The Running Thread
Discussion
Personal 10k best of 48:55 for me this morning, stoked in that the previous two events I had been hovering around the 54:00 mark so pleased to knock off 5 minutes. I think being paced at 50:00 made the difference, got me into a good (for me) pace which I maintained throughout the race.
I did my first fell run of any substance in many years yesterday. Skiddaw from the North West. There was thick cloud and rain from about 500m. I was a bit nervous beforehand as I mostly run on the flat of the Cheshire Plain and I did it with a fell runner who has completed the Bob Graham Round. I actually found it to be fine, even the descent. My Vivobarefoot Trail shoes were spot on too.
I really enjoyed it and might have a go at some fell races.
I really enjoyed it and might have a go at some fell races.
ocrx8 said:
Had a shocker of a 10k this morning. The first 5 miles were textbook, at which point I was on for a sub 33 and a win. At 9.5km I near enough collapse due to sheer lack of energy - my vision was going off, I couldn't keep in a straight line, pace slowing dramatically down etc. The first aiders and marshalls were all excellent and being in an ambulance for 45 mins was an experience!
Any ideas what may have caused it? I've done a fair few races now, cracked out a 33:24 last weekend no problem and definitely had enough breakfast/fluid beforehand. I didn't stop at the 5km water station but I never have done in 10ks previously.Temperature was about 17/18 and on the muggy side. I'm leaning towards it being heat exhaustion as it took me forever to cool down and get back to a relatively normal state in the ambulance.
Sounds like heat exhaustion to me. Silly question now, but before the race did you feel well adjusted to heat? I'm pushing myself just as hard now as I do in the autumn, winter and spring despite the heat. I usually throw a good amount of water over myself as I pass through water stations to offset the heat.Any ideas what may have caused it? I've done a fair few races now, cracked out a 33:24 last weekend no problem and definitely had enough breakfast/fluid beforehand. I didn't stop at the 5km water station but I never have done in 10ks previously.Temperature was about 17/18 and on the muggy side. I'm leaning towards it being heat exhaustion as it took me forever to cool down and get back to a relatively normal state in the ambulance.
Bitter-sweet morning for me at a 10k. Bitter because I missed sub-40 by just 2 seconds, but sweet because it was a course PB by almost a minute compared to last year.
Ocrx8 - difficult to say what it was but sounds like it could be dehydration or heat exhaustion. I'm sure it could be many other things as well. Did you feel it comingor did it hit you suddenly? Were you mouth or nose breathing ( I ask because SWMBO needs to nose breathe or she occasionally cannot get air in as her breaths are too shallow and that can lead to feeling ill)
4 runs this week for me 2 swims and 4 cycles so a real mixed bag. 2 of the runs were with clubs at 1830 so very hot and the 6.3 mins miles on Wednesday was brutal. Found a guy who just set a PB for 10k of 40 mins straight have someone to run with.
4 runs this week for me 2 swims and 4 cycles so a real mixed bag. 2 of the runs were with clubs at 1830 so very hot and the 6.3 mins miles on Wednesday was brutal. Found a guy who just set a PB for 10k of 40 mins straight have someone to run with.
Thanks all. From memory I felt it at around 5.5 miles (pulled out at 5.85) - I remember telling myself "you're nearly there, keep going!". I also remember a complete and utter lack of energy kicking in fairly quickly. Mouth breathing is the only option for me during exercise (sorry PH!).
I've read up on the subject and it's probably either heat exhaustion or low blood pressure. They checked the latter in the ambulance and nothing was mentioned about it being too low, so I'm inclined to go with the former. It rained during the previous 10k I did, which would have helped substantially in keeping my body at a "normal" temperature at that pace. Next time - make use of the water stations!
I'm more gutted as it's the first race I've faltered at and it's knocked the confidence down quite a few notches. I'll get some rest and get out there again...
I've read up on the subject and it's probably either heat exhaustion or low blood pressure. They checked the latter in the ambulance and nothing was mentioned about it being too low, so I'm inclined to go with the former. It rained during the previous 10k I did, which would have helped substantially in keeping my body at a "normal" temperature at that pace. Next time - make use of the water stations!
