Wiggins - could this be a Similar issue as Lance A ?

[Magic919]

It's like the witch test that involved drowning.

[okgo]

el stovey said:

A lot of hysterics on this thread.

How can they be "worse than Armstrong". Armstrong was doping. SKY have been using exemptions. It's the exemption that makes it legal. If SKY hadn't got the exemption, they wouldn't be using the substances at all.

Thousands of athletes are legally using exemptions all around the world. It's totally different from doping and what Armstrong was doing.

There's all manner of loose ends and grubby stories that need to be dealt with but using an exemption is completely different to doping.

As an aside, football is full of doping also, there's much more rotten things going on in football than diving. there's just a lack of willingness to address any of it.

It rather depends how said person went about getting that TUE. It IS an illegal drug, and if the TUE was granted for false reasons, then its doping, plain and simple.

[johnxjsc1985]

okgo said:

It rather depends how said person went about getting that TUE. It IS an illegal drug, and if the TUE was granted for false reasons, then its doping, plain and simple.

then the Doctor who prescribed it could be in real trouble not just a 12 month ban.

[anonymous-user]

johnxjsc1985 said:

48Valves said:

Working with some keen cyclists as I do. It amuses me greatly that keen road cyclists will bang on about cheating diving footballers. But defend drugs cheat pro cyclists till they are blue in the face.

SIreland Brad and Sir Dave are worse than Armstrong in my opinion given their rhetoric on his case.

you clearly have no idea who Lance Armstrong is or what he did.
we now have Putin declaring athletes with TUE's should not compete with those who don't.
There is a bigger picture here and State Sponsored Doping isn't even being discussed.

Edited by johnxjsc1985 on Wednesday 12th October 09:32

I'm sure the State Spinsored Doping is still on the radar. Russia have been punished for that. But as usual Putin has backed the right horse, it's hard to argue against the fact that something very fishy has been uncovered. I'm surprised Russia were not a bit more in the ball, should have taken Sky's lead with legal drugs!

[tertius]

johnxjsc1985 said:

okgo said:

It rather depends how said person went about getting that TUE. It IS an illegal drug, and if the TUE was granted for false reasons, then its doping, plain and simple.

then the Doctor who prescribed it could be in real trouble not just a 12 month ban.

I'd love to know what the actual process for requesting and approving a TUE is, for example:

1. Who raises the initial request (athlete/athlete's doctor/team/team doctor/other)?
2. Who reviews/approves it before it is submitted?
3. Who actually grants it (national body/WADA/both/other steps or approvers)?
4. Does a doctor/medic on behalf of the approving party actually see the athlete in question?

Etc..

[okgo]

There was a parcel - http://www.cyclingnews.com/news/cope-i-dont-know-w...

lmao that you would travel all the way to another country to deliver something as trivial as pedals. Come on, what was in there guys...

[Dr Imran T]

I think whatever the final outcome may prove, the reputation of Sky, Wiggins & Brailsford has been damaged.

I'd be interested to hear the Rhetoric of team Sky in next seasons grand tours/races etc. I'm not sure they will preach the same nonsense in fear of a backlash.

[_Neal_]

Dr Imran T said:

I think whatever the final outcome may prove, the reputation of Sky, Wiggins & Brailsford has been damaged.

I'd be interested to hear the Rhetoric of team Sky in next seasons grand tours/races etc. I'm not sure they will preach the same nonsense in fear of a backlash.

Indeed. And will there be any anti-Wiggins sentiment at 6 Day London?

[anonymous-user]

Dr Imran T said:

I think whatever the final outcome may prove, the reputation of Sky, Wiggins & Brailsford has been damaged.

I'd be interested to hear the Rhetoric of team Sky in next seasons grand tours/races etc. I'm not sure they will preach the same nonsense in fear of a backlash.

I wondered this too. Assuming SKY stay in cycling and the lottery money keeps flowing GB cycling will continue to dominate and encourage young riders to take up cycling. A kind of virtuous circle with perhaps less exemptions and finger pointing at the cheating foreigners?

[johnxjsc1985]

_Neal_ said:

Indeed. And will there be any anti-Wiggins sentiment at 6 Day London?

people going to watch Bradley Wiggins will not be going to boo him.

