The Wattage Thread
Discussion
Its so interesting seeing the different riders in your category, and how wildly they differ, the issue he will have is that he is racing against people with a LOT more power than him, and most of the races are not going to make the most of his power/weight ratio.
Although interesting that he was only 16th in that iTeam race, I was 2nd in that and it was a flat sprint which he should have done well with with that short term power.
Although interesting that he was only 16th in that iTeam race, I was 2nd in that and it was a flat sprint which he should have done well with with that short term power.
He is a 2nd cat rider, but yes some of the longer duration figs are at the lower end.
You are looking at that wrong chart again skr, look at Coggans, his 1 min is cat 2 level on that chart. I've never done an all out minute but find 30 sec is normally a good duration to have a kick for (1000 for me the other day) as its longer than a lot of people can sustain big power. So someone like the above would have to go pretty close to the line to be in with a shot.
You are looking at that wrong chart again skr, look at Coggans, his 1 min is cat 2 level on that chart. I've never done an all out minute but find 30 sec is normally a good duration to have a kick for (1000 for me the other day) as its longer than a lot of people can sustain big power. So someone like the above would have to go pretty close to the line to be in with a shot.
Rocksteadyeddie said:
As his results evidence. He seems to have spent his year riding crits and getting nothing out of them. Are we sure he's only 64kg? I only ask as it's a bit odd for a little guy to spend his time riding crits, and if he was a lot heavier then obviously his power numbers don't look as good.
I still think that his numbers (at 64kg) make him look a decent rider with a decent kick, but his results suggest otherwise. Which perhaps goes to prove the old adage that numbers aren't everything (on the road).
Lots at Hog Hill though, which should suit a light guy with a decent 1 minute given the finish.I still think that his numbers (at 64kg) make him look a decent rider with a decent kick, but his results suggest otherwise. Which perhaps goes to prove the old adage that numbers aren't everything (on the road).
And w/kg doesn't matter a damn when there is a flat finish, power trumps weight on the flat.
It is easy to forget, you're right.
I don't often ride with the rest of the club anymore because of that very fact, one mans threshold is another mans tempo. Some 3rd cats went out last night and did the same chaingang route we do, I do it in about an hour with anything from 300-330w, the third cat guys were in the mid 200's, the gap is huge.
I don't often ride with the rest of the club anymore because of that very fact, one mans threshold is another mans tempo. Some 3rd cats went out last night and did the same chaingang route we do, I do it in about an hour with anything from 300-330w, the third cat guys were in the mid 200's, the gap is huge.
It could work, but I think they like working at their own pace (which is ultimately why they will never improve of course), I prefer either going out with someone my pace, or solo, no responsibilities then to wait for people that get dropped etc. I quite like training solo anyway, I'd train solo only if I knew more routes around Surrey I think, but as it stands when I do a long ride 4 hrs + I don't mind going out with a few choice others that know the roads better than me.
Edited by okgo on Wednesday 31st October 12:09
So me being a total tard didn't really think that having all the bolts on my Qaurq at various torque levels would make that much difference. It seems it does having torqued them allto what the suggest, I need to give it a few hard sprints to settle it and re-zero, but I think all along I've been getting low power readings as the initial ones are coming out higher.
This would make sense, because I did a 20 min test back in April on a borrowed powertap and I've never managed to replicate that wattage since, despite being a lot stronger, so I will have to do a few re-tests. However, that's all very well, but whether I've been riding the speed I have on big watts or the ones I thought, either means I'm pretty aero, or I'm not aero at all.
This would make sense, because I did a 20 min test back in April on a borrowed powertap and I've never managed to replicate that wattage since, despite being a lot stronger, so I will have to do a few re-tests. However, that's all very well, but whether I've been riding the speed I have on big watts or the ones I thought, either means I'm pretty aero, or I'm not aero at all.
Edited by okgo on Saturday 3rd November 14:41
andySC said:
Chatting to a mate last night who rides for Raleigh/GAC. We got talking about power etc as I mentioned I have got a Wattbike coming in a few days...he's a very handy Crit rider & said he can hold 380w for 20mins "when he's going really well"....not a big fella (66kg) but its interesting to hear that the pro's aren't always pushing out huge numbers.
It depends on so many things, weight usually the big one, as proved by your man above. I'd expect to be able to do around 380 for 20 mins next season especially given the truer figures as above, but no chance I'm going to lose 15kg anytime soon, and also if he's decent at crits (who is it?) I'm sure he has a good kick on him which obviously helps hugely! Chris Boardman famously had literally ZERO sprint, I think his peak was 700w or something, which is amazingly low, but obviously was packed full of slow twitch!With the pro guys their power I think is always limited somewhat by the fact that they need to be nibmle enough to climb mountains. I think in an ideal world the best TT'er would be built like a rower, just a huge bloke with stupid power etc, the cloest you get to that on the pro scene nowadays would be Cancellara I guess who is a big bloke and is only able to get away with it because he has such a stupid amount of power at his disposal.
