Discussion
Well my 510 is still being a PITA. Autostop/Autoresume about every 30 seconds, to the point on Sunday when I went for a short ride, it measured 18 mph and 39 miles where as the Strava data was 19.3mph and 43 miles ... I know the route so I know the Strava data is correct. Piece of s
t!
t!JEA1K said:
Well my 510 is still being a PITA. Autostop/Autoresume about every 30 seconds, to the point on Sunday when I went for a short ride, it measured 18 mph and 39 miles where as the Strava data was 19.3mph and 43 miles ... I know the route so I know the Strava data is correct. Piece of st!
Have you looked at what the autopause speed is set to?t!
How are people not understanding how these things work?
Strava - takes its own account of stopped time and gives you an average speed accordingly.
Garmin - if you have autopause on is set to stop recording at 3mph or less, obviously GPS being what it is still thinks you're moving when you may just be waiting at lights, i.e. strava may be taking the average in a different way.
How do you avoid issues - turn autopause on your garmin off, stop worrying about the average speed, it means nothing outside of an event, accept that when you see the final screen on the garmin that when you upload to strava it will do its own stopped period calculation and probably bump the avg by a small amount, its never going to be lower than a 'real' average which is so obviously distance over time.
I just cannot see why people care in the slightest about such trivial matters.
Strava - takes its own account of stopped time and gives you an average speed accordingly.
Garmin - if you have autopause on is set to stop recording at 3mph or less, obviously GPS being what it is still thinks you're moving when you may just be waiting at lights, i.e. strava may be taking the average in a different way.
How do you avoid issues - turn autopause on your garmin off, stop worrying about the average speed, it means nothing outside of an event, accept that when you see the final screen on the garmin that when you upload to strava it will do its own stopped period calculation and probably bump the avg by a small amount, its never going to be lower than a 'real' average which is so obviously distance over time.
I just cannot see why people care in the slightest about such trivial matters.
okgo said:
How are people not understanding how these things work?
Strava - takes its own account of stopped time and gives you an average speed accordingly.
Garmin - if you have autopause on is set to stop recording at 3mph or less, obviously GPS being what it is still thinks you're moving when you may just be waiting at lights, i.e. strava may be taking the average in a different way.
How do you avoid issues - turn autopause on your garmin off, stop worrying about the average speed, it means nothing outside of an event, accept that when you see the final screen on the garmin that when you upload to strava it will do its own stopped period calculation and probably bump the avg by a small amount, its never going to be lower than a 'real' average which is so obviously distance over time.
I just cannot see why people care in the slightest about such trivial matters.
I also worked this out a long while ago and now totally ignore my overall averages only looking at specific segments, efforts and overall feel - I find that I enjoy my rides more since and target efforts more effectively! Strava - takes its own account of stopped time and gives you an average speed accordingly.
Garmin - if you have autopause on is set to stop recording at 3mph or less, obviously GPS being what it is still thinks you're moving when you may just be waiting at lights, i.e. strava may be taking the average in a different way.
How do you avoid issues - turn autopause on your garmin off, stop worrying about the average speed, it means nothing outside of an event, accept that when you see the final screen on the garmin that when you upload to strava it will do its own stopped period calculation and probably bump the avg by a small amount, its never going to be lower than a 'real' average which is so obviously distance over time.
I just cannot see why people care in the slightest about such trivial matters.
okgo said:
How are people not understanding how these things work?
Strava - takes its own account of stopped time and gives you an average speed accordingly.
Garmin - if you have autopause on is set to stop recording at 3mph or less, obviously GPS being what it is still thinks you're moving when you may just be waiting at lights, i.e. strava may be taking the average in a different way.
How do you avoid issues - turn autopause on your garmin off, stop worrying about the average speed, it means nothing outside of an event, accept that when you see the final screen on the garmin that when you upload to strava it will do its own stopped period calculation and probably bump the avg by a small amount, its never going to be lower than a 'real' average which is so obviously distance over time.
I just cannot see why people care in the slightest about such trivial matters.
I find an upload to Strava from my Edge 200 will always underestimate, but usually only by .1 of a MPH of average speed as shown on the Garmin, so have never had an issue. My elevation is always halved, but I live with it.Strava - takes its own account of stopped time and gives you an average speed accordingly.
Garmin - if you have autopause on is set to stop recording at 3mph or less, obviously GPS being what it is still thinks you're moving when you may just be waiting at lights, i.e. strava may be taking the average in a different way.
