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NIIKME
Original Poster
477 posts
91 months
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Hi, seen some good advice previously and like another chap in this forum I am considering going down the Giant full sus route. So I have this bike and it has served me well for 3 years.....in fact I am quite attached to it. http://www.evanscycles.com/products/specialized/st...I am considering the full sus route for a number of reasons; all my mates have them and are pressing ahead of me on the trails now (both up and down hill), we are looking at our first trip to wales soon, and frankly my ass bone can take no more. I have 2 options as I see it, bite the bullet on a £2k bike, or upgrade my frame. The issues with the latter as I see it is that the front shock will be no good because travel is only 90mm, and some of the components are getting on a bit - paticularly the rear derailleur which has taken a battering. Everything else though, brakes, headset etc is good kit no(?). So what do the experts think? Will I save much by upgrading the frame or am I better off sniffing out a deal on a Giant. I could pick up a frame on fleabay I suppose. But then a 2011 Giant Anthem has caught my eye at £1600.
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rhinochopig
16,139 posts
68 months
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First the bad news. Your mates are pressing ahead because they are fitter and technically better than you.
Personally I would keep the HT as is and get a full-sus bike as it save you the money of upgrading and still wanting one later.
Look at bikes in the 120mm-140mm travel range. Go to a trail centre and rent a few and see what you like; ride your mates too. Anything more than 140mm is overkill for UK riding unless you only ride DH.
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NIIKME
Original Poster
477 posts
91 months
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Haha, I can assure you the first statement is not true. Although I do find it curious how one of the fat blokes goes uphill faster but I put this down to the fact he just goes straight up whereas I am weaving all over the place avoiding lumps and bumps.
And I think you are probably right I could spend a load of money on bits and pieces when really I just want a whole new bike! What do we think the hardtail is worth - 400 quid ?
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rhinochopig
16,139 posts
68 months
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NIIKME said: Haha, I can assure you the first statement is not true. Although I do find it curious how one of the fat blokes goes uphill faster but I put this down to the fact he just goes straight up whereas I am weaving all over the place avoiding lumps and bumps.
And I think you are probably right I could spend a load of money on bits and pieces when really I just want a whole new bike! What do we think the hardtail is worth - 400 quid ? Keep it. Use it as a winter bike. A full-sus in winter does tend to wear bearings quite quickly. The fat bloke may not be quite as fit as you but he could well be better technically. A full-sus is not a panacea when it comes to speed up and down hills. I'll give you an example: Before my son was born I used to ride regularly with some mates, which was a bit of a trek for me but worth it for the riding. One of the lads who used to ride out with us was a young Dan Hart - he of World DH champ fame. He's come past me on his hard-tail down a rocky single track like I was stood still. Me I was on Whyte 46 with 6" of travel going as fast as I could. It's why I advocate riding a hardtail when you first start because a HT does not flatter the rider and forces you to pick the smoother lines rather than just relying on suspension travel.
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Rolls
835 posts
47 months
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In wales IME a full sus will be no quicker uphill than a hardtail - downhill, marginally, yes, but definatley not uphill - they're not that technical!
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NIIKME
Original Poster
477 posts
91 months
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hmm I think there are other reasons why a full sus is appealing, I am not that much slower and that is not the primary driver. Another reason is that my enthusiasm for being on the ragged edge is declining as I get older.. there is a level of comfort associated with the full sus.
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Fluffsri
1,153 posts
66 months
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A full sus wont make you any better/faster but itll be comfier on a long day ride. Im always at the back on the ups (too fat) but usually on the front on the downs (gravity is better for fat blokes)I ride hard tail and bouncer but I guy Ive ride with has a 29er fully rigid singlespeed and its hardwork keeping up with him on decents LOL
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996 sps
5,720 posts
86 months
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I bought a new 2011 Giant Anthem X3 1295 from Pro Pedal in Apr, last week I done a 5 mile time trial around Tal Y Bont reservoir then up through Windy Gap in South Wales done the same touted on Tuesday, I race it, I use it where my mates take there 140 mm travels, for me personally it does the job, oh to add done Cannock a few weeks ago on my hardtail and won't again my back was killing and I'm obviously now used to my Anthem.
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pablo
10,406 posts
143 months
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you almost have to go back to basics with a full sus and learn to ride it in a different way, its not a case of just jumping on it, riding in the same style as your ht and going faster...
it took me ages to learn to ride a full sus well after years on a ht and i eventually found i didnt like it as much. yes its comfier on all day rides but its not as much fun as grabbing a ht by the neck and throwing it down a hill. as others have said, your have to read th terrain a lot more and it makes for a very involving ride.
have a look at a 29er before a full sus, htere are loads of places you can hire one for the day nad give ita good thrashing.
