The **BOXING** thread

[Yiliterate]

Amirhussain said:

Sergio Martinez vs Miguel Cotto on the 7th.

Tough one to call. Martinez is a brilliant fighter but has been showings signs of being beatable for a couple of years now, even if he has come through each time against Barker, Macklin, Murray and Chavez jr. That said, you just don't know how many big fights Cotto has left in him (not that the word Quit means much to him); his CV is just incredible. Plus it's not known how effective Cotto will be at Middleweight. Looking forward to it!

[custardtart]

Yiliterate said:

As I posted at the time, it was an amazing punch; masterful execution. For me, it was the little tug with the left on Groves' right arm that made it; either it was going to lower Groves' guard (although he should have had his left up too to give more protection from the right cross) or it was going to pull Groves onto the shot; and whichever, it was also going to switch Groves' attention to what Froch was doing with his left and away from his right, even if only for a split second. Brilliant shot...

Indeed, reminded me of Thomas Hearn's perfect knock out set up of Duran, if slightly less stylish.

[dirty boy]

I had the fight evens with Groves winning the round about to go ahead until he got KO'd.

Froch was ineffective with the slow jab, and even my wife was irritated with Jim Watt getting excited by Froch's body punches stating they weren't getting through (replays showed Groves was defensively excellent and they was all being parried or taken on the arms).

The better punches were coming from Groves, especially when you consider Groves has a fast and hard jab and was using it effectively, but for a judge to score ringside, who knows how they see it.

Compubox says

Froch
Total 349 thrown, 96 landed 28%
Jabs 212 thrown, 40 landed 19%
Power 137 thrown, 56 landed 41%

Groves
Total 314 thrown, 126 landed 40%
Jabs 218 thrown, 83 landed 38%
Power 96 thrown, 43 landed 45%

[FredClogs]

dirty boy said:

I had the fight evens with Groves winning the round about to go ahead until he got KO'd.

Froch was ineffective with the slow jab, and even my wife was irritated with Jim Watt getting excited by Froch's body punches stating they weren't getting through (replays showed Groves was defensively excellent and they was all being parried or taken on the arms).

The better punches were coming from Groves, especially when you consider Groves has a fast and hard jab and was using it effectively, but for a judge to score ringside, who knows how they see it.

Compubox says

Froch
Total 349 thrown, 96 landed 28%
Jabs 212 thrown, 40 landed 19%
Power 137 thrown, 56 landed 41%

Groves
Total 314 thrown, 126 landed 40%
Jabs 218 thrown, 83 landed 38%
Power 96 thrown, 43 landed 45%

Froch made it perfectly clear that it was not his intention to let this fight go the distance. I'm not sure what you're trying to say, it's a pretty simple sport to understand, Groves got stopped because he was unable to defend himself in the first fight and then knocked out in the second by a very seasoned 3 time world champion - that is that.

He may come again, I hope he does, I like his style and his speed is undeniable but Groves is no where near the fully rounded professional that the hype around these fights has led many to believe, his ranking now puts him in a very dangerous place because there are other very good well seasoned pros in that division who will have seen him to be very beatable and a big payday.

As for the comments above about Froch retiring, I hope not, I'd love to see him try to crack Andre Ward and I don't think he fears a fight with Ward other than a points loss I don't think Ward has got the power to upset Carl, I reckon a step up to meet Hopkins would be great as well, something to really tell the grand kids about as I doubt they'll know who George Groves was.

[sjc]

FredClogs said:

Froch made it perfectly clear that it was not his intention to let this fight go the distance. I'm not sure what you're trying to say, it's a pretty simple sport to understand, Groves got stopped because he was unable to defend himself in the first fight and then knocked out in the second by a very seasoned 3 time world champion - that is that.

He may come again, I hope he does, I like his style and his speed is undeniable but Groves is no where near the fully rounded professional that the hype around these fights has led many to believe, his ranking now puts him in a very dangerous place because there are other very good well seasoned pros in that division who will have seen him to be very beatable and a big payday.

