The Wattage Thread
Discussion
yonex said:
I read about the differences in numbers with the q's and always zero offset myself. I've got two Powertaps now and they give comparable readings, I trust the actual trend of the numbers as I can see I am faster/fitter than before I started training properly. Even with the considerable drag of my utterly s
tty diet I am doing ok. This year was supposed to be TT's but meh, I'm sort of happy just riding to a plan at the moment.
One question I do have, as you'll know, probably, is if I switch to a crank based system for the road bike and use q rings will the way the power meter functions give dramatically different numbers from the hub based systems I have been using for the last couple of years? I don't want to chuck out the data I have as it's repeatable and seems consistent for both good and bad days.
If so, I'll stay with the PT and get a race wheel built. Having said that P2M are apparently pretty good with non round rings?
My P2M with Q's still read slightly lower than a powertap I used. I think its because the P2M doesn't rely on a cadence magnet to measure cadencetty diet I am doing ok. This year was supposed to be TT's but meh, I'm sort of happy just riding to a plan at the moment. One question I do have, as you'll know, probably, is if I switch to a crank based system for the road bike and use q rings will the way the power meter functions give dramatically different numbers from the hub based systems I have been using for the last couple of years? I don't want to chuck out the data I have as it's repeatable and seems consistent for both good and bad days.
If so, I'll stay with the PT and get a race wheel built. Having said that P2M are apparently pretty good with non round rings?
Edited by yonex on Friday 20th June 14:12
So I did the Richmond Park TT on Sunday, it was my weakest wattage and HR for the three 10 mile TTs I'd done in eight days.
327w av, 331w NP. 5% lower than the previous weekend. How much quicker that would have got me I don't know. Single digit seconds I would have thought. Happy to have placed 9th in category. And (just) beat the quickest lady!
Happy with my time, and most importantly happy to have beaten the guys I was 'racing' against.
Tomorrow night I'm repeating my Wednesday TT from last week, but on a borrowed TT bike. I hoping for similar conditions and power to last time to see how much difference the positon makes. It's not fitted to me, but if the difference is significant I might not be able to resist.
327w av, 331w NP. 5% lower than the previous weekend. How much quicker that would have got me I don't know. Single digit seconds I would have thought. Happy to have placed 9th in category. And (just) beat the quickest lady!
Happy with my time, and most importantly happy to have beaten the guys I was 'racing' against.
Tomorrow night I'm repeating my Wednesday TT from last week, but on a borrowed TT bike. I hoping for similar conditions and power to last time to see how much difference the positon makes. It's not fitted to me, but if the difference is significant I might not be able to resist.
Well done.
There were some quick guys in the road category on Sunday. The winning time was extremely fast.
It is hard to get our the best power in there due to the undulation, and as I said above, using it in the right places is key, my AP and NP are over 10w apart from my ride in the TT as I hit it hard up the climbs and recovered on the downs a bit.
Don't be surprised if you find your power is less in the TT position, it hinders me too.
There were some quick guys in the road category on Sunday. The winning time was extremely fast.
It is hard to get our the best power in there due to the undulation, and as I said above, using it in the right places is key, my AP and NP are over 10w apart from my ride in the TT as I hit it hard up the climbs and recovered on the downs a bit.
Don't be surprised if you find your power is less in the TT position, it hinders me too.
okgo said:
Well done.
There were some quick guys in the road category on Sunday. The winning time was extremely fast.
It is hard to get our the best power in there due to the undulation, and as I said above, using it in the right places is key, my AP and NP are over 10w apart from my ride in the TT as I hit it hard up the climbs and recovered on the downs a bit.
Don't be surprised if you find your power is less in the TT position, it hinders me too.
Thanks for the pointers. There were some quick guys in the road category on Sunday. The winning time was extremely fast.
It is hard to get our the best power in there due to the undulation, and as I said above, using it in the right places is key, my AP and NP are over 10w apart from my ride in the TT as I hit it hard up the climbs and recovered on the downs a bit.
