The **BOXING** thread
Discussion
The thing with Joshua is that I think his defence is a lot better than we have seen (mostly because it's been 99% attack). But as an amateur he was really good at avoiding shots.
On another note- I'm no longer on the fence. Having watched more of Stiverne I am now backing him to KO Wilder. 4th round
On another note- I'm no longer on the fence. Having watched more of Stiverne I am now backing him to KO Wilder. 4th round
Gatti v Ward (first fight). What a fight. Feel exhausted just watching it!
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Amirhussain said:
Gatti v Ward (first fight). What a fight. Feel exhausted just watching it!
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That trilogy of fights are my favourite ever boxing matches, they're like real life Rocky fights.https://m.facebook.com/story.php?story_fbid=833457...
Good fight that!!! Stiverne fought the wrong fight entirely but got to give wilder credit for getting through the exhaustion mid way and sticking to the game plan to last the distance.
I'd like to see fury have a go at him now....then a big unification match at the end of the year for the winner against wlad for all the trinkets.
Oh and I think santa cruz loses to both Frampton and qu igg!
I'd like to see fury have a go at him now....then a big unification match at the end of the year for the winner against wlad for all the trinkets.
Oh and I think santa cruz loses to both Frampton and qu igg!
I still think that Wilder is a very wild fighter, but he did box very well and answered a lot of questions about him. Does he have the stamina for a full fight? Yes. Can he take a punch? Yes, he got hit with a few big ones and didn't seem bothered.
He, to me, is a bit of a Happy Gilmore character! He has this immense power, but his style and punching technique needs to be refined. get that right and he really will be an excellent heavyweight. For now though he is the world champion. It will be interesting to see where he goes from here.
Stiverne can take a beating! You would need to hit him with a sledge hammer to stand a chance of knocking him out.
I still think Joshua would win against Stiverne or Wilder, but Wilder has certainly gone up in my estimations.
Perhaps we could see Wilder vs Fury, with the winner taking on Klitschko (as suggested by Tuscaneer).
He, to me, is a bit of a Happy Gilmore character! He has this immense power, but his style and punching technique needs to be refined. get that right and he really will be an excellent heavyweight. For now though he is the world champion. It will be interesting to see where he goes from here.
Stiverne can take a beating! You would need to hit him with a sledge hammer to stand a chance of knocking him out.
I still think Joshua would win against Stiverne or Wilder, but Wilder has certainly gone up in my estimations.
Perhaps we could see Wilder vs Fury, with the winner taking on Klitschko (as suggested by Tuscaneer).
Stiverne took a lot of heavy shots and, as Steve Lillis said afterwards, it started getting uncomfortable to watch. The one thing I did wonder though was whether the edge had been taken off Wilder's power with him coming in light at 15st 9lbs - that's pretty svelte for someone who's 6' 7'' and quite heavily muscled. I thought he actually looked like an elongated Cruiserweight i.e. had the physique of a fighter who had 'made the weight'.
In respect of Santa Cruz, I'd agree he looked a class below Frampton and Quigg, let alone Rigondeaux. However, I think I remember Jimmy Lennon jr saying something like Ruiz was ranked 14th by the WBO in the Featherweight division during the fighter introductions. If so, it might be the case that he wasn't expected to be much of a test, so Santa Cruz just wasn't in the right frame of mind...
In respect of Santa Cruz, I'd agree he looked a class below Frampton and Quigg, let alone Rigondeaux. However, I think I remember Jimmy Lennon jr saying something like Ruiz was ranked 14th by the WBO in the Featherweight division during the fighter introductions. If so, it might be the case that he wasn't expected to be much of a test, so Santa Cruz just wasn't in the right frame of mind...
It was a all action fight,rarely any clinches ,which in itself is good in any Heavyweight contest.
Wilder is OK, I did not really see Stiverne land that cleanly to say he takes a shot.I think a fight with Haye would test his chin & the fact that Haye is a lot faster in every department, that would be a firm test for Wilder. Stiverne's ring craft was awful ,I know Wilder has not any amateur career but on Stiverne's performance you would be hard pressed to tell,plus that he is a Olympic Silver medal winner, abysmal.
For Stiverne to say he was not 100% after the fight is pathetic & disrepctful to Wilder who clearly outclassed him, obviously Mark Brelands influence.
Wilder is OK, I did not really see Stiverne land that cleanly to say he takes a shot.I think a fight with Haye would test his chin & the fact that Haye is a lot faster in every department, that would be a firm test for Wilder. Stiverne's ring craft was awful ,I know Wilder has not any amateur career but on Stiverne's performance you would be hard pressed to tell,plus that he is a Olympic Silver medal winner, abysmal.
For Stiverne to say he was not 100% after the fight is pathetic & disrepctful to Wilder who clearly outclassed him, obviously Mark Brelands influence.
RAFsmoggy said:
For Stiverne to say he was not 100% after the fight is pathetic & disrepctful to Wilder who clearly outclassed him, obviously Mark Brelands influence.
