Wiggins - could this be a Similar issue as Lance A ?
Discussion
funkyrobot said:
Interesting.
I must admit that this saga has changed my perspective on what Wiggins and Sky have achieved.
It's a damn shame really as I've followed the sport for years. Sick of seeing it being dragged through the gutter in so many ways.
It's pretty obvious that it's very, very difficult to do anything honestly and cleanly in this sport. It's probably time to just let the dopers get on with it. Let's stop pretending that this sport can be clean.
I know that this a cycling thread, but is it a pretense to believe that any sport is clean? Was there some halcyon day when we could emphatically trust the result of any sporting competition?I must admit that this saga has changed my perspective on what Wiggins and Sky have achieved.
It's a damn shame really as I've followed the sport for years. Sick of seeing it being dragged through the gutter in so many ways.
It's pretty obvious that it's very, very difficult to do anything honestly and cleanly in this sport. It's probably time to just let the dopers get on with it. Let's stop pretending that this sport can be clean.
I often feel that all my life I have been just a gullible, naive, schmuck, when it comes being an enthusiastic sports fan.
funkyrobot said:
I must admit that this saga has changed my perspective on what Wiggins and Sky have achieved.
Why? Wiggins did nothing illegal. It's possible to take your view further though and claim it's not just Wiggins and Sky, it's the whole of recent British cycling with it's 'win at any cost' approach.popeyewhite said:
funkyrobot said:
I must admit that this saga has changed my perspective on what Wiggins and Sky have achieved.
Why? Wiggins did nothing illegal. It's possible to take your view further though and claim it's not just Wiggins and Sky, it's the whole of recent British cycling with it's 'win at any cost' approach.This thread is about Wiggins, hence why I've commented about him.
popeyewhite said:
funkyrobot said:
I must admit that this saga has changed my perspective on what Wiggins and Sky have achieved.
Why? Wiggins did nothing illegal. It's possible to take your view further though and claim it's not just Wiggins and Sky, it's the whole of recent British cycling with it's 'win at any cost' approach.
Granfondo said:
popeyewhite said:
funkyrobot said:
I must admit that this saga has changed my perspective on what Wiggins and Sky have achieved.
Why? Wiggins did nothing illegal. It's possible to take your view further though and claim it's not just Wiggins and Sky, it's the whole of recent British cycling with it's 'win at any cost' approach.El stovey said:
Granfondo said:
popeyewhite said:
funkyrobot said:
I must admit that this saga has changed my perspective on what Wiggins and Sky have achieved.
Why? Wiggins did nothing illegal. It's possible to take your view further though and claim it's not just Wiggins and Sky, it's the whole of recent British cycling with it's 'win at any cost' approach.It is not there to give you an ADVANTAGE!
I put the key words in capitals in case you had sand in your eyes!
Granfondo said:
A TUE is to give the athlete the ability to not be DISADVANTAGED due to injury or illness!
It is not there to give you an ADVANTAGE!
I put the key words in capitals in case you had sand in your eyes!
Right.... But as has been pointed out many many times, TUEs are not illegal. Nor has it been established that it was used to gain an advantage.It is not there to give you an ADVANTAGE!
I put the key words in capitals in case you had sand in your eyes!
The TUE system stinks and is open for abuse, but there has been no evidence that Wiggins or anyone from Team Sky did this.
_dobbo_ said:
Granfondo said:
A TUE is to give the athlete the ability to not be DISADVANTAGED due to injury or illness!
It is not there to give you an ADVANTAGE!
I put the key words in capitals in case you had sand in your eyes!
Right.... But as has been pointed out many many times, TUEs are not illegal. Nor has it been established that it was used to gain an advantage.It is not there to give you an ADVANTAGE!
I put the key words in capitals in case you had sand in your eyes!
The TUE system stinks and is open for abuse, but there has been no evidence that Wiggins or anyone from Team Sky did this.
Granfondo said:
_dobbo_ said:
Granfondo said:
A TUE is to give the athlete the ability to not be DISADVANTAGED due to injury or illness!
It is not there to give you an ADVANTAGE!
I put the key words in capitals in case you had sand in your eyes!
Right.... But as has been pointed out many many times, TUEs are not illegal. Nor has it been established that it was used to gain an advantage.It is not there to give you an ADVANTAGE!
I put the key words in capitals in case you had sand in your eyes!
The TUE system stinks and is open for abuse, but there has been no evidence that Wiggins or anyone from Team Sky did this.