Agree with all of that.
I thought he lost to DeGale as well,it wouldn't surprise me if he gradually goes backwards now.

[lord trumpton]

I think groves made his own bed for that fight. I know the banter is all for the fight hype but he took it way too far. I like Groves and wanted him to beat Froch but part of me thinks that if he just kept his voice down, trained hard and remained respectful he may not be feeling quite as embarrassed as I guess he is right now.

Manny has the right approach to pre fight hype imho - he just smiles and remains polite. When he gets in the ring then thats when he starts talking

[Yiliterate]

lord trumpton said:

I think groves made his own bed for that fight. I know the banter is all for the fight hype but he took it way too far. I like Groves and wanted him to beat Froch but part of me thinks that if he just kept his voice down, trained hard and remained respectful he may not be feeling quite as embarrassed as I guess he is right now.

Manny has the right approach to pre fight hype imho - he just smiles and remains polite. When he gets in the ring then thats when he starts talking

Yeah, can understand that point of view - the only thing I'd say is if Groves hadn't done what he did in the build-up to both fights, it's unlikely that we would have just seen one of the biggest events - if not the biggest event - in British boxing history. Before the first fight, George Groves was a talented up-and-coming prospect...one fight and one loss later, he's headlining Wembley Stadium! Quite remarkable when you think about it...!

[London424]

Yiliterate said:

lord trumpton said:

I think groves made his own bed for that fight. I know the banter is all for the fight hype but he took it way too far. I like Groves and wanted him to beat Froch but part of me thinks that if he just kept his voice down, trained hard and remained respectful he may not be feeling quite as embarrassed as I guess he is right now.

Manny has the right approach to pre fight hype imho - he just smiles and remains polite. When he gets in the ring then thats when he starts talking

Yeah, can understand that point of view - the only thing I'd say is if Groves hadn't done what he did in the build-up to both fights, it's unlikely that we would have just seen one of the biggest events - if not the biggest event - in British boxing history. Before the first fight, George Groves was a talented up-and-coming prospect...one fight and one loss later, he's headlining Wembley Stadium! Quite remarkable when you think about it...!

But I think that his performance and the 'controversy' around the result was more than enough to sell tickets.

[dirty boy]

FredClogs said:

I'm not sure what you're trying to say, it's a pretty simple sport to understand, Groves got stopped because he was unable to defend himself in the first fight and then knocked out in the second by a very seasoned 3 time world champion - that is that.

I wasn't trying to say anything, just pointing out that I had Groves ahead and that Froch wasn't doing as well as Jim Watt's commentary would have suggested, which to a layman spectator can skew opinions.

I threw the CompuBox stats in there to accompany up my opinion.

I care not for the result, that's beyond doubt.

[Yiliterate]

London424 said:

But I think that his performance and the 'controversy' around the result was more than enough to sell tickets.

Both the performance and the nature of the ending were essential ingredients in selling the second fight, no doubt about it. But enough on their own to sell 60,000 tickets in less than an hour and 80,000 overall, plus pull in the PPVs?? Groves putting Froch on the seat of his shorts was fantastic from a boxing point of view (allegiances aside) but it was him puffing his chest out a week before the fight and saying 'I'm going to hit him with two right hands in the first round and there will be fk all he can do about it' that gave it a whole different context. It also made sure people were watching when it happened! And while the ending was controversial, without Groves kicking up the storm he did (along with the attention-grabbing he'd done in the lead up), it would probably only have been the same bunch of aficionados tuning in for the second fight as did the first...that's if the fight went ahead at all; there have been plenty of perceived injustices and 'what ifs' that have been left unresolved or unanswered in boxing...!

[Tirus]

FredClogs said:

As for the comments above about Froch retiring, I hope not, I'd love to see him try to crack Andre Ward and I don't think he fears a fight with Ward other than a points loss I don't think Ward has got the power to upset Carl.

