Esprit V8 Twin Turbo
Discussion
Hi, I used to own a T350 (great car!) and now own a V8 Esprit.
The T350 felt more raw, and felt quicker (as you would expect, as it is a bit lighter and similar power). But the T350 is all about sensory overload, lots of noise from engine, and wind roar. The Esprit does everything with a much higher degree of refinement. It is, quite simply, a more developed car. It certainly handles better than the TVR. And it is deceptively quick. Sometimes it can feel almost feel a bit boring compared with the rawness of the T350, but as a drivers car it is better, no question. The Speed 6 is one of the all time great engines, but so is the flat-plane crank Esprit V8 (which is very un-V8-like in its smoothness and willingness to rev).
Perhaps one way to put it, in terms of refinement and how developed the overall package is is this: TVR is to Esprit as Esprit is to Porsche 911!
Regarding budget to own one - I think it is all down to luck. My own experience is that the TVR required significantly more expenditure than the Esprit. For the TVR, I would say your estimate is about right, i.e. similar to my own experience. So far, touch wood, I have done around 5,000 miles/one year in the Esprit with no major expenditure at all - but there are issues looming, I know, such as engine mounts and rattling exhaust manifolds, so the engine will have to come out and at that point I will put a new clutch in and cambelts while I am at it - total cost will be far in excess of anything I ever spent on the TVR.
BTW the TVR never let me down in any significant way.... was pretty reliable really. And so far, the Esprit has also been very reliable (I will no doubt regret saying that next time I take it out!!).
In fact (going slightly off topic), I have owned 3 Lotus cars (Europa (new shape one), Elise S and Esprit), and all three cars have been very reliable indeed.
Cheers,
Jerry
The T350 felt more raw, and felt quicker (as you would expect, as it is a bit lighter and similar power). But the T350 is all about sensory overload, lots of noise from engine, and wind roar. The Esprit does everything with a much higher degree of refinement. It is, quite simply, a more developed car. It certainly handles better than the TVR. And it is deceptively quick. Sometimes it can feel almost feel a bit boring compared with the rawness of the T350, but as a drivers car it is better, no question. The Speed 6 is one of the all time great engines, but so is the flat-plane crank Esprit V8 (which is very un-V8-like in its smoothness and willingness to rev).
Perhaps one way to put it, in terms of refinement and how developed the overall package is is this: TVR is to Esprit as Esprit is to Porsche 911!
Regarding budget to own one - I think it is all down to luck. My own experience is that the TVR required significantly more expenditure than the Esprit. For the TVR, I would say your estimate is about right, i.e. similar to my own experience. So far, touch wood, I have done around 5,000 miles/one year in the Esprit with no major expenditure at all - but there are issues looming, I know, such as engine mounts and rattling exhaust manifolds, so the engine will have to come out and at that point I will put a new clutch in and cambelts while I am at it - total cost will be far in excess of anything I ever spent on the TVR.
BTW the TVR never let me down in any significant way.... was pretty reliable really. And so far, the Esprit has also been very reliable (I will no doubt regret saying that next time I take it out!!).
In fact (going slightly off topic), I have owned 3 Lotus cars (Europa (new shape one), Elise S and Esprit), and all three cars have been very reliable indeed.
Cheers,
Jerry
Jerry - Thanks for your post, made interesting reading.
Am i right to say that you prefer the Esprit over the T350? I often look at pics in the classifieds and i feel that the interior of the Esprit lets it down a bit, lots of plastic. The TVR however, has very nice switchgear. I know this is quite a minor point to bring up but as that's what you're looking at when you drive the car it's quite important.
I also love the 993 911 but i find the interior in that quite horrid too, which is why I couldn't spend £20+ on one.
The TVR does indeed give you a sensory overload, it's always an occasion to go out in her. I've always had positive reaction from the guy at the petrol station or the kids playing in the street when i go past.
Does the Esprit get the same postive reactions? the reason i ask is; reading threads on the fezza sections, lots of comments about negative comments, spit on the bonnet etc... I hope the Lotus doesn't get this kind of treatment?
Are the servicing costs similar to a S6 TVR i.e ~ £450 for 6k and £800 for 12k?
Thanks to everyone who has replied, it does make interesting reading.
666
Am i right to say that you prefer the Esprit over the T350? I often look at pics in the classifieds and i feel that the interior of the Esprit lets it down a bit, lots of plastic. The TVR however, has very nice switchgear. I know this is quite a minor point to bring up but as that's what you're looking at when you drive the car it's quite important.