I'm more gutted as it's the first race I've faltered at and it's knocked the confidence down quite a few notches. I'll get some rest and get out there again...
Completed my first marathon yesterday - actually 28 miles by the time we had checked various elements of the instructions. Was a self guided one using a 6 page set of written instructions. Organised by the Long Distance Walkers Association.
Wasn't quick by any means at 7:25 but by the time you are reading instructions, stopping at the 4 checkpoints to have the fact you have been there recorded as well as drinks and snacks the actual moving time was 5:39. A great experience and my longest run by 12 miles.
Delighted to have got a marathon distance under my belt - looking forward to Beachy Head in October now.
Wasn't quick by any means at 7:25 but by the time you are reading instructions, stopping at the 4 checkpoints to have the fact you have been there recorded as well as drinks and snacks the actual moving time was 5:39. A great experience and my longest run by 12 miles.
Delighted to have got a marathon distance under my belt - looking forward to Beachy Head in October now.
markh1973 said:
Completed my first marathon yesterday - actually 28 miles by the time we had checked various elements of the instructions. Was a self guided one using a 6 page set of written instructions. Organised by the Long Distance Walkers Association.
Wasn't quick by any means at 7:25 but by the time you are reading instructions, stopping at the 4 checkpoints to have the fact you have been there recorded as well as drinks and snacks the actual moving time was 5:39. A great experience and my longest run by 12 miles.
Delighted to have got a marathon distance under my belt - looking forward to Beachy Head in October now.
Good effort. That sounds like my kind of thing.Wasn't quick by any means at 7:25 but by the time you are reading instructions, stopping at the 4 checkpoints to have the fact you have been there recorded as well as drinks and snacks the actual moving time was 5:39. A great experience and my longest run by 12 miles.
Delighted to have got a marathon distance under my belt - looking forward to Beachy Head in October now.
Sorry, long post! Some advice required please.
I'm due to run a marathon in a couple of weeks, unfortunately pulling out isn't an option. Up until about 8 weeks ago my training had been going well, running 3 -4 times a week (up to 9 miles at average pace of 8 mins a mile and easily running 12 miles at a 9 min pace for my longer weekend run).
I was then struck by some sort of, extremely painful, tendinitis in the heel/sole of my foot meaning I had to lay off the running. I did one run a week for 3 weeks (and even then it was a pretty slow hobble)but after 3 weeks was able to get back out. I then did some very limited training with couple of longer runs (13 & 16 miles) to build up my distance but managed to get some sort of lower leg injury (again extremely painful, I couldn't walk without a limp for the best part of two weeks), obviously too much too soon. I've managed to get back into running 3 times a week a couple of weeks ago but it's obvious I've lost a huge amount of fitness over the period of the injuries. Last weekend was meant to be my last long run before taper (20 miles) and for the final 1.5 miles I was in bits, absolutely exhausted, breathing very hard off a slow pace etc(3 hrs 27m). Yesterday's 16 miles wasn't much better (although the first 6 miles was reasonably brisk).
I think there are a number of factors at play 1) obvious loss of fitness 2) the heat (which historically has always affected my running) and 3) my, if the internet is to be believed, very poor hydration (I don't like running feeling 'full' of liquid although I suspect I'll have to lump it).
Obviously time is very short so little I suspect can be done fitness wise. Any tips to get me round in two weeks? I had been hoping for sub 4 hrs but that's long gone, at this stage I just want to not finish last. What should I be looking at food and hydration wise? Any tips for coping with the heat better?
Ta GD!
I'm due to run a marathon in a couple of weeks, unfortunately pulling out isn't an option. Up until about 8 weeks ago my training had been going well, running 3 -4 times a week (up to 9 miles at average pace of 8 mins a mile and easily running 12 miles at a 9 min pace for my longer weekend run).
I was then struck by some sort of, extremely painful, tendinitis in the heel/sole of my foot meaning I had to lay off the running. I did one run a week for 3 weeks (and even then it was a pretty slow hobble)but after 3 weeks was able to get back out. I then did some very limited training with couple of longer runs (13 & 16 miles) to build up my distance but managed to get some sort of lower leg injury (again extremely painful, I couldn't walk without a limp for the best part of two weeks), obviously too much too soon. I've managed to get back into running 3 times a week a couple of weeks ago but it's obvious I've lost a huge amount of fitness over the period of the injuries. Last weekend was meant to be my last long run before taper (20 miles) and for the final 1.5 miles I was in bits, absolutely exhausted, breathing very hard off a slow pace etc(3 hrs 27m). Yesterday's 16 miles wasn't much better (although the first 6 miles was reasonably brisk).
