat being that they need to be a) moist enough to neck on the go, b) high carb, c) lightweight-ish and d) easily packaged/non-messy to consume. Any pre-made products or home-made recipes that you use?
Edited by tenohfive on Tuesday 21st February 20:52
tenohfive said:
Ultra runners - race day food question:
What do you take that isn't sugary to break up the endless, sickly sweet monotony of gels and powerbars but which still pack a good calorie/carb to weight punch?
During my last one it was a real chore at the end to force another gel down my throat (despite having bars, shots, gels and sweets) so I'm thinking about taking a couple of savoury options along as a treat for longer events. Caveat being that they need to be a) moist enough to neck on the go, b) high carb, c) lightweight-ish and d) easily packaged/non-messy to consume. Any pre-made products or home-made recipes that you use?
Seen this recommended a lotWhat do you take that isn't sugary to break up the endless, sickly sweet monotony of gels and powerbars but which still pack a good calorie/carb to weight punch?
During my last one it was a real chore at the end to force another gel down my throat (despite having bars, shots, gels and sweets) so I'm thinking about taking a couple of savoury options along as a treat for longer events. Caveat being that they need to be a) moist enough to neck on the go, b) high carb, c) lightweight-ish and d) easily packaged/non-messy to consume. Any pre-made products or home-made recipes that you use?
Edited by tenohfive on Tuesday 21st February 20:52
http://www.tailwindnutrition.com/
tenohfive said:
Ultra runners - race day food question:
What do you take that isn't sugary to break up the endless, sickly sweet monotony of gels and powerbars but which still pack a good calorie/carb to weight punch?
During my last one it was a real chore at the end to force another gel down my throat (despite having bars, shots, gels and sweets) so I'm thinking about taking a couple of savoury options along as a treat for longer events. Caveat being that they need to be a) moist enough to neck on the go, b) high carb, c) lightweight-ish and d) easily packaged/non-messy to consume. Any pre-made products or home-made recipes that you use?
Seen this recommended a lotWhat do you take that isn't sugary to break up the endless, sickly sweet monotony of gels and powerbars but which still pack a good calorie/carb to weight punch?
During my last one it was a real chore at the end to force another gel down my throat (despite having bars, shots, gels and sweets) so I'm thinking about taking a couple of savoury options along as a treat for longer events. Caveat being that they need to be a) moist enough to neck on the go, b) high carb, c) lightweight-ish and d) easily packaged/non-messy to consume. Any pre-made products or home-made recipes that you use?
Edited by tenohfive on Tuesday 21st February 20:52
http://www.tailwindnutrition.com/
Smitters said:
KTF said:
tenohfive said:
Ultra runners - race day food question:
What do you take that isn't sugary to break up the endless, sickly sweet monotony of gels and powerbars but which still pack a good calorie/carb to weight punch?
During my last one it was a real chore at the end to force another gel down my throat (despite having bars, shots, gels and sweets) so I'm thinking about taking a couple of savoury options along as a treat for longer events. Caveat being that they need to be a) moist enough to neck on the go, b) high carb, c) lightweight-ish and d) easily packaged/non-messy to consume. Any pre-made products or home-made recipes that you use?
A friend who has done ultras, triple ironmans, etc. pretty much eats whatever stays down. I think at one event his support team went off to McDonalds for breakfast and he was snacking on a few hash browns each lap. It really doesnt matter as long as something is going in.What do you take that isn't sugary to break up the endless, sickly sweet monotony of gels and powerbars but which still pack a good calorie/carb to weight punch?
During my last one it was a real chore at the end to force another gel down my throat (despite having bars, shots, gels and sweets) so I'm thinking about taking a couple of savoury options along as a treat for longer events. Caveat being that they need to be a) moist enough to neck on the go, b) high carb, c) lightweight-ish and d) easily packaged/non-messy to consume. Any pre-made products or home-made recipes that you use?