Fred the pain of losing to Ward for a 2nd time would send Froch into a depression like poor old Foreman when he lost to Ali... Seriously, Froch is a winner as long as he stays away from Ward.

Now if Grove's wants a boxing lesson Ward will be his man too!

[Yiliterate]

An interesting 'what's next for Froch' artice:

http://www.espn.co.uk/boxing/sport/story/312179.ht...

I'm guessing Chavez Jnr is the most likely but I'd love to see the Golovkin fight. Bika is an interesting option too; not a particularly big fight but one that shouldn't present too much danger for Froch and gives him a chance to reclaim his old WBC belt. Maybe take that first then Golovkin as the finale?

[FredClogs]

Yiliterate said:

An interesting 'what's next for Froch' artice:

http://www.espn.co.uk/boxing/sport/story/312179.ht...

I'm guessing Chavez Jnr is the most likely but I'd love to see the Golovkin fight. Bika is an interesting option too; not a particularly big fight but one that shouldn't present too much danger for Froch and gives him a chance to reclaim his old WBC belt. Maybe take that first then Golovkin as the finale?

I'm not sure I'd want to see Froch get in with Golovkin! I think he has the beating of all the others on the list, including Ward.

I was trying to remember the last big Vegas fight Matchroom were involved with and couldn't so did some Googling and if I'm not wrong you have to go back to Naseem Hamed, I don't know whether that's a comment on the importance of Vegas in world boxing these days or the Hearns? A massive Vegas show to put on some of Matchrooms other fighters would be awesome, I'd love to see Lee Selby do his thing in Vegas.

[London424]

Saw this picture earlier that just shows the size difference of Froch and Joshua.

https://twitter.com/TheLadBible/status/47379327288...

[FredClogs]

London424 said:

Saw this picture earlier that just shows the size difference of Froch and Joshua.

https://twitter.com/TheLadBible/status/47379327288...

And Froch is 6ft 1!!!

[Yiliterate]

Frampton vs Kiko Martinez for IBF Super Bantamweight belt signed for September in Belfast!

http://www.worldboxingnews.net/news/wbn/2014/06/04...

Rumours that Arthur Abraham could be defending his WBO Super Middleweight belt against Paul Smith...a way of Sauerland building Abraham's UK profile ahead of a possible shot at redemption for Groves???

[lord trumpton]

FredClogs said:

London424 said:

Saw this picture earlier that just shows the size difference of Froch and Joshua.

https://twitter.com/TheLadBible/status/47379327288...

And Froch is 6ft 1!!!

Whoa - thats one bloke I wouldn't want to take a punch off!

Looks more like a bodybuilder than a boxer

[Tirus]

lord trumpton said:

Whoa - thats one bloke I wouldn't want to take a punch off!

Looks more like a bodybuilder than a boxer

Just like "Big" Frank & Left hook Lacey what did they have in common aprt from a devastating punch ?

Lack of stamina in the mid to later rounds due to carrying to much muscle. Unless that is totally natural aka Tyson/Norton Shaver's they use up to much energy feeding those huge pumped up muscle's.

[dirty boy]

Tirus said:

lord trumpton said:

Whoa - thats one bloke I wouldn't want to take a punch off!

Looks more like a bodybuilder than a boxer

Just like "Big" Frank & Left hook Lacey what did they have in common aprt from a devastating punch ?

Lack of stamina in the mid to later rounds due to carrying to much muscle. Unless that is totally natural aka Tyson/Norton Shaver's they use up to much energy feeding those huge pumped up muscle's.

Similar to Mitchell Maduma the other night, Maduma looked a monster with ridiculously low bf (tiny legs too!) faded massively. It is a common occurrence, but less so at heavyweight as they don't need to drop weight for weigh ins.

[Tirus]

Also remember how Mr Eubanks Snr used to stand & pose to get a breather - Rock soild chin - heavy puncher - fast hands - No real Stamina