I also love the 993 911 but i find the interior in that quite horrid too, which is why I couldn't spend £20+ on one.
The TVR does indeed give you a sensory overload, it's always an occasion to go out in her. I've always had positive reaction from the guy at the petrol station or the kids playing in the street when i go past.
Does the Esprit get the same postive reactions? the reason i ask is; reading threads on the fezza sections, lots of comments about negative comments, spit on the bonnet etc... I hope the Lotus doesn't get this kind of treatment?
Are the servicing costs similar to a S6 TVR i.e ~ £450 for 6k and £800 for 12k?
Thanks to everyone who has replied, it does make interesting reading.
666
I don't really know the older models but there is virtually no plastic in my interior, it's mostly leather. You're correct that the interior is one area where the facelifts have had the least effect. The newer instrument binnacle is better but they could really have done a lot more.
The A service is probably around your estimate and the B service (4yr / 24k)a lot more as they will be changing cambelts (and tensioners, aux belt etc if you're sensible). As I said, all the costs are in my profile.
Other major expenditure points include: Clutch, AP front disks, turbo oil and coolant feeds. Make sure you find a car where these are recent.
Don't worry about attention, you will get lots of it. I've lost count of the number of times I have come back to the car to find people taking photos or waiting to ask about it. Many young kids (and some no so young) have had their photo taken in it and some girls have had their photo taken on it...
Well it was spat on once but so far no girls have ever flashed their boobs at the TVR
The A service is probably around your estimate and the B service (4yr / 24k)a lot more as they will be changing cambelts (and tensioners, aux belt etc if you're sensible). As I said, all the costs are in my profile.
Other major expenditure points include: Clutch, AP front disks, turbo oil and coolant feeds. Make sure you find a car where these are recent.
Don't worry about attention, you will get lots of it. I've lost count of the number of times I have come back to the car to find people taking photos or waiting to ask about it. Many young kids (and some no so young) have had their photo taken in it and some girls have had their photo taken on it...
Well it was spat on once but so far no girls have ever flashed their boobs at the TVR
Diablos-666 said:
Jerry - Thanks for your post, made interesting reading.
Am i right to say that you prefer the Esprit over the T350? I often look at pics in the classifieds and i feel that the interior of the Esprit lets it down a bit, lots of plastic. The TVR however, has very nice switchgear. I know this is quite a minor point to bring up but as that's what you're looking at when you drive the car it's quite important.
I also love the 993 911 but i find the interior in that quite horrid too, which is why I couldn't spend £20+ on one.
The TVR does indeed give you a sensory overload, it's always an occasion to go out in her. I've always had positive reaction from the guy at the petrol station or the kids playing in the street when i go past.
Does the Esprit get the same postive reactions? the reason i ask is; reading threads on the fezza sections, lots of comments about negative comments, spit on the bonnet etc... I hope the Lotus doesn't get this kind of treatment?
Are the servicing costs similar to a S6 TVR i.e ~ £450 for 6k and £800 for 12k?
Thanks to everyone who has replied, it does make interesting reading.
666
Yes, I prefer the Esprit, but there is plenty about the TVR I miss. The super cool instruments and switchgear being one of them. But I think you are being hard on the Esprit interior, the instrument binnacle is real alloy and contains classy VDO instruments, there is lots of real leather around, and it all seems well put together. No hideous 'chromed' plastic a la Porche, BMW etc. It is way ahead of a 996 Porche IMO, the latter's interior being a real low point for that marque. The only minus points IMO are the vauxhall switchgear (not a big issue) and the vauxhaul cavalier (!) door handles and mirror control, both of which do look a bit out of place (and don't wear too well either).Am i right to say that you prefer the Esprit over the T350? I often look at pics in the classifieds and i feel that the interior of the Esprit lets it down a bit, lots of plastic. The TVR however, has very nice switchgear. I know this is quite a minor point to bring up but as that's what you're looking at when you drive the car it's quite important.
I also love the 993 911 but i find the interior in that quite horrid too, which is why I couldn't spend £20+ on one.
The TVR does indeed give you a sensory overload, it's always an occasion to go out in her. I've always had positive reaction from the guy at the petrol station or the kids playing in the street when i go past.
Does the Esprit get the same postive reactions? the reason i ask is; reading threads on the fezza sections, lots of comments about negative comments, spit on the bonnet etc... I hope the Lotus doesn't get this kind of treatment?