Edited by tenohfive on Tuesday 21st February 20:52
If I want a sweet snack I go with peanut M&Ms
I avoid gels at all costs
KTF said:
Smitters said:
necking olive oil
People actually do this at ultras or similar? That sounds grim.Jurek was searching for ways to carry calories in the most efficient way possible and writes about experimenting, citing olive oil as one of his less successful ideas!
Smitters said:
I'd agree - anything you can stomach. I think there comes a point where moral is important and having stuff you like is more important than out and out performance food. I have found pepperamis good, salted cashews or peanuts too. I've avoided bread/sandwiches as it needs a bit too much moisture from the mouth, but have gone down the pastry route with ginsters slices. I've found little and often and variety is the key, as is decanting stuff into zipseal bags to make them more portable/less messy. I've tried homemade peanut butter and protein balls, but they get a bit sticky in the heat and also cling to the roof of your mouth a bit. I've heard good things about Tailwind too, but that may be too sweet and tbh, I've not tried it. The eternal search for the highest calories/gram goes on, though I read Scott Jurek's book and he doesn't recommend necking olive oil... unless you really want to see those gels again soon.
Great advice, same principle for me - something at 300kcal is better than something at 500kcal on the packet that weighs the same yet actually gives you 0kcal as you can't get it down. I like (savoury) slices of saucison, bits of parmesan, nuts (v high kcal vs grm), baby bel,; sweet-wise stuff like Tangfastics, wine gums, semi-dried fig/apricot, and rice pudding/custard/jelly if you've got drop-bag points. There is the carb vs fat thing also to bear in mind I suppose, and also how you treat your drink (water, isotonic, 'rego', tailwind etc) - I tend to stick to water, but will use coke/beer if you have drop bags.
I stick with water and electrolyte tabs - I decided awhile ago to separate out hydration from nutrition.
The sorts of events I've signed up for are largely self supported with limited access to drop bags (maybe once every 6 hours or so I think) so I need to be pretty clever about it. Weight for weight Wiggle's own brand energy bars are right up there, Powergel Powershots and Gu energy gels all also being in a similar ball park. And I like them all - for about the first 5 hours or so anyway. (The Powershots are just like pick'n'mix sweets, but easier to get down.)
Nuts and sausage-style meats sound look a good shout. And not mentioned here but Bounce balls look interesting. I've also come across a recipe for sweet potato brownies which bears further examination, and I burned my first effort at pinole yesterday. I'll have another mooch through Jurek's recipes for any ideas - most of his stuff seemed overly complicated though from what I remember, requiring all sorts of specialist wholefoods that I just CBA bothering with.
The sorts of events I've signed up for are largely self supported with limited access to drop bags (maybe once every 6 hours or so I think) so I need to be pretty clever about it. Weight for weight Wiggle's own brand energy bars are right up there, Powergel Powershots and Gu energy gels all also being in a similar ball park. And I like them all - for about the first 5 hours or so anyway. (The Powershots are just like pick'n'mix sweets, but easier to get down.)
Nuts and sausage-style meats sound look a good shout. And not mentioned here but Bounce balls look interesting. I've also come across a recipe for sweet potato brownies which bears further examination, and I burned my first effort at pinole yesterday. I'll have another mooch through Jurek's recipes for any ideas - most of his stuff seemed overly complicated though from what I remember, requiring all sorts of specialist wholefoods that I just CBA bothering with.
AbzST64 said:
Smitters said:
So I won an entry into the Edinburgh Marathon Festival from Running Heroes. It's pretty vague, but I think this means I've won an entry into the marathon. I was planning a trail marathon in early May. Do I up the ante and go for a pb on the road? I'd have to cannonball it Saturday night and Sunday afternoon as it's May BH, as I'm not paying £1000 to fly and house the OH and MicroSmitters while I jog about in Scotland.
Hmmm. Decisions.
It may not be possible as it's a prize but i'll easily take the entry! I'm on the reserve list on running heroes for this prize but still doesn't mean i'll get it...! Im up in Aberdeen so handy for me!Hmmm. Decisions.