When he said that I interpreted it as 'I just didn't turn up tonight'. He said he felt 100% before he fight, but not in the ring. Perhaps it was nerves? I think he got hit pretty hard in the first couple of rounds and went into defensive mode. When he (half) tried some attack he was getting somewhere with Wilder, so if he sustained those attacks a bit more then he may have done the business, but for reasons known only to himself he was only putting 2-3 shots together at any time.Wilder was pretty one dimensional with his attacks though. As good as his jab was it was pretty much 'left jab, right hook' and repeat.
Haye would destroy the pair of them.
Edited by STW2010 on Sunday 18th January 15:42
Possibly but he also said he felt flat, maybe he peaked to early? Wilder was pretty quick for such a big guy & i think this is why he came in lighter than before, to give him the " In & out" edge if so it worked.
I agree about Haye, that's if he could get back into shape after his shoulder op ?
I think Fury would be beaten by Wilder, to much speed for plodding Fury, though to be fair he has improved his hand speed but his foot work ,well what footwork ?
I agree about Haye, that's if he could get back into shape after his shoulder op ?
I think Fury would be beaten by Wilder, to much speed for plodding Fury, though to be fair he has improved his hand speed but his foot work ,well what footwork ?
I think people are seeing Haye through rather rose tinted spec as a heavyweight. His record at that level doesn't seem hugely impressive, none of his victories are against impressive opponents.
As a cruiserweight he was impressive but I'm not sure the same applies to his bouts at heavyweight.
As a cruiserweight he was impressive but I'm not sure the same applies to his bouts at heavyweight.
I think it was more based on the fact that Haye gave Wilder a pasting in sparring whilst training for Fury.
Wilder impressed me. He showed that he can go 12 full rounds even though he definitely got tired in there before tagging Stiverne hard in the 7th and putting the fight firmly back in his favour. Stiverne has a hell of a beard, I'll say that much too.
Can Wilder beat Klitschko? No. Can he beat Fury? I'd say yes he can. So hopefully he'll continue to bring excitement to the division.
Wilder impressed me. He showed that he can go 12 full rounds even though he definitely got tired in there before tagging Stiverne hard in the 7th and putting the fight firmly back in his favour. Stiverne has a hell of a beard, I'll say that much too.
Can Wilder beat Klitschko? No. Can he beat Fury? I'd say yes he can. So hopefully he'll continue to bring excitement to the division.
Fittster said:
I think people are seeing Haye through rather rose tinted spec as a heavyweight. His record at that level doesn't seem hugely impressive, none of his victories are against impressive opponents.
As a cruiserweight he was impressive but I'm not sure the same applies to his bouts at heavyweight.
His win against Valuev was pretty impressive given just how difficult it is for a pretty averaged sized guy to fight a giant, but you're right, I think in this era Haye isn't big enough - is he back in training for a definite return to boxing? There would be some big domestic fights, they could even do a sort of domestic Super 4 touring show around the country, Haye, Fury, Joshua, Price - winner takes all (or gets to fight Audely Harrison).As a cruiserweight he was impressive but I'm not sure the same applies to his bouts at heavyweight.
FredClogs said:
Fittster said:
I think people are seeing Haye through rather rose tinted spec as a heavyweight. His record at that level doesn't seem hugely impressive, none of his victories are against impressive opponents.
As a cruiserweight he was impressive but I'm not sure the same applies to his bouts at heavyweight.
His win against Valuev was pretty impressive given just how difficult it is for a pretty averaged sized guy to fight a giant, but you're right, I think in this era Haye isn't big enough - is he back in training for a definite return to boxing? There would be some big domestic fights, they could even do a sort of domestic Super 4 touring show around the country, Haye, Fury, Joshua, Price - winner takes all (or gets to fight Audely Harrison).As a cruiserweight he was impressive but I'm not sure the same applies to his bouts at heavyweight.
Also, from what I remember, in his last Cruiserweight fight vs Enzo Maccarinelli, Haye came in something like 2lbs inside the limit, so it's not as if he was finding it desperately difficult to make that weight either. Frankly, if the Cruiserweight division offered the same prestige, money and big fights as the Heavyweight division, I doubt Haye would have stepped up...
STW2010 said:
Haye also demolished Chisora. Something Vitali couldn't do
.........BUT , to be fair to vitali he only had one arm for 10 rounds of the fight. there was a recurrence of his rotator cuff injury from years before I believe.the punch stats for the fight certainly bear this out with vitali averaging less than half his usual punch output round on round.
not to take away what david did....he did an absolute number on chisora but the apparent good showing of Derek versus vitali flatters to deceive
tuscaneer said:
STW2010 said:
Haye also demolished Chisora. Something Vitali couldn't do
.........BUT , to be fair to vitali he only had one arm for 10 rounds of the fight. there was a recurrence of his rotator cuff injury from years before I believe.the punch stats for the fight certainly bear this out with vitali averaging less than half his usual punch output round on round.
not to take away what david did....he did an absolute number on chisora but the apparent good showing of Derek versus vitali flatters to deceive
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