Don't be surprised if you find your power is less in the TT position, it hinders me too.
Great result on Sunday yourself (although I can't help but feel that's a little patronising to say).
Scary that you're hindered.
Tomorrow is flat flat flat. Cannot wait.
Thought I'd test my FTP tonight doing a 20 min test (actual power from Wahoo Kickr). This is only the second test I've done and clearly need to work on pacing. I started out at 250W which is comfortable and what I've been doing 2*20s at recently. Thought I'd start off low and increase gradually before trying to kill myself in the last 5 minutes. I had absolutely nothing left in that last minute but reckon I should have started higher and looked for a more gradual rise over the test. 20 minute average was 278W which equates to an FTP of 264 W (4.2 W/kg). My previous test back in January was FTP of 246 W using similar strategy so a ~10% increase although I think I'm probably a bit higher if I get the pacing right.
Any advice on pacing guys?
Any advice on pacing guys?
Edited by nammynake on Tuesday 24th June 21:26
Looks like a good work out, sort that FTP setting out!
I did a crit too, but its basically just sprinting out of every corner, the upshot is average similar to yours, but NP of 390! Legs hurt this morning.
Nammynake, the reason the Hunter Allen book recommends a max 5 min blow out before the 20 min test is for the reason you mention, blow the cobwebs, and a ood warm up.
I did a crit too, but its basically just sprinting out of every corner, the upshot is average similar to yours, but NP of 390! Legs hurt this morning.
Nammynake, the reason the Hunter Allen book recommends a max 5 min blow out before the 20 min test is for the reason you mention, blow the cobwebs, and a ood warm up.
Sandersports said:
its a dam good workout .... For me there is no training that even comes close to the results racing gives me . I cant get anywhere near them kinda figures when training, not even close .
I have always found that I can produce much better numbers/performanace in a race situation. okgo said:
Nammynake, the reason the Hunter Allen book recommends a max 5 min blow out before the 20 min test is for the reason you mention, blow the cobwebs, and a ood warm up.
My warm up was fine I think (got up to 250W) - it was the pacing for the 20 min test that I'm trying to improve. I think next time I'll start at 270W and hold that for longer and gradually increase over the last 10 minutes rather than holding too much back and really ramping up the power in the last 5. The last 5 minutes were OK at around 300-320 Watts but that final jump to 340/350W was very tough and I barely hung on. Fortunately the Wahoo Kickr adjusts the resistance according to cadence to always hold that power, so despite blowing out of my arse I held 350W to the very end.Not sure what test it is you're doing?
But if you want to derive FTP from your 20 min test, then its meant to be that you do a 5 min max effort before you do the 20 mins to take the edge off.
I still find the most effective way is from races too, TT's for my TT bike FTP, and crits that are not too 'sprinty' for my roadbike. I did a fairly steady state crit the other night that was 70 mins long with an NP just over 370, which is where my FTP set at the minute. I wouldn't trust my NP from last night as there are so many periods of no power and then lots of sprinting, if there were ever an NP buster combo, then my rider type and that circuit it probably it.
But if you want to derive FTP from your 20 min test, then its meant to be that you do a 5 min max effort before you do the 20 mins to take the edge off.
I still find the most effective way is from races too, TT's for my TT bike FTP, and crits that are not too 'sprinty' for my roadbike. I did a fairly steady state crit the other night that was 70 mins long with an NP just over 370, which is where my FTP set at the minute. I wouldn't trust my NP from last night as there are so many periods of no power and then lots of sprinting, if there were ever an NP buster combo, then my rider type and that circuit it probably it.
okgo said:
Not sure what test it is you're doing?
But if you want to derive FTP from your 20 min test, then its meant to be that you do a 5 min max effort before you do the 20 mins to take the edge off.