El stovey said:
Granfondo said:
_dobbo_ said:
Granfondo said:
A TUE is to give the athlete the ability to not be DISADVANTAGED due to injury or illness!
It is not there to give you an ADVANTAGE!
I put the key words in capitals in case you had sand in your eyes!
Right.... But as has been pointed out many many times, TUEs are not illegal. Nor has it been established that it was used to gain an advantage.It is not there to give you an ADVANTAGE!
I put the key words in capitals in case you had sand in your eyes!
The TUE system stinks and is open for abuse, but there has been no evidence that Wiggins or anyone from Team Sky did this.
Granfondo said:
popeyewhite said:
funkyrobot said:
I must admit that this saga has changed my perspective on what Wiggins and Sky have achieved.
Why? Wiggins did nothing illegal. It's possible to take your view further though and claim it's not just Wiggins and Sky, it's the whole of recent British cycling with it's 'win at any cost' approach.
Granfondo said:
_dobbo_ said:
Granfondo said:
A TUE is to give the athlete the ability to not be DISADVANTAGED due to injury or illness!
It is not there to give you an ADVANTAGE!
I put the key words in capitals in case you had sand in your eyes!
Right.... But as has been pointed out many many times, TUEs are not illegal. Nor has it been established that it was used to gain an advantage.It is not there to give you an ADVANTAGE!
I put the key words in capitals in case you had sand in your eyes!
The TUE system stinks and is open for abuse, but there has been no evidence that Wiggins or anyone from Team Sky did this.
You wouldn't know it, but Wiggins was about to go into respiratory spasm just from those triffids behind him
Very difficult to argue with the fan boys, although it's great fun listening to their logic. Never fails to pack me up. This t
t is a prime example.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=chNBaUgQ-nA&sn...
t is a prime example.https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=chNBaUgQ-nA&sn...
mcelliott said:
Very difficult to argue with the fan boys, although it's great fun listening to their logic. Never fails to pack me up. This tt is a prime example.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=chNBaUgQ-nA&sn...
That video - worra load of bolllocks. I think I shall declare myself an expert and give out that kind of earth-shattering insight.t is a prime example.https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=chNBaUgQ-nA&sn...
Granfondo said:
Do you believe that Wiggins ATHSMA / ALERGIES was the only reason that this intravenous injections were given to a man that can hold over 470 watts for an hour with those major respiratory problems?
No I think the whole thing stinks and Wiggins is fair game ever since he sat on a fking throne like some sort of humongous throbber.But the question that was asked was what did he do that was illegal, which despite an insane amount of scrutiny is nothing otherwise they'd have already stripped him of any victories.
_dobbo_ said:
But the question that was asked was what did he do that was illegal, which despite an insane amount of scrutiny is nothing otherwise they'd have already stripped him of any victories.
IMO he's broken the rules.TUEs are for genuine illness. Now you can argue that they shouldn't be allowed and if you need strong drugs to keep going. You should actually stop anyway.
Genuine illness doesn't happen just before the start of 2 Tours and a Giro. It's as simple as that. Especially when it doesn't rear its head every again in your career!
So just because they (sky) managed to con wada? into authorising the TUE doesn't mean it wasn't cheating and thus breaking the rules
Rich_W said:
_dobbo_ said:
But the question that was asked was what did he do that was illegal, which despite an insane amount of scrutiny is nothing otherwise they'd have already stripped him of any victories.
IMO he's broken the rules.TUEs are for genuine illness. Now you can argue that they shouldn't be allowed and if you need strong drugs to keep going. You should actually stop anyway.
Genuine illness doesn't happen just before the start of 2 Tours and a Giro. It's as simple as that. Especially when it doesn't rear its head every again in your career!
So just because they (sky) managed to con wada? into authorising the TUE doesn't mean it wasn't cheating and thus breaking the rules
Granfondo said:
Totally agree ,why can't people see or understand that it's not the fact he had a TUE it's the fact he didn't NEED the TUE that's the cheating!
Presumably WADA or whoever are going to take away his yellow jersey now that this is apparently a fact? Again what has he done illegal? You keep saying he has but don't seem to be able to say what. It looks like you're just stating your opinion as fact?
There's lots of murky stuff going on here but I haven't seen any actually evidence of anything illegal going on. I don't know either way if he's done anything illegal but you keep stating he has, without being able to give any evidence whatsoever. Apologies if you actually know that he didn't need a TUE, or it's actually been proven as fact.
Edited by anonymous-user on Saturday 11th March 07:23
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