I think there are a number of factors at play 1) obvious loss of fitness 2) the heat (which historically has always affected my running) and 3) my, if the internet is to be believed, very poor hydration (I don't like running feeling 'full' of liquid although I suspect I'll have to lump it).
Obviously time is very short so little I suspect can be done fitness wise. Any tips to get me round in two weeks? I had been hoping for sub 4 hrs but that's long gone, at this stage I just want to not finish last. What should I be looking at food and hydration wise? Any tips for coping with the heat better?
Ta GD!
Edited by Greedydog on Monday 13th July 15:31
Edited by Greedydog on Monday 13th July 15:35
Greedydog said:
Any tips to get me round in two weeks?
IMHO -Take great care not to get injured - injury will make your time much slower than being a bit less fit will so train as much as you can but don't overdo it.
Make sure you don't do any junk miles just to get the mileage up, consider what the purpose is of every run so that it counts.
Have a massage/some massages.
Take great care not to get injured.
Decide on a strategy that will get you to the end then stick to it; finishing in a slower time is better than not finishing. Run 1 or 2 or 3 miles and walk 3 or 2 or 1 all the way will be better than run 16, crawl 10 even though it might be hard to hold back and resist the temptation to speed up early, it's preferable to change to a faster plan towards the end and much more satisfying to be steaming past people in the last section.
Did I say take great care not to get injured?
Good luck!
As john2443 says, avoid injury..Stop running sporadically as the mileage variances will get you injured.
From what you say, you appear to have the ability to get around in 4 hours, but start slowly.
When I'm running in the mountains for more than 3 hours, I drink half a litre of isotonic drink every hour as a minimum with a bit of added salt. Every hour, I'll eat a cracker and a bit of cake and a jelly baby or three. Every 12km I'll stuff a gel down my throat.
Remember, you can burn 900 kCal an hour and that's very hard to replace.
I'm not saying you should eat the above, but it gives you an idea.
From what you say, you appear to have the ability to get around in 4 hours, but start slowly.
When I'm running in the mountains for more than 3 hours, I drink half a litre of isotonic drink every hour as a minimum with a bit of added salt. Every hour, I'll eat a cracker and a bit of cake and a jelly baby or three. Every 12km I'll stuff a gel down my throat.
Remember, you can burn 900 kCal an hour and that's very hard to replace.
I'm not saying you should eat the above, but it gives you an idea.
Smitters said:
Roo3Stuart said:
Evening all
A couple of random questions:
I am one of those reformed/evangelical forefoot runners having gone from cushioned Asics and orthotics to low drop shoes and a short stride etc. I have been pretty much injury free in 2 years of doing so, and have dealt with the obligatory sore calves, but the one thing I can't seem to get past is sore feet! After every run, my heels ache and are stiff after sitting still for a while. It isn't really a problem, I can run the next day, and I don't think it is an injury of any sort, more that the only thing that aches after a run is my feet. I believe stretching my calves should help as they are probably limiting flexibility in my feet and ankles but any suggestions for mitigating this welcome!
Unrelated, does anyone else use a Garmin 620 with running dynamics? For those not familiar it measures cadence, ground contact time and vertical oscillation. I'm not sure whether it is anything other than a great gadget which has established that I bounce like Zebedee despite the other measures being quite good. Really just interested in what people do with the technology - I like having my cadence on my wrist as it makes me focus on a short stride and trying to get to 180 steps per minute, but I can only do this when running fast (by my standards). Oh and it produces really cool graphs!
Cheers all
I roll my feet really gently on a tennis ball, which I find provides relief from sore feet.A couple of random questions:
I am one of those reformed/evangelical forefoot runners having gone from cushioned Asics and orthotics to low drop shoes and a short stride etc. I have been pretty much injury free in 2 years of doing so, and have dealt with the obligatory sore calves, but the one thing I can't seem to get past is sore feet! After every run, my heels ache and are stiff after sitting still for a while. It isn't really a problem, I can run the next day, and I don't think it is an injury of any sort, more that the only thing that aches after a run is my feet. I believe stretching my calves should help as they are probably limiting flexibility in my feet and ankles but any suggestions for mitigating this welcome!