Good luck with the wattbike!
Well, either way, 1000 watts is dogs
t, the point was he had NOTHING in the short term stakes, which shows that playing to your strengths is vital.
Probably agree with that, although it depends on the club, ours is huge, but isn't really a racing club, but there are probably 10 guys with 300w + FTP's and maybe 5 of those are 330+, but in one of the more racing focused clubs you'll find more strong guys.
Agree re your other point, as I noted to Ed, a lad we raced a few times with last year who moved through to 1st cat this season has moved to Rapha for next season, his numbers will be comparable to many 1st cats, worse in some cases.
t, the point was he had NOTHING in the short term stakes, which shows that playing to your strengths is vital.Probably agree with that, although it depends on the club, ours is huge, but isn't really a racing club, but there are probably 10 guys with 300w + FTP's and maybe 5 of those are 330+, but in one of the more racing focused clubs you'll find more strong guys.
Agree re your other point, as I noted to Ed, a lad we raced a few times with last year who moved through to 1st cat this season has moved to Rapha for next season, his numbers will be comparable to many 1st cats, worse in some cases.
I've got my FTP on WKO set to 350, as that seems about right from all the figures I have. Yes, the first ride was 4 hrs at 220w AP, the second was 7 hrs at 180 AP, obviously NP figs were higher.
However, I will need to re-test now I've made sure all the chainring bolts are torqued up as its giving higher figures, will give it a few hard sprints to settle it then re-zero and see where I'm at.
I'd love to give it a go, but I'm too old, too fat, and too skint haha! Annoyingly a lad Eddie and I rode with has just gone pro, which shows it doesn't take that much more to do it, but you do have to know the right people!
However, I will need to re-test now I've made sure all the chainring bolts are torqued up as its giving higher figures, will give it a few hard sprints to settle it then re-zero and see where I'm at.
I'd love to give it a go, but I'm too old, too fat, and too skint haha! Annoyingly a lad Eddie and I rode with has just gone pro, which shows it doesn't take that much more to do it, but you do have to know the right people!
I do zero it every ride yes, but since re torquing the bolts apparently the best way to get it stable is to do a few 5 sex efforts and keep resetting the offset.
Ultimately as long as the numbers ate consistent its not a worry. I would imagine its more accurate now than it was based on loads of factors. I would have thought my best 20 min power was these days in region of 360-380 which would work out based on data for other people I ride with. Still, it's all about the speed in a tt!!
Ultimately as long as the numbers ate consistent its not a worry. I would imagine its more accurate now than it was based on loads of factors. I would have thought my best 20 min power was these days in region of 360-380 which would work out based on data for other people I ride with. Still, it's all about the speed in a tt!!
Oh just seen on Strava, be interested to know if those were max efforts, as they're not that high really. I reckon he is low 70's KG wise?
He shouldn't have been able to ride away from a 2/3 race with those numbers! Still, good to know I'll smash him to bits in a sprint
They do look like max numbers judging from his HRM. Interesting. I will do a re-test soon and put numbers on here, but I think the numbers are going to be a fair bit higher than I was getting before, I reckon over the longer periods I will be looking at more, 20 mins should be around 370w-380w and 1 hour around 360 or so I think. I don't think the 5 min figure is going to be much different, I did 400w for 5 mins the other day and although it wasn't easy, it didn't feel 'hard' as such. If I can drop some more weight I will have a stronger proposition I think.
He shouldn't have been able to ride away from a 2/3 race with those numbers! Still, good to know I'll smash him to bits in a sprint
They do look like max numbers judging from his HRM. Interesting. I will do a re-test soon and put numbers on here, but I think the numbers are going to be a fair bit higher than I was getting before, I reckon over the longer periods I will be looking at more, 20 mins should be around 370w-380w and 1 hour around 360 or so I think. I don't think the 5 min figure is going to be much different, I did 400w for 5 mins the other day and although it wasn't easy, it didn't feel 'hard' as such. If I can drop some more weight I will have a stronger proposition I think.
Edited by okgo on Friday 23 November 12:14
fromage said:
I have heard some people struggle on harder shorter efforts on turbo power wise, may be worth looking at his road riding figures and comparing.
Not sure on his weight though.
Hoping to get a powertap sorted in the next week or two, I'm struggling to think of somewhere to do a 20min test though.
Yeh, that is true. Not sure on his weight though.
Hoping to get a powertap sorted in the next week or two, I'm struggling to think of somewhere to do a 20min test though.
Yes, its always tricky, you could do Richmond Park, I did one back in April that was ok as there wasn't much downhill - http://app.strava.com/activities/6860221
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