Edited by Smitters on Tuesday 21st February 11:56
At this point you can enter any details you like so in theory you can pass the prize on (although it should be returned to the pool and drawn again). I very much doubt running heroes go through and check who has entered.
For the bath half prize I won, the code for free entry was still working even after I had entered so others could have used it as well.
tenohfive said:
I stick with water and electrolyte tabs - I decided awhile ago to separate out hydration from nutrition.
The sorts of events I've signed up for are largely self supported with limited access to drop bags (maybe once every 6 hours or so I think) so I need to be pretty clever about it. Weight for weight Wiggle's own brand energy bars are right up there, Powergel Powershots and Gu energy gels all also being in a similar ball park. And I like them all - for about the first 5 hours or so anyway. (The Powershots are just like pick'n'mix sweets, but easier to get down.)
Nuts and sausage-style meats sound look a good shout. And not mentioned here but Bounce balls look interesting. I've also come across a recipe for sweet potato brownies which bears further examination, and I burned my first effort at pinole yesterday. I'll have another mooch through Jurek's recipes for any ideas - most of his stuff seemed overly complicated though from what I remember, requiring all sorts of specialist wholefoods that I just CBA bothering with.
Fair enough on hydration and nutrition. I have done the same, principally because I wanted the zerocal tabs that make bottles reuseable day after day without getting horrifically grotty. But I never managed to get myself to multiday level, so I'm considering going back to caloried tabs, because you can carry a tab that has calories for the same weight of one that doesn't, which does your minimalist requirements. I'm considering it just to add variation to calorie intake when I race later this year.The sorts of events I've signed up for are largely self supported with limited access to drop bags (maybe once every 6 hours or so I think) so I need to be pretty clever about it. Weight for weight Wiggle's own brand energy bars are right up there, Powergel Powershots and Gu energy gels all also being in a similar ball park. And I like them all - for about the first 5 hours or so anyway. (The Powershots are just like pick'n'mix sweets, but easier to get down.)
Nuts and sausage-style meats sound look a good shout. And not mentioned here but Bounce balls look interesting. I've also come across a recipe for sweet potato brownies which bears further examination, and I burned my first effort at pinole yesterday. I'll have another mooch through Jurek's recipes for any ideas - most of his stuff seemed overly complicated though from what I remember, requiring all sorts of specialist wholefoods that I just CBA bothering with.
You're right on the Jurek recipes - a lot require some fairly non-standard ingredients. I tried some home made energy bars using chia seeds and the like, but never managed to make anything I felt was as palatable as shop bought or which had better energy delivery to make up for the taste. If you hit on a winning formula, please do share! I am lucky in that my race is laps, so I can grab stuff from a tent every 9km.
Having done the Knacker Cracker at new year, I'm now on Trionium's mailing list.
Half tempted to give this a go next year, I'd need to do some dedicated training though, I do occasionally suffer from some back trouble and my wife is 80kgs
http://www.trionium.com/wife/
I particularly like the line about time penalties for dropping the wife...I don't think that would be the only penalty
Half tempted to give this a go next year, I'd need to do some dedicated training though, I do occasionally suffer from some back trouble and my wife is 80kgs
http://www.trionium.com/wife/
I particularly like the line about time penalties for dropping the wife...I don't think that would be the only penalty
Edited by RizzoTheRat on Thursday 23 February 21:49
johnwilliams77 said:
tenohfive said:
Ultra runners - race day food question
Seen this recommended a lothttp://www.tailwindnutrition.com/
Otherwise for me:
Chia Charge bars
Flapjacks
Eat Natural Dark Chocolate bars
Gels sometimes in the last 10k or so but rarely before
Last July I did a 100-miler pretty much solely on a small tub of houmous, a couple of orange segments every few miles (lapped course so no need to carry them), about 3 litres of chocolate milk and one slice of dominos pizza!
Anyone watched the Barkley Marathons documentary (its on Netflix)? Great watch, proper nutters and I love the whole ethos ($1.60 entry fee!), the organiser was a great chap.