Unrelated, does anyone else use a Garmin 620 with running dynamics? For those not familiar it measures cadence, ground contact time and vertical oscillation. I'm not sure whether it is anything other than a great gadget which has established that I bounce like Zebedee despite the other measures being quite good. Really just interested in what people do with the technology - I like having my cadence on my wrist as it makes me focus on a short stride and trying to get to 180 steps per minute, but I can only do this when running fast (by my standards). Oh and it produces really cool graphs!
Cheers all
Hywel Davies has written about efficiency by using this type of device, but I suspect that the "how" of making the changes required might need to be quite carefully done. This blog post might be interesting. http://training.hyweldavies.me/#post154
Interesting link. Question for me is cause or effect - all my readings improve when I go faster but which is causing which? I guess if you can improve dynamics and hence speed without increasing heart rate then that would be a good outcome.
Lotus Notes said:
As john2443 says, avoid injury..Stop running sporadically as the mileage variances will get you injured.
From what you say, you appear to have the ability to get around in 4 hours, but start slowly.
When I'm running in the mountains for more than 3 hours, I drink half a litre of isotonic drink every hour as a minimum with a bit of added salt. Every hour, I'll eat a cracker and a bit of cake and a jelly baby or three. Every 12km I'll stuff a gel down my throat.
Remember, you can burn 900 kCal an hour and that's very hard to replace.
I'm not saying you should eat the above, but it gives you an idea.
I would agree. regularly taking in calories and salt/electrolytes in water helpsFrom what you say, you appear to have the ability to get around in 4 hours, but start slowly.
When I'm running in the mountains for more than 3 hours, I drink half a litre of isotonic drink every hour as a minimum with a bit of added salt. Every hour, I'll eat a cracker and a bit of cake and a jelly baby or three. Every 12km I'll stuff a gel down my throat.
Remember, you can burn 900 kCal an hour and that's very hard to replace.
I'm not saying you should eat the above, but it gives you an idea.
Massively in events over a couple of hours long.
Thanks guys, I'm taking a long hard look at my hydration and nutrition, I think the lack of planning, hydration especially, but also energy intake really hurt in my 20 mile run, I've never experienced anything like it.
Training wise I think I'll stick to a few 10k'ish runs to keep what aerobic fitness I have while, hopefully, avoiding further injury.
Training wise I think I'll stick to a few 10k'ish runs to keep what aerobic fitness I have while, hopefully, avoiding further injury.
Good running day yesterday. PB on the 5.5 mile run-commute in the morning and a decent track session with the club in the evening. The session was 5 sets of 800m; 2 mins recovery; 400m; 1 min recovery; 200m; 2 mins recovery, so 7k in total. Group of about 20 doing it at various paces. My 800s were 2:25-2:30, 400s in 68-69s and 200s in 31-33s, so getting quicker with a bit of consistent training.
Dr Murdoch said:
Ive got my 10k race on Sunday, on Tuesday just gone and I ran in to work and back home again (8.5miles x 2). It was quite an effort for one reason or another...
Should I now rest completely, or go for a light run between now and Sunday?
Short run today at 10k pace, rest Friday and a gentle jog on Saturday..Should I now rest completely, or go for a light run between now and Sunday?
HAd my first proper taining run after the marathon. 5.3k in 27 minutes which is about 4 minutes slower than the last time I ran this distance.
I have been going for the odd run once a week for the last 6 weeks but I decide to give myself time to recover properly. My knees and hips are feeling a lot better from having a break but I need to get my arse in gear as I have a 10k in September (aiming sud 45) and the Frankfurt Marathon (sub 3.40) in October.
I have been going for the odd run once a week for the last 6 weeks but I decide to give myself time to recover properly. My knees and hips are feeling a lot better from having a break but I need to get my arse in gear as I have a 10k in September (aiming sud 45) and the Frankfurt Marathon (sub 3.40) in October.
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