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james239
373 posts
35 months
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Canon Nerve (am or XC depending on budget/desired travel).
All this different riding style for hard tail/full sus is balls unless your riding top level.
I'm not the fittest person but I have a Nerve AM and still climb the fastest in our pretty fast group.
If you want ful sus then just go for it. I ride full sus just because it's more comfy and you can hammer it down the trails bouncing over little jumps and generally thrashing it as fast as you dare.
Pro pedal will help you climb on modern bikes too. Never used the granny on my nerve so im taking it off and just going 10 speed.
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pablo
10,406 posts
143 months
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james239 said: Canon Nerve (am or XC depending on budget/desired travel).
All this different riding style for hard tail/full sus is balls unless your riding top level. only it isnt. when you go from ht to fs, your natural inclination is to get out of the saddle and absorb the rough descents with your body as this is what you are used to. do this on a fs however, means that the rear suspension isnt working in the manner intended, especially on xc bikes and you arent getting much of the benefits. my problem was this is how i have always ridden, to stay seated on descents, even flowing sections of singletrack seemed totally unnatural to me. eventually i got used to staying seated when i would be out of the saddle and yes, it was faster and the traction and grip were much improved, was it as much fun as getting out of the saddle, sprinting through sections and using your body to negoitate obstacles though?!?!....
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jshell
5,050 posts
75 months
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FS ain't gonna climb faster than a HT due to the bike. It's heavier and absorbs 'some' energy, so it's more to do with fitness/weight. Saying that, I bought one of these in XL: http://www.giant-bicycles.com/en-us/bikes/model/tr... on ebay for 750 us dollars and am almost complete building it. (fecking raceface crankset needs fecking spacers!) I did over-specify the forks though, WAAAY http://www.chainreactioncycles.com/Models.aspx?Mod... overspecced because of my bulk.  It needed a 20mm axle front wheel which was sourced from CRC for £109. Everything else came from my old bike, except the gear cables which were graunchy and grindy so replaced easily.
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JustNeil
523 posts
97 months
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Instead of speculating on levels of fitness vs bike suitability, why don't you ask one of your mates to swap bikes with you one ride and see what difference it makes? Then buy a FS anyway, because you want one.  At least you'll know if it'll help before you blow a couple of grand.
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BalhamBadger
962 posts
43 months
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james239 said: Pro pedal will help you climb on modern bikes too. Never used the granny on my nerve so im taking it off and just going 10 speed. Blimey! Where do you ride?!
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Fluffsri
1,153 posts
66 months
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BalhamBadger said: Blimey! Where do you ride?! Norfolk? 
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james239
373 posts
35 months
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BalhamBadger said: Blimey! Where do you ride?! South downs mainly. I've done Cwmcarn and Cannock though - never used the granny and never let a hill make me get off and push! 10 speed cassette offers such a good range of usable gears in the middle chain ring I honestly think its all you need for off road riding. I know it won't be for everyone though.
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NIIKME
Original Poster
477 posts
91 months
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Thanks for the response and debate. I have riden their bikes so know its the direction I am going. Indeed I have had a full sus before - do you remember the first stumpjumpers with top sections about a feet deep??  The main question is is it worth going the upgrade route.... and I think I have now decided it will never give me that new bike feeling so perhaps better keep saving up. The Anthem x2 looks like a good bet for my style of riding.
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james239
373 posts
35 months
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I'd say full new bike.
Sell the hard tail to get some money back or keep it for use in the winter do you don't wear parts out too quick on the full sus.
Although I love my full sus I'm after a hardtail to use as single speed when the weather isn't great/make flat rides more challenging.
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BalhamBadger
962 posts
43 months
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james239 said: South downs mainly. I've done Cwmcarn and Cannock though - never used the granny and never let a hill make me get off and push! 10 speed cassette offers such a good range of usable gears in the middle chain ring I honestly think its all you need for off road riding. I know it won't be for everyone though. That's some good going, especially that long climb at Cwmcarn! Definitely think 2x10 is the way forward, but I'd be losing the big ring, not the granny!
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james239
373 posts
35 months
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BalhamBadger said: That's some good going, especially that long climb at Cwmcarn! Definitely think 2x10 is the way forward, but I'd be losing the big ring, not the granny! To be fair I was with a slow mate so I got a couple of breaks on the way up. I agree 2x10 is the perfect XC set up. Only going 1x10 because I've started doing downhill so think a single ring will be better and I'll make it work for XC - hopefully determination not to get off and push will help me get fitter, and I can lose the left hand shifter to make way for a dropper post switch.
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