How do you avoid issues - turn autopause on your garmin off, stop worrying about the average speed, it means nothing outside of an event, accept that when you see the final screen on the garmin that when you upload to strava it will do its own stopped period calculation and probably bump the avg by a small amount, its never going to be lower than a 'real' average which is so obviously distance over time.
I just cannot see why people care in the slightest about such trivial matters.
As for your comment as to why people care - come on, you know it's important. We can't all be pro's, and data is important to those who are time limited and care about they're riding. It should be encouraged, not poo poo'd. Yes the accuracy and meaning may be irrelavent when you hit a certain "scope" of ability, but, not many are there, and so nurture the interest!
Dizeee said:
As for your comment as to why people care - come on, you know it's important. We can't all be pro's, and data is important to those who are time limited and care about they're riding. It should be encouraged, not poo poo'd. Yes the accuracy and meaning may be irrelavent when you hit a certain "scope" of ability, but, not many are there, and so nurture the interest!
Absolutely people should care if they're interested regardless of ability (speaking as a fairly new cyclist of very average ability). The way I read it and feel myself is that the average speed over an entire ride is largely irrelevant because you can't account for traffic volume, light sequences etc. or random influences cause by other people around you. What is of use though is data from specific segments or efforts and my overall feel from them ride.I found early on that I was uploading a ride, checking my time/avg speed and getting demotivated and distracted from the enjoyment of riding if it wasn't where I wanted it to be. Even if that was because of stupid things like wind speed and direction or getting held up at junctions etc.
Now I tend to pay more attention to my what I'm doing during my ride, making sure that I'm riding the way I want to on that ride knowing that when I upload I can be happy that I've achieved what I wanted regardless what the overall numbers suggest?
Banana Boy said:
Absolutely people should care if they're interested regardless of ability (speaking as a fairly new cyclist of very average ability). The way I read it and feel myself is that the average speed over an entire ride is largely irrelevant because you can't account for traffic volume, light sequences etc. or random influences cause by other people around you. What is of use though is data from specific segments or efforts and my overall feel from them ride.
lolYes that is the case initially. What then happens is you need to maintain a certain "average" including these variables within it. Ignoring segments!
I commute 30+ miles into London and the target is 20mph average, usually met, sometimes exceeded, and if not met then nothing less than 19 will do. That includes all stops and being held up and everything else in between.
Dizeee said:
lol
Yes that is the case initially. What then happens is you need to maintain a certain "average" including these variables within it. Ignoring segments!
I commute 30+ miles into London and the target is 20mph average, usually met, sometimes exceeded, and if not met then nothing less than 19 will do. That includes all stops and being held up and everything else in between.
Ah ok, so you end up having to cane it to make up time if you've been held up? Interesting approach - each to their own I guess. Yes that is the case initially. What then happens is you need to maintain a certain "average" including these variables within it. Ignoring segments!
I commute 30+ miles into London and the target is 20mph average, usually met, sometimes exceeded, and if not met then nothing less than 19 will do. That includes all stops and being held up and everything else in between.
Dizeee said:
AFAIK fitbit is totally incompatible with Strava, and in terms of data as it does not use GPS, highly inaccurate too.
Yep - to clarify I'm specifically referring to the FitBit Surge - their top model. They now quote this as Starva friendly. The GPS side is there but you need to activate it each time you want to use it as it works differently to the normal functions - and its £200 (£160 in the right spots) so I don't want to jump in without seeking some user opinions.You have to laugh at their website - lots of emphasis on keeping you eyes on the road rather than your Fitbit. At 35/40 downhill I'm usually pretty focused having suffered a "tank slapper " a few months back at that speed.
As others say - look to the overall final average (I seldom need to stop) plus the results for segments I already know.
Edited by ClassicMercs on Wednesday 30th September 20:48
okgo said:
Its easier when you commute in the middle of the night like he does.
I've managed a 20mph commute a handful of times by comparison...
Anyway, I really wouldn't worry about it, nobody is looking at your commutes and admiring average speed, that applies to everyone
Rofl... you do crack me up with your flippant and totally inaccurate commentary on my rides!I've managed a 20mph commute a handful of times by comparison...
Anyway, I really wouldn't worry about it, nobody is looking at your commutes and admiring average speed, that applies to everyone
My last night commute was in 2013 and I certainly don't think anybody could care less about my riding.