I still find the most effective way is from races too, TT's for my TT bike FTP, and crits that are not too 'sprinty' for my roadbike. I did a fairly steady state crit the other night that was 70 mins long with an NP just over 370, which is where my FTP set at the minute. I wouldn't trust my NP from last night as there are so many periods of no power and then lots of sprinting, if there were ever an NP buster combo, then my rider type and that circuit it probably it.
Average power over 20 minutes multiplied by 0.95 to proxy 60 min FTP.But if you want to derive FTP from your 20 min test, then its meant to be that you do a 5 min max effort before you do the 20 mins to take the edge off.
I still find the most effective way is from races too, TT's for my TT bike FTP, and crits that are not too 'sprinty' for my roadbike. I did a fairly steady state crit the other night that was 70 mins long with an NP just over 370, which is where my FTP set at the minute. I wouldn't trust my NP from last night as there are so many periods of no power and then lots of sprinting, if there were ever an NP buster combo, then my rider type and that circuit it probably it.
Ouch. 4th 10 mile TT in 12 days.
This time on borrowed TT bike to see what difference it made. I went about a minute quicker than last weeks road bike attempt, in similar conditions, although I dare say I'm more fatigued now.
Important stats, 321w average and 170bpm average. The lowest watts and highest HR of the 4 TTs. I feel totally fked. NP was 324w, so seemed I held a pretty consistent power throughout, although I faded a bit over the last 1.5 miles.
I thought I recognised a black and green De Rosa, so took a punt and tried to say hello, but it came out as "are, breath, you, breath, diz, breath, zee" combined with a load of dribble. So apologies if that was you Dizzee, hope I didn't shower you.
Time for a week off TT, might go back to 3rd/4th racing next week instead.
This time on borrowed TT bike to see what difference it made. I went about a minute quicker than last weeks road bike attempt, in similar conditions, although I dare say I'm more fatigued now.
Important stats, 321w average and 170bpm average. The lowest watts and highest HR of the 4 TTs. I feel totally f
ked. NP was 324w, so seemed I held a pretty consistent power throughout, although I faded a bit over the last 1.5 miles. I thought I recognised a black and green De Rosa, so took a punt and tried to say hello, but it came out as "are, breath, you, breath, diz, breath, zee" combined with a load of dribble. So apologies if that was you Dizzee, hope I didn't shower you.
Time for a week off TT, might go back to 3rd/4th racing next week instead.
Fourmotion said:
Ouch. 4th 10 mile TT in 12 days.
This time on borrowed TT bike to see what difference it made. I went about a minute quicker than last weeks road bike attempt, in similar conditions, although I dare say I'm more fatigued now.
Important stats, 321w average and 170bpm average. The lowest watts and highest HR of the 4 TTs. I feel totally fked. NP was 324w, so seemed I held a pretty consistent power throughout, although I faded a bit over the last 1.5 miles.
I thought I recognised a black and green De Rosa, so took a punt and tried to say hello, but it came out as "are, breath, you, breath, diz, breath, zee" combined with a load of dribble. So apologies if that was you Dizzee, hope I didn't shower you.
Time for a week off TT, might go back to 3rd/4th racing next week instead.
This time on borrowed TT bike to see what difference it made. I went about a minute quicker than last weeks road bike attempt, in similar conditions, although I dare say I'm more fatigued now.
Important stats, 321w average and 170bpm average. The lowest watts and highest HR of the 4 TTs. I feel totally f
ked. NP was 324w, so seemed I held a pretty consistent power throughout, although I faded a bit over the last 1.5 miles. I thought I recognised a black and green De Rosa, so took a punt and tried to say hello, but it came out as "are, breath, you, breath, diz, breath, zee" combined with a load of dribble. So apologies if that was you Dizzee, hope I didn't shower you.
Time for a week off TT, might go back to 3rd/4th racing next week instead.
Fourmotion said:
I thought I recognised a black and green De Rosa, so took a punt and tried to say hello, but it came out as "are, breath, you, breath, diz, breath, zee" combined with a load of dribble. So apologies if that was you Dizzee, hope I didn't shower you.
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