[WestyCarl]

Dr Imran T said:

I think whatever the final outcome may prove, the reputation of Sky, Wiggins & Brailsford has been damaged.

I'd be interested to hear the Rhetoric of team Sky in next seasons grand tours/races etc. I'm not sure they will preach the same nonsense in fear of a backlash.

I'm guessing Sky will be cleared after all it's up to the governing body to approve TUE's, SKY just propose them.

Then SKY will have the usual "learnt lessons" will do things differently, etc. (as they did after their 1st season)

The whole cycling circus will continue with very little change until the next time when "they'll do it differently" again............

[johnxjsc1985]

WestyCarl said:

I'm guessing Sky will be cleared after all it's up to the governing body to approve TUE's, SKY just propose them.

Then SKY will have the usual "learnt lessons" will do things differently, etc. (as they did after their 1st season)

The whole cycling circus will continue with very little change until the next time when "they'll do it differently" again............

Drugs have been part of Cycling for so long now I believe after the second World war Tonedron was available and was one of the drugs of choice having been used by fighter pilots to stay alert and ready.
Now blood doping is rife and the development of using the body to perform better is making it so difficult for them to be caught. I really don't know what the answer is .
this is the ultimate sanction for a rider who takes drugs

Edited by johnxjsc1985 on Thursday 13th October 17:21

[mcelliott]

Any yet, with all the history of the sport, and people who have an intimate knowledge of it, Sky came out with the rounder wheels, fluffy pillows crap, and we were supposed to believe it. Those who questioned it from the outset were seen as total st stirrers - I'm glad all of this has come out into the open and people are having a grown up discussion about it.

[johnxjsc1985]

maybe the idea of racing for 4 or 5 or even 6 hours a day for 21 days some of it up Mountains is just too much for the human body to take.

[Magic919]

Yeah, all that warming up and cooling down rubbish.

[funkyrobot]

johnxjsc1985 said:

maybe the idea of racing for 4 or 5 or even 6 hours a day for 21 days some of it up Mountains is just too much for the human body to take.

I personally believe that the races are far too long.

Yes, historically they were even longer and a pro race is meant to be just that, a challenge. However, I think they could do with being at least halved. 80 - 100 km stages would be plenty.

[johnxjsc1985]

funkyrobot said:

I personally believe that the races are far too long.

Yes, historically they were even longer and a pro race is meant to be just that, a challenge. However, I think they could do with being at least halved. 80 - 100 km stages would be plenty.

The Vuelta has done something like this and the racing is really aggressive .

[WestyCarl]

Unfortunately this is not unique to cycling, but I believe prevalent in most professional sports.

Cycling is in the spotlight because of Villy Voet, Festina and LA.

The next scandal could be African middle / long distance runners, for example.............

The only way to clear up elite sport is transparency. To compete at Elite level and earn money you need to regularly publish all your medical / blood data. No if's, but's or excuses, it's just mandatory if you want to earn money from sports.

[johnxjsc1985]

WestyCarl said:

Unfortunately this is not unique to cycling, but I believe prevalent in most professional sports.

Cycling is in the spotlight because of Villy Voet, Festina and LA.

The next scandal could be African middle / long distance runners, for example.............

The only way to clear up elite sport is transparency. To compete at Elite level and earn money you need to regularly publish all your medical / blood data. No if's, but's or excuses, it's just mandatory if you want to earn money from sports.

or we should accept they are not super humans and stop expecting them to go faster and faster . Bolt was almost vilified for not breaking World Records at Rio we cant expect the levels of performance to rise continually and then look shocked when we find they have take PED's

[WestyCarl]

johnxjsc1985 said:

or we should accept they are not super humans and stop expecting them to go faster and faster . Bolt was almost vilified for not breaking World Records at Rio we cant expect the levels of performance to rise continually and then look shocked when we find they have take PED's

I don't believe it's public expectation, in fact quite the opposite, the public are getting sick of all the doping scandals and turning away from elite sport.

Where there is competition someone will always cheat, mainly to gain more money. So either take the money out of sport which is pretty much impossible or have complete transparency which isn't perfect but much better than current.