Dizeee said:
Rofl... you do crack me up with your flippant and totally inaccurate commentary on my rides!
My last night commute was in 2013 and I certainly don't think anybody could care less about my riding.
I don't follow you, but you posted up some pathetic KOM the other day that you had done at near midnight. My last night commute was in 2013 and I certainly don't think anybody could care less about my riding.
As said above, I can count the amount of times I've done real 20mph avg into work or home even on one hand, and that would have taken a tailwind of some proportion, but of course I'm nowhere near your standard
get a grip https://www.strava.com/segments/4694485?filter=ove... - in to London
https://www.strava.com/segments/3550823?filter=ove... - out of London
I think that says it all really, that is not evening taking into account the slower bit for most people when out of the park, or taking into account their commute from Embankment into where they actually work - I've ridden both of those segments nearly 300 times according to Strava and I've averaged over 20mph according to strava 6 times on the way in with a common SW strong wind, and I've averaged over 20 mph on the way once, just once.
Of course you could just say that you commute at strange times of the day AND that you commute to Z3 in South London, which most people would barely class as commuting into London.
But you won't do that, obviously.
https://www.strava.com/segments/3550823?filter=ove... - out of London
I think that says it all really, that is not evening taking into account the slower bit for most people when out of the park, or taking into account their commute from Embankment into where they actually work - I've ridden both of those segments nearly 300 times according to Strava and I've averaged over 20mph according to strava 6 times on the way in with a common SW strong wind, and I've averaged over 20 mph on the way once, just once.
Of course you could just say that you commute at strange times of the day AND that you commute to Z3 in South London, which most people would barely class as commuting into London.
But you won't do that, obviously.
Oh dear!
Someone open a window, it's getting rather heated in here.
Please back it up a little, and take a deep breath before considering your next posts, both of you. So many other corners of the PH forum have descended into this sort of sniping that Pedal Powered is really the only place I'm comfortable now. Can I just have my warm and fuzzy 'virtual' comfort blanket back, please.
I've been as guilty as anyone of dragging threads down (but not in PP, I hope) in the past, but when you look back over these exchanges in time, you realise that you've been just as bad as the *ahem* member you were arguing with. So, from a position of experience, if you're not really adding that much to the topic, please either let go of the argument, or take it elsewhere. These sorts of spats are what kills threads, and this one can be quite useful at times.
Thanks!
Someone open a window, it's getting rather heated in here.
Please back it up a little, and take a deep breath before considering your next posts, both of you. So many other corners of the PH forum have descended into this sort of sniping that Pedal Powered is really the only place I'm comfortable now. Can I just have my warm and fuzzy 'virtual' comfort blanket back, please.
I've been as guilty as anyone of dragging threads down (but not in PP, I hope) in the past, but when you look back over these exchanges in time, you realise that you've been just as bad as the *ahem* member you were arguing with. So, from a position of experience, if you're not really adding that much to the topic, please either let go of the argument, or take it elsewhere. These sorts of spats are what kills threads, and this one can be quite useful at times.
Thanks!
Nothing will kill the thread, its all relevant anyway as its a Strava thread.
You cannot expect to come wading in with comments about never averaging less than 19mph without someone questioning it!
Anyway, its total fiction so we need not worry - NEXT!
I've just created a segment from near my door, to near my work, bet I've NEVER averaged 20mph into work.
You cannot expect to come wading in with comments about never averaging less than 19mph without someone questioning it!
Anyway, its total fiction so we need not worry - NEXT!
I've just created a segment from near my door, to near my work, bet I've NEVER averaged 20mph into work.
okgo said:
https://www.strava.com/segments/4694485?filter=ove... - in to London
https://www.strava.com/segments/3550823?filter=ove... - out of London
I think that says it all really, that is not evening taking into account the slower bit for most people when out of the park, or taking into account their commute from Embankment into where they actually work - I've ridden both of those segments nearly 300 times according to Strava and I've averaged over 20mph according to strava 6 times on the way in with a common SW strong wind, and I've averaged over 20 mph on the way once, just once.
Of course you could just say that you commute at strange times of the day AND that you commute to Z3 in South London, which most people would barely class as commuting into London.
But you won't do that, obviously.