Are the servicing costs similar to a S6 TVR i.e ~ £450 for 6k and £800 for 12k?
Thanks to everyone who has replied, it does make interesting reading.
666
The Esprit just drives better.
I have had loads of admiring looks and positive comments in the Esprit, but I do live in France where they seem less resentful of fast/expensive cars than people generally are in the UK.
I have not had a main dealer service done yet on the Esprit, it is about due for one now - but will probably be doing it myself - so can't really comment on that, sorry. The TVR services always included fixing stuff too, but the actual service bit never seemed too bad to me.
HTH
Cheers
Jerry
Diablos-666 said:
I took note of the following car lap times and in all honesty I thought the esprit twin turbo would have been quicker...
TVR T350 - 1min 27 secs
Noble - 1min 25 secs
Sagaris - 1min 24 secs
Esprit V8TT - 1 min 32 secs
it was the old stig what drove the lotus......he were crap.....TVR T350 - 1min 27 secs
Noble - 1min 25 secs
Sagaris - 1min 24 secs
Esprit V8TT - 1 min 32 secs
He had a bad experience driving for the GT team though. Management disagreements that kind of ruined the experience for him, so he may have had an agenda. Either that or the tyres were rubbish.
Or possibly that the car wasn't actually as fast as I thought...
something like that anyway...
Or possibly that the car wasn't actually as fast as I thought...
something like that anyway...
peter450 said:
I think some of the components were not up to more than 350hp, gearbox springs to mind, but i'm sure although not 100% certain, that other engine components are also marginal past this
There are V8's out there that have gone on to quite high HP figures, but i think some moderate amount of extra work was required to get this done reliably
The turbos ran quite low boost as i understand, the N/A version of the motor made 270 to 280 hp so it was certainly not heavily boosted
Lotus never made a n/a version of the V8.There are V8's out there that have gone on to quite high HP figures, but i think some moderate amount of extra work was required to get this done reliably
The turbos ran quite low boost as i understand, the N/A version of the motor made 270 to 280 hp so it was certainly not heavily boosted
The V8 is a great car - mine never fails to makle me smile every time i use it.
I would say that the turbos mainly affect the torque curve which is more or less flat. The peak HP may not be that significant but the power delivery is an almost turbine like wall of torque.
In any case, without intercooling the plenum air intake temperatures would rise too far with higher boost and the ECU would simply back off the timing to avoid detonation.
Even with the standard boost settings I can feel the car looses a bit on hot days due to the IAT.
In any case, without intercooling the plenum air intake temperatures would rise too far with higher boost and the ECU would simply back off the timing to avoid detonation.
Even with the standard boost settings I can feel the car looses a bit on hot days due to the IAT.
I have had TVR's and now currently have a mint esprit turbo and a mint 911, both mid/ late eighties.
the 911 is better built, more comfortable and more practical.
It gets driven less than any TVR or Lotus I have owned. I just find it so.....normal.
The Esprit reminds me of an early Griff/ late S series in interior look and feel. It handles miles better than any I have driven but seriously lacks the noise, even an exhaust upgrade wont make much difference once your used to the TVR. It does however go just as fast as an older TVR up to a cerbera. It isnt as quick as a Tuscan but it is far more useable on a normal road and its so easy to drive.
you just have to accept they are different cars with different points.
they cost about the same to look after and run (TVR / Lotus) . The porsche was more outlay to buy but needs less care and attention.
I actually went looking for a new Tuscan S, saw and fell in love with the lotus (in lamborghini orange) then had some left over. still wanted a soft top and saw the porsche. purchased both for the price of a decent tuscan.
horses for courses
the 911 is better built, more comfortable and more practical.
It gets driven less than any TVR or Lotus I have owned. I just find it so.....normal.
The Esprit reminds me of an early Griff/ late S series in interior look and feel. It handles miles better than any I have driven but seriously lacks the noise, even an exhaust upgrade wont make much difference once your used to the TVR. It does however go just as fast as an older TVR up to a cerbera. It isnt as quick as a Tuscan but it is far more useable on a normal road and its so easy to drive.
you just have to accept they are different cars with different points.
they cost about the same to look after and run (TVR / Lotus) . The porsche was more outlay to buy but needs less care and attention.
I actually went looking for a new Tuscan S, saw and fell in love with the lotus (in lamborghini orange) then had some left over. still wanted a soft top and saw the porsche. purchased both for the price of a decent tuscan.
horses for courses
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