Couldn't even process doing one 20-25 mile lap with 12,000ft ascent, let alone 5 in 60 hours. Pretty incredible, the first few guys who completed it were still running at the end!
Couldn't even process doing one 20-25 mile lap with 12,000ft ascent, let alone 5 in 60 hours. Pretty incredible, the first few guys who completed it were still running at the end!
ukaskew said:
Anyone watched the Barkley Marathons documentary (its on Netflix)? Great watch, proper nutters and I love the whole ethos ($1.60 entry fee!), the organiser was a great chap.
Couldn't even process doing one 20-25 mile lap with 12,000ft ascent, let alone 5 in 60 hours. Pretty incredible, the first few guys who completed it were still running at the end!
Yes, seen it and loved it. It's a very different running community and it's only 5 hours drive from where I live and that terrain is total wilderness. It's run by an eccentric and I love the "we have 1 person who has no right to be here". So few people have accomplished it and I run with someone who regularly enters, but has not yet made the cut (he jogged a hilly sub 3 marathon as part of his ultra training a few weeks ago, the day after a quick 14 mile run) He spoke with someone who has done it and it's so brutal that only the mentally tough even get to 1 lap.... and very few complete the "fun run". Couldn't even process doing one 20-25 mile lap with 12,000ft ascent, let alone 5 in 60 hours. Pretty incredible, the first few guys who completed it were still running at the end!
Running gods, I come to you seeking guidance.
My work load make training a bugger, I have a lot of work to do during the summer and by November I'm a wreck.
I've signed up to Brentwood Half and have been training. Running club Monday, Pilates Tuesday, speed session at running club Wednesday, normally a run on a Thursday and a long run Saturday which will be 25km this weekend over the Olympic mountain bike course ready for Orion 15 with occasional 5 mile cross countries on a Sunday.
My PR PB is 17:54 and I did 18:04 on Christmas Eve.
Not done a half for several years and have only done 2 anyway, PB is 1:31.??
I'm not sure how to pace this half. It must be under 1:30. Tonight I did 14.79k at 4:12/km average pace, which includes warming up and stopping for a couple of minutes to chat with a friend. There were 7 consecutive kms at around 3:56 pace, but I doubt I can hold on for 21km.
I'm a bit of a bugger for starting too fast, so holding back is hard. I'm thinkings 4:15-4:12 for the first 10 then see if I can crank it up and end with a possible sprint finish with possible finish line pukage.
Over to the more experienced half marathon runners.
Thanks.
My work load make training a bugger, I have a lot of work to do during the summer and by November I'm a wreck.
I've signed up to Brentwood Half and have been training. Running club Monday, Pilates Tuesday, speed session at running club Wednesday, normally a run on a Thursday and a long run Saturday which will be 25km this weekend over the Olympic mountain bike course ready for Orion 15 with occasional 5 mile cross countries on a Sunday.
My PR PB is 17:54 and I did 18:04 on Christmas Eve.
Not done a half for several years and have only done 2 anyway, PB is 1:31.??
I'm not sure how to pace this half. It must be under 1:30. Tonight I did 14.79k at 4:12/km average pace, which includes warming up and stopping for a couple of minutes to chat with a friend. There were 7 consecutive kms at around 3:56 pace, but I doubt I can hold on for 21km.
I'm a bit of a bugger for starting too fast, so holding back is hard. I'm thinkings 4:15-4:12 for the first 10 then see if I can crank it up and end with a possible sprint finish with possible finish line pukage.
Over to the more experienced half marathon runners.
Thanks.
Willy Nilly - With that 5k time, you are much closer to a 1:20 - 1:22 than a 1:30 pace. Only you know how you feel and how the training has gone/will go but I would set out at 6:25 per mile and see if you can get quicker in the last half of the race.
the challenge will be speed endurance, so any tempo runs you've done or any long runs will contribute, but you have good basic speed
the challenge will be speed endurance, so any tempo runs you've done or any long runs will contribute, but you have good basic speed
Gassing Station | Sports | Top of Page | What's New | My Stuff