I hate to be the bearer of bad news, but I don't see Dizeee's Strava name on either of those leaderboards. Time to stop now. The argument is getting pretty foggy. https://www.strava.com/segments/3550823?filter=ove... - out of London
I think that says it all really, that is not evening taking into account the slower bit for most people when out of the park, or taking into account their commute from Embankment into where they actually work - I've ridden both of those segments nearly 300 times according to Strava and I've averaged over 20mph according to strava 6 times on the way in with a common SW strong wind, and I've averaged over 20 mph on the way once, just once.
Of course you could just say that you commute at strange times of the day AND that you commute to Z3 in South London, which most people would barely class as commuting into London.
But you won't do that, obviously.
Whether a person records with autopause or not (I do) or even if they only begin recording on fast stretches after warming up inside their privacy zone is largely irrelevant. As, according to some on here, is average speed. But I like to watch my average, as beyond segments it's the only real guide I've got to whether I'm improving or just stood still. I'm slow. Almost always the slowest of the folk I 'follow' on Strava over any given segment. I also hold some pretty contemptible KOMs, which few people actually give a stuff about. I don't 'know' my heart rate zones, have hit a brick wall with regard to upping my cadence, and have no access to a power metre or turbo trainer.
I'm failing to see what point there is to either side of this to-ing and fro-ing, especially as it's well on the way to personal abuse. Just live and let live. Autopause works for some, as does posting (artificially) high averages by excluding warm-ups and cool-downs. I don't know if anyone on here is doing that, nor do I care. But it really bothers me when folk who apparently share at least two similar interests seem hell bent on kicking off a row over something as meaningless and trivial as Strava.
Reading an article in a bike mag t'other day, it was pointed out that rider 'x' had been KOM on a segment for three years. But that if rider 'y' uploaded his hillclimb winning ride to Strava, rider 'y' would easily take the KOM away. What the Strava addicts and KOM-hunters often fail to realise is that they may well be KOM on one particular website, but that there's every chance that there is someone far quicker than them riding their turf, but either not recording to GPS, or just uploading it elsewhere. Blowing out of your arse to say that you've gone quicker than your last effort, or your riding buddy's best effort? Fine. But don't go giving yourself a stroke to get a KOM, when Strava's not the authoritative list of everyone who ever
FWIW: I hold both okgo and Dizeee in high regard as cyclists, because they are far quicker than I will ever be. Reading the 'Racing Thread' on here, and seeing some of the speeds/times recorded in races by large numbers of Strava users I follow, I know enough to realise that racing on tarmac is something I'll never be successful at. I just don't have the appetite for hurting that I once did. I'll stick to mucking about at the back of XC/Enduro MTB races, with half an eye on a point or two in a series. But even then, the winning rider in a race might not have got anywhere near a Strava KOM-beating time. But who takes home the medals and the prize money?
Strava? It might shock people to find out that it's not actually real life racing.
S10GTA said:
Have you looked at what the autopause speed is set to?
No, I haven't will have take a look thanks. Although, I haven't adjusted this unless a firmware change has. After my post, I rode on Tuesday evening and the ride was exactly the same on Garmin as on Strava .... also didn't see the erratic auto pauses. Will see what it does on the ride the eveing.In other news, sort of Strava-related, My Garmin Edge 500 has been 'playing up' again.
It's the display. It seems to record OK, and regurgitates the data when prompted, but out on the road (and off it) I've noticed that when it cycles between screens, it often leaves part of the previous screen displayed when the new one opens, so I get a jumbled bunch of LCD crystals layered over each other in an unintelligible mess.
It soon sorts itself out, but this is a new 'thing' for this unit, which up until now has worked splendidly well, save for the odd occasion when it has decided not to find satellites automatically after losing reception mid ride.
Is my Garmin dying? Or is it nowt to worry about? Anyone having/had the same issues? I thought I'd ask in here, as most Garmin users seem to also upload to Strava.
It's the display. It seems to record OK, and regurgitates the data when prompted, but out on the road (and off it) I've noticed that when it cycles between screens, it often leaves part of the previous screen displayed when the new one opens, so I get a jumbled bunch of LCD crystals layered over each other in an unintelligible mess.
It soon sorts itself out, but this is a new 'thing' for this unit, which up until now has worked splendidly well, save for the odd occasion when it has decided not to find satellites automatically after losing reception mid ride.
Is my Garmin dying? Or is it nowt to worry about? Anyone having/had the same issues? I thought I'd ask in here, as most Garmin users seem to